TonyN

I don't think any intelligent fan or NFL talent evaluator is "fixated" only on 40 times in the evaluation of receivers.

 

That being said, everything else being equal, a wide-out who runs a 4.40 40 yard dash is almost certainly going to be a better player than a wide-out who runs a 4.55 40 yard dash. But the shuttle run and 3 cone are also important drills to determine real, usable "football speed". Track speed does not necessarily translate into football speed. The bottom line is that 40 times are simply a piece of the puzzle.

Ok, so you want to play the peer game.

 

Here are your rankings (the first three are tops of all time):

 

Aaron Rodgers        106.0

Tony Romo              97.6

Peyton Manning       97.5

Tom Brady               95.9

Philip Rivers             95.7

Drew Brees             95.4

Ben Roethlisberger   95.9

Matt Ryan                91.1

Matt Schaub            89.9

Andrew Luck           86.6

Carson Palmer        86.3

Cam Newton           85.4

 

Now suffice it to say that Schaub has seen better days, and if you take into account that a lot of these guys are probably not going to be around in three years, who do you think is going to be near the top of the league? Then, again for shits and giggles, just think of the weapons that some of these QBs have had over the years and compare them to what Cam has had.  You got to be kidding me, dude.

His passer rating is not that far off from Andrew Luck, the purported gold standard of the young QBs.

 

Like I said, give Cam better conditions, or at least those equal to some of his peers before you throw him under the bus.  What you're trying to insinuate about him just being not that good is totally false, and that's before you take his running into account.

 

Don't forget about Wilson's 98.6

or Foles 94.2

or Kaepernick's 90.6

or Griffin's 90.6

or Bridgewater's 85.2

or Austin Davis' 85.1

 

all QB's with less experience than Newton and better/equal passing numbers. As far as Newton is concerned, I maintain what I have been saying about him for the last 2 1/2 seasons. He is a mediocre passer with good mobility. I stand by that assessment. I realize 3 1000 yard receivers and a top 10 rushing attack are not good enough weapons for Cam to put up big numbers---that's what the Panthers had in 2013...Cam just needed MORE "weapons" in order to finish above 16th in NFL passer rating...

Kid brought a cap gun to the fight, but he didn't realize that I had a 12 gauge.

 

Sorry, dude. I have been waiting 30 minutes for you to pull my cap gun out of your ass. I guess it must be stuck somewhere up there. Later.

Since you seem stifled, read this brief article. There are many more like it. http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/page/hotread141217/nfl-statistics-quarterbacks-devalued-era-favoring-offenses

 

Did you know that of the top 50 completion percentage seasons of all -time, fully 37 of them have come in the 2000's?

 

Golly, I had no idea Chad Pennington was better than Joe Namath !!!

I am fully aware that our defense played great football for the last four games. That's not even debatable.

But, did he improve or not? For shits and giggles, since you're so into numbers and extrapolation, how did our receiving corps do during that four game stretch, and extrapolate that through a full season.

And were you a Jake Delhomme fan by chance? Were you able to watch Elway, Marino, or Favre? Did you see Flacco and Eli Manning win the Super Bowl? You ever heard of Staubach, Unitas or Jurgensen? Well, that 87.4 percent passer rating in those last four games was higher than the career passer rating for all of them.

And the passer rating, besides winning of course, is arguably the most important stat of them all.

 

I am fully aware of the changes in the NFL game which have essentially made statistical comparisons of quarterbacks who played even 6 or 7 years ago completely irrelevant to those of today's players. Ironically those same stats are what Camophiles hide behind in order to "prove" Newton's worth relative to the all time greats.. 

 

When Roger Staubach retired in 1979, his career passer rating of 83.4 was the best of all time. 

 

An 83.4 last season would have placed Staubach between Andy Dalton and Cam Newton at 27th in the NFL.

 

Here is the reality: the statistics of today's players can only be accurately gauged by comparisons with their contemporaries. Newton's numbers of 2011 mean nothing in comparison with Marino's numbers from 1983 or even Manning's numbers from 1998. Get out a little. Look at Newton's numbers in comparison with Dalton. With Wilson. With Kaepernick. With Tannehill. With Luck. It's early yet, but look at Bridgewater...

 

A strange thing starts to emerge: Cam Newton's career numbers are not that good. In fact, they are pedestrian in comparison with those of his contemporaries. Statistically, Cam Newton is a slightly less accurate Andy Dalton with better mobility.

I guess that you, and others I might add, just think that it's a coincidence that as Cam's protection got better, he got better last year.

 

Are you sure you want to go there?

 

Over his last 4 starts in 2014, while playing against the 14th, 31st, 23rd and 32nd best defenses in the NFL,

 

Newton completed 58.3% of his passes for 183 yards per game and a 87.4 passer rating while suffering only 6 sacks.

 

Extrapolated to a full season, that would put him at 29th in completion percentage, 20th in passer rating, and 32nd in yards per game. 

 

Meanwhile, over the last 4 games of the season, the Carolina defense gave up an average of 10.75 points per game.

 

Extrapolated to a full season, that would be number one in the NFL by a wide margin.

 

Any questions as to what unit was responsible for the late season surge???

Miami offense vs. Carolina offense, a breakdown:

 

Pass Blocking

QB Sacks + hits

Mia 144

Car 109

Significant edge, Panthers

 

Run production from non-QB's:

Mia 343 for 1561  4.6 avg

Car 370 for 1497  4.0 avg

Slight edge Mia

 

# 1 Wide out: 

Mia Wallace: 67 catches 862 yards 12.9 avg (traded by Dolphins for a 5th round draft pick)

Car Benjamin 73 catches 1008 yards 13.8 avg (would you trade Benjamin for a 5th? Me neither.)

Big edge, Carolina

 

Tight End

Mia Clay + Hartline combined: 98 catches for 1079 yards 11.0 avg

Car Olsen by himself: 84 catches 1008 yards 12.0 avg

Huge edge, Carolina

 

#2 Wide out

Mia Landry 84 catches for 758 yards, 9.0 avg

Car Cotchery 48 cathchesfor 580 yards, 12.1 avg

Edge, Miami

 

Quarterback: 

 

Tannehill 66.4% completions (5th NFL) 27 TD's, 12 Int, 253 ypg 92.8 NFL passer rating (14th NFL).

Newton 58.5% completions (28th NFL) 18 TD's, 12 Int, 223 ypg  82.1 NFL passer rating (26th NFL). 

 

Now lets add their rushing stats for a total offense comparison:

 

Tannehill, 272 yards per game

Newton, 261 yards per game

 

But here's the real point:

No one believes Tannehill is the second coming of god or an elite QB. Most Miami fans are still on the fence as far as Tannehill goes. Maybe he is the answer, maybe not.

 

Meanwhile, if in Carolina you happen to suggest Newton is exactly what his statistics say he is ( a mid-level QB), then you MUST be a racist with an agenda.

 

Incidentally, Career NFL passer rating, Newton 85.4

                                                              Tannehill 84.0

Can anyone name any weapon on the Dolphins team? Ryan F'ing Tannehill, passed for more yds, higher completion %, threw for more TDs and had a higher rate than Cam with a far worse oline. But yeah, it's weapons.

 

The interesting thing is to look at Tannehill's numbers last season with a terrible roster...

 

and compare them, not with Newton's horrible numbers last season, but with Newton's "magic" rookie season when he played with an absolutely loaded offensive roster (Smith, Lafell, Olsen, Shockey and two running backs who averaged 5.4 yards a carry)...

 

Tannehill was better. And if you look around at what the talking heads are saying, almost every unbiased observer is saying that Tannehill is better. Now.

And nowhere in that mass of utter garbage letters assembled above can you find the letter combination S-H-U-L-A.

 

Huh... I'll be danged.

 

You have to blame Chud for two of those seasons, Tigger.

In 2013 we had 3 receivers who went for 1000 yards last year:

 

Smith as the true number 1 for a very good Ravens team, LaFell as a hybrid 1/2 for the Super Bowl champion Patriots and Pro Bowl caliber tight end Greg Olsen. Throw speedster Ted Ginn into that mix and we had a damn good receiving corps in 2013.(Yes, yes, I know: Lafell was not good enough to make any NFL roster outside of Carolina, period, much less as a number 2 wideout. But I am sure JO JO would let some of you guys kiss his Super Bowl ring if you asked nicely).

 

That 2013 team also had a productive DeAngelo Williams, Pro Bowl fullback Mike Tolbert and an offensive line ranked in the top 10 in virtually every metric imaginable. We finished 28th in passing offense and Cam Newton finished 15th in NFL passer rating.

 

Behind Andy Dalton.

Behind Alex Smith.

Behind Jay Cutler.

Behind Sam Bradford.

Behind Colin Kaepernick.

Behind Josh McCown.

Behind Nick Foles. 

 

Those numbers had nothing to do with the Panthers' limited passing attempts...indeed, as a general rule, the fewer the attempts, the better a players' passer rating tends to be.

 

The result of his first three seasons was that Cam Newton went into last season ranked as the 16th best QB in the league by NFL GM's and scouts. Why?

 

Here are Cam Newton's finishes in NFL passer rating for his career: 

 

2011: 15th

2012: 15th

2013: 16th

2014: 26th

 

Yes, Newton can run, but the threat of the run should actually make him a MORE productive passer, not a less productive passer (see Kaepernick and Wilson for examples).

 

This is a big season for Cam Newton. It is the reason he does not have a contract. He is not a "kid" anymore. He has started 65 NFL football games-4 complete seasons and has yet to put up a passer rating above 90, while being one of the least accurate passers in the NFL over that stretch. Carolina's pass protection last season was not nearly as poor as many try to make it out to be, but this has already been shown statistically. The bottom line is that Cam Newton's surrounding talent last season was better than several younger quarterbacks who out played him. 

All 24 of those teams made the playoffs...

 

14 played in their respective conference championship games...

 

7 made it to the Super Bowl...

 

5 won the Super Bowl

 

Last year your Carolina Panthers gave up 15.1 ppg.

 

Can Chico work his magic with a revamped secondary ???

 

If the Panthers are as good defensively as they were last year, you'll need to make playoff reservations...

 

And the Panthers have a punchers chance at a deep playoff run...

His point was the Panthers are not utilizing Cam as they should...not the most insightful analysis as its obvious to anyone, but im glad he said it on air...

 

 

Actually, Harrison said:  " It is time for the Carolina Panthers to switch quarterbacks".

 

That was the quote.

Newton is a disaster under pressure...he had at least 5 seconds to throw the ball,,,baloney

Another great GIF opportunity...right into the officials back

The players lost this game.

Hey, nuthuggers, post a GIF of that one

One enormous factor in that comparison. Denver has a real offensive line.

 

 

No, No. the Broncos have Peyton Manning. That is the difference. 20 TD's and 0 INT's through 4 1/2 games

FG is OK here...no turnover

Cam is lucky that wasn't number 3...bad throw

we are going to win this freaking game

Defense will bail us out again...

We are going to answer the bell and take this game.

 

Some tough luck, some mistakes...

 

This team is good enough to overcome them and win on the road

KEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEk

We are going to win this game.

They dropped a early TD pass?

They dropped a converted 4th down? in the red zone

Blind Rivera hate. We are losing bc out players

 

Dude, I like Rivera.

 

It is called sarcasm...sorry, I though it was SOOOO obvious.