Devil Doc

7 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Why do you think the majority of people are getting tested? It's not just for shots and giggles. These people are largely developing symptoms and seeking testing. The symptoms are new because they're newly sick - a.k.a. new cases. The dip in cases is directly correlated to fewer tests, it's not due to a smaller percentage of positive tests just like the increased number of tests months ago wasn't the primary cause of the rise of the number of cases since rates of positive tests also increased.

People are getting tested, regardless of symptoms. Is this not what I just said "The dip in cases is directly correlated to fewer tests, it's not due to a smaller percentage of positive tests". Yes, We are finding less positive cases, because of less test. People are already positive, and there is possibly millions that are positive that we have not found yet. Instead of being focused on positive cases, which do not mean anything, we need to be focused on deaths. The same amount of people are going to the virus regardless of testing, we just have to find them. 

It would be great to test everyone, to isolate those who are positive, which would have course make the positive cases go up. At this very late point in the game, since testing is very disarray and sporadic, keeping track of deaths, and not positive cases, should be the focus. The slinky effect of this Virus still has 3 flights of stairs to go. 

7 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

You can't be this dumb.

Ya, I got nothing. If you think that is dumb, that is on you. People are going to get the virus, there is no stopping it. It is just when they will get it, and when we will find it. Will we have a vaccine before everyone get the Virus? Who knows. Will the virus circle back around to the states who have opened back up? Who knows. The problem is, people have this Virus, they can have it for awhile and not be tested. Hell, I could have the Virus, and be spreading it around, who knows. Is me having the Virus going to change anything? The people I have been around have already been exposed, I will not be exposing more, due to social distancing, wearing a mask, hand washing, not visiting new stores, etc. 

35 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

If you understand data the answer is right there in the link. 

Ok, I wanted your opinion. Looking at the data, what I assumed is true. We are just finding cases with testing, they are not exactly "New" cases. 

3 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Remember when the increase in new cases was being blamed on more testing? Well, the data refuted that claim but here recently, the opposite has been true. The dip in new cases seems to be directly correlated to less testing.

https://mobile.twitter.com/COVID19Tracking/status/1291140412711690240/photo/1

So, does this mean that increased testing did equal increase in cases? I am under the assumption that we already have people who have the Virus, we are just finding more, it is not really new cases. 

57 minutes ago, Jeremy Igo said:

Cool, can you call Mecklenburg county and tell them it's that easy? Thanks 

I would say maybe travel to another county, to get tested, maybe it is not as bad? I dunno? I have seen it take average 2-5 Days, worse is 10. 

27 minutes ago, Jeremy Igo said:

My daughter woke up with a fever, body aches, sore throat. Turns out she came in contact with a friend of hers last week that had been sick. however, her parents never told us, had just said she was "grounded". 

So I call today and the soonest we can get her tested is on Thursday. Then it will be 6 days for the results to come back. 

In other words, there is no useful testing available to us. Having results 10 days after showing symptoms isn't real helpful. 

 

This is the best we can do as a country?

Yep, that is the way it is around most of the country. Unless, you are rich and have faster ways to test. The Government and multiple municipalities are working hard everyday to make it faster, hang in there. 

On 8/1/2020 at 3:15 PM, stirs said:

 

I am now Two for Two.. I replaced all of my House Filters with ones that kill viruses ( Study showed that Virus spreads through A/C). I also since March have lost 35 pounds, bringing me to an BMI of 31.6 from 36.6. Science is awesome. 

2 hours ago, The NFL Shield At Midfield said:

For reference Miami-Dade county has about 2.7 million people and reported almost 3000 new cases yesterday.  Using a city as dense as Hong Kong and saying that it's proof that masks don't help because they recorded a "spike" of 145 cases makes the exact opposite point you think it does.

According to Wikipedia:

100,000 people per square kilometer and you're busting a nut and throwing a parade for your big brain over 145 new cases in a day.

It's also entirely possible that they're experiencing their second wave now, which is something that everyone said was going to happen anyway.  We're still rolling along in wave 1 here.

We are definitely not in our first wave, that past April 20th. What we are experiencing now is catch up, The North got it first, now it is the Souths Turn. 

13 hours ago, 45catfan said:

Yeah, this has been assumed for a while.  No secret family pass it to one another in the home.  Now they are talking about changing out the air filter more frequently and upgrade to the higher grade filters.

Ive been changing my filters and buying the ones that filter out Viruses and Bacteria.. thinking of which. I need to buy new filters.. lol. Thanks for the reminder. 

13 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

being outside is not the problem, it's what happens afterwards. large beach gatherings tend to end in people going to large, air conditioned indoor gatherings where the virus is shown to spread the most. protests generally end in people going home, and studies have shown they don't really increase the transmission rate. 

you have such an obtuse and un nuanced view of this it's really difficult to converse with you. 

im really having trouble believing you're in a master's program for anything. 

 

Other side of the coin.

Lets say that "Protesting/Gatherings" that is not on the beach,  as you said, created little transmissions. Now, with that information, if someone wants to have a gathering, they will just call it a protest. Do you not see what was created when there is double standards like that? 

6 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

being outside is not the problem, it's what happens afterwards. large beach gatherings tend to end in people going to large, air conditioned indoor gatherings where the virus is shown to spread the most. protests generally end in people going home, and studies have shown they don't really increase the transmission rate. 

you have such an obtuse and un nuanced view of this it's really difficult to converse with you. 

im really having trouble believing you're in a master's program for anything. 

 

Studies show it does not increase transmissions rate.. that is what I have a problem with. You cannot in your mind tell me that poo isn't fabricated. When they specifically tell you that outdoor gatherings and protest are different. If you want to believe that there is not extra curricular activities after a protest or massive gatherings, then that is on you.  You are going to tell me that the only reason there is not transmission is because what they do afterwards? C'mon man. I just find it convenient that they will do this study to justify a gathering

2 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

it's a facile point. 

"prove to me the political affiliation of every person" is sea lioning. do you honestly think these were BLM in fuging ft lauderdale during spring break? Like is that really an argument I'm supposed to entertain?

i was responding specifically to the dangers of having beaches open. you're conflating your stupid concern trolling with a different argument about spreads between protests and beach going

You cannot differentiate between the two. That is the point. If you are going to close down beaches, then close down any other gatherings of similar or congregated masses. 

4 minutes ago, Wes21 said:

The idea of running the entire show from Washington is silly.  People actually expect federal agents to know that ABC hospital in Anytown, USA is running low on masks?  No.  And that's where the chain of command works.  The people at the hospital follow their protocol for it, then they kick it up the food chain.  If its a big enough deal, you could get city, county or even state agencies involved in the situation.  Either way ALOT has to happen before it goes to the feds, and ALOT of people need to be doing their part.  I swear I've seen people who genuinely think the feds are supposed to be sending out agents to do inventory on every hospital in America, and if the feds don't show up the people that work there or in the lower forms of government can just cross their arms and say "not my problem."

I am in school for a Masters in Emergency and Disaster Management.. this exact topic is drilled into the doctrine. The Feds are not hear to bail you out everytime, they are here to assist and provide an extra layer, they are NOT in charge. The more the states and local government rely on the Federal Government, it creates higher budgets, thinning of personnel, and too much bureaucracy. You State and Local Government is responsible for your mitigation, recovery and response, with guidance from the Federal Government. 

2 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

thats oversimplification

protestors are likely not going out to cramped bars afterwards. Congregating in giant pool parties or at the beach is generally going to lead to meeting up in bars and restaurants and shops afterwards; i don't think that's a controversial statement.

closing beaches was a way to decrease foot traffic to transmission sites and maintain some semblance of political cover. 

i mean its been proven how bad the beach parties were. this was the spread of one spring break in ft lauderdale

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/11/us/florida-spring-break-coronavirus.html

Is there proof that these Beach Goers, are not the same as protesters, or not the same as other gatherings? Were these beach goers a certain political party or certain political agendas? This is the point I am trying to make. 

5 minutes ago, GOAT said:

big facts.

that massive party that went viral in charlotte the other day looked like a petey pablo concert in 2005.

I'm sure the amount of MAGA hat wearing individuals was staggering lmao...

This is just a slight example. The issue is, when you start pointing fingers at certain political parties or people who are in a certain political party, but do not point fingers at the other side... it does not help anything. 

7 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

They're equal in that they're gathering of large numbers of people when medical professionals are saying that is the #1 thing we need to be avoiding. I'm completely removing the sociopolitical motivations from the equations because the virus does too. Do you really think the pool party goers aren't going to look at the media praising the protests and say "Well, if they can gather together so can we!" Nothing happens in a vacuum. I understand the motivation of the protesters but it still doesn't make gathering in huge crowds during a pandemic a good idea.

Which was exactly my point of shamming people.. Your going to Shame one, but not the other? That does not help the situation. When the News channels do this ( Which there is proof they did) all it created was a attitude of discontent. 

2 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I can't say the same. It has been a VERY politically motivated decision in my observation.  I don't think anyone is cheering mask wearing. Yeah, it sucks. But honestly, it's a relatively minor inconvenience. Certainly less inconveniencing than a widespread pandemic.

I can see where you are coming from.. in your circle of observation it is politically motivated. I have seen it from both sides honestly. One example, is a twitter video of a local club... no one was wearing a mask, and no one was social distancing. Why we  do not know the political origins of the patrons of this club, however, to think they are all the same political party is also projection. 

2 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Outdoors transmission has been shown to be pretty low. It was just very ironic to see that situation unfold just days apart. The right has by far played the bigger role in politicization, but that was a clear case of politicization from the left. 

Was the Pool party in the Ozarks, not outside either? That is the other thing that creates confusion. You want to shut down beaches, and outdoor activities... but yet protest, or other cause gatherings are ok? Certain things are shut down, but similar things are not? 

5 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I definitely agree with the stance that pandemic deniers are absolutely the biggest culprit in our current situation. Goal post movers who choose whether or not certain behaviors are acceptable based on sociopolitical factors are a (very) distant second.

I agree with this too.. but Pandemic Deniers are not just MAGA's Anit-Maskers are just not MAGA's. This is another thing the news is doing, it is trying to implant the behaviors and ideas of people into categories. I know plenty of people who hate Trump, and are Democrats.. who hate wearing the mask, and/or do not wear the mask.. just as much as I do Republicans. 

1 minute ago, electro's horse said:

what other factors would you like them to mention?

Density and economic factors are mentioned all the time. This is why it happened primarily first in large cities like LA and NYC, and primarily effected lower income people. This is why when they were forced back to work the people in lower socioeconomic brackets were disproportionately effected. This has been a drum they've banged the entire time. 

What are you watching that you're not seeing them criticize state and local government? Like I don't give a poo about ohio for example but I can tell you exactly what Mike Dewine was doing and how badly he changed course and how poor the effects have been. 

How can you honestly look at what's going on and decide "well this is a states rights issue?" If the states can't close their borders it is by definition a federal issue. It doesn't matter what cooper does in NC when every asshole from charlotte drives down to charleston to go to applebees and get a covid cocktail. you are completely delusional. 

and encouraging people to wear masks and social distance isn't working. and the government at the federal level are clearly not doing anything. if you feel bad being shamed for not wearing a mask, or if some karen has her fee fees hurt, tough poo. this is a pandemic. your idiocy directly effects me and my family. I don't give a hot gay fug if you feel persecuted for acting like a dumbass. you are one. 

the job of the news isn't to make you feel good. if you turn on the tv and feel like an asshole for what you're not doing, you probably are one. 

No, it is not a Federal Issue. It has been left up to the states. You are acting like the Government can just overstep, they can't. What can the Government do? Martial Law? That is about it. If there is a law created, it will take months to be enacted and voted on, just like States. Who cares if encouraging wearing a mask or social distancing isn't working, you think forcing laws or shamming people is going to do any better? You think the news telling people to fear the Virus is doing them any good? Cooper made things worse by doing a mask mandate.. instead of going through the proper channels and creating a law. All the Government can do, which they are, is provide support for testing and supplies. All the Government can do is run ads on TV about social distancing and mask wearing.. which they are. I think you overestimate the Federal Government capabilities, and what there role is. 

3 minutes ago, 4Corners said:

MAGAts are the main culprit that’s for sure 

Wrong Again.. you have no proof of this. 

9 minutes ago, kass said:

 

Yes, let the people decide how serious the virus is.

 

 

This is exactly my point. You are forgetting to show the other side. You think it is just MAGA-Warriors that are making bad decisions of not wearing a mask or social distancing? This shows me you listen to biased news. 

1 minute ago, electro's horse said:

it is not possible to report on covid19 without mentioning the government response and how completely inadequate it is

the traditional role of the fourth estate is not just to inform but the educate. the average person (you included) does not have the necessary education to assimilate the data and understand it because virology and epidemiology is not something 99% of people know anything about. it is perfectly acceptable that CNN has sanjay gupta on to synthesize the information. 

it's almost like you're advocating that someone turns on CNN, finds like a blank screen showing average viral loads per exposure or whatever, then cracking open some medical school text books to figure out what that means. you're completely out of your mind. 

the executive has to be acting here as we see because states can't/won't handle this, and individuals (despite what you're telling yoursel) cannot protect themselves and their families just through their rugged individualism. This is of course proven by the home being the number one site of transmission. 

the lack of action by the executive is news. and it deserves constant coverage. instead of hating the news because they're reinforcing how poorly the trump administration is doing (and allowing it to reflect on you personally) maybe open yourself up to change and think about how you can improve moving forward. 

the mcallen situation is a specific example of how the news is NOT overblowing this. That's worse than anything that has made it onto the television. that's not hard to understand. 

I have no problems them reporting how bad the Trump administration is doing, what I have a problem with is them not mentioning any other factors. I have a problem with them not reporting that is based on density, economic, hospitals per capita and age. They fail to report that the the States and Local Government that chose what to do and not to do. The Federal Government has no control, nor should they, it is a State/Local issue first. If the States can't or will not do anything or protect themselves, that is on the states, not the Government. The news should not be like.. well If I was in charge, or this expert says.. no, nothing you or I could have done, it is a natural process, it is a Virus that needs to run its course. We can encourage people to social distance, wear a mask, etc.. but that is just it.. Encourage.. not Blame, Incite Fear, No Shame people.... that is not up to the News to decide.  The news should not be reinforcing anything, just reporting the news, that is the issue. They can show graphs, data and other things, and instead of doom and gloom, they can say encouraging things like or think positively and no negatively. When the news changed from giving you information and reporting, to telling you and shamming you.. it is not NEWS. 

21 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

Dude i know i have a slightly different viewpoint about covid than a lot in this thread but this is a fuging goddamn disaster and the level of scrutiny its receiving is nowhere near where it should be. Like I cannot fathom what else you would reasonably expect the news to talk about right now. Go to fox if you want breaking news about taco bell's menu sourced to a reddit poster

like CNN is maybe dumbing it down but A.) yes this is a global pandemic that is going to end up killing well over a million americans and B.) the executive is failing in such an extreme manner that historians are going to look back at this being a massive inflection point. You are literally living through history right now. 

I've not seen anything on CNN even close to how bad things actually are. 

Want me to prove it?

McAllen Texas is putting all their covid patients into a converted hospice hospital across the street. This is so they can claim their main hospital is covid free and continue to do elective surgeries. They're staffing this hospital with travel nurses and mid levels, probably so if things go real pear shaped they can just cut ties and claim they had no idea what was going on. This is the twitter thread about it. This includes pictures. 

Highlights (lowlights?) from this include

- intubated patients covered in ants

- hallways with beds on either side

- cpap/vent machines run with oxygen tanks because they don't have enough wall space to plug poo in

- employees walking off the job en masse

- hospital hiding ppe because they say the staff are using too much

- nurses literally covered in poo because the hospital won't give more than one gown per shift

Is this on CNN? Of course not. This is so much worse than anything percolating up to the 24 hours news cycle.

The thing about Taco Bell is not news either. What is reporting how bad the executive is failing has to do news wise, or how is this information going to help or inform the public? It won't. ?How is reporting death and despair going to change anything? It won't. People are tired of hearing about it, people have given up caring and have other important poo to worry about. The news talks about it, when the relevancy of the Virus is fading. The News is news, it is not opinion, is it not to bash a political figure, it is not to run all day news on how bad someone is failing, or how bad someone is. It needs to be the news. Report the data, report what you see.. and that's it. I do no know why you want to nitpick the conditions of McAllen, TX.. and not mention the other gregarious errors from other states, country and around the world. I am on the opinion that the Virus DOES NOT need the scrutiny it is getting. All it does is instill fear, panic, and chaos. This Virus does not need to be looked at under a microscope... by so called NEWS organizations. The News needs to report news, let the people decide how serious the VIRUS is.. not the media.