grimesgoat

5 hours ago, MHS831 said:

FYI

• Bradley Bozeman  6th round
• Austin Corbett 2nd round (33rd pick overall)
• Pat Elflein  3rd Round
• Taylor Moton 2nd Round (last pick in round 2)
• Brady Christensen 3rd Round
• Ickey Ikwonu  1st Round (6th overall pick)

 

Don't forget about Tremble in 3rd round too.  We should be able to run a little.

20 minutes ago, Captroop said:

First Reaction:

If it gets us into day 2 of the draft, and they take on his salary, I can't think of many people more replaceable on the roster than Robby.

 

Second Reaction:

 

Hmmmmmm...

I think a team will gladly take on his salary at around $1m.  We'd be out a player and about 8.5m, but getting competition for Darnold with a 2nd rounder may be worth it.  I believe that is what will make Anderson attractive - his low 2022 base salary.

1 minute ago, RumHam said:

I DONE CALLED IT, GREEN BAY WILL CALL TODAY, BANK ON IT

I floated it in another thread as well.  I think we are targeting a WR in round 5.  This was probably a contingency all along.

54 minutes ago, Martin said:

1 minute ago, mrcompletely11 said:

No I got it I was just piggy backing on your post on what might potentially get us there?  I totally agree with you

Looking at the numbers on Robbie Anderson - He could potentially be very valuable to someone with a second.  I think I have this right.   If we traded him, we'd have to eat an extra 8-9 million on top of the 10m that was already counting against the cap.  And we'd need to replace him with someone decent.  But the recipient would have a decent vet WR with a 2022 salary of only 1m.  

I know we all are sick of Anderson and think he sucks, but I don't believe other teams feel the same.  I think GB could possibly give us 53 for Robbie and his 2022 salary of 1m or so.

I'm sure I have some cap-stalkers out there that will correct me if I'm wrong on this.

8 minutes ago, grimesgoat said:

I can't see us trading up for Willis, Corral, Ridder or Howell.  I think all of those guys go in the top half of the 2nd and would cost too much to get up there.  NYG, ATL, SEA, DET, HOU, WAS, TB, and NO all might be eyeing QB and all have picks in the top half of the 2nd.

Strong might drop into the 4th.  A small move up using a 5th might get him, but he did not come in for a visit so I doubt he's in play.

It seems most likely that Zappe will be there when we pick at 137.  I think we grab him.

6 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Give me a scenario where we can trade into the 2nd?

I'm going to assume you mis-read my post.  I can't think of a scenario.  That's why I said I can't see us trading up.

We may be able to move up a little in the 4th for Strong if he is there.  But I think the likely bet is staying put and selecting Zappe.

I can't see us trading up for Willis, Corral, Ridder or Howell.  I think all of those guys go in the top half of the 2nd and would cost too much to get up there.  NYG, ATL, SEA, DET, HOU, WAS, TB, and NO all might be eyeing QB and all have picks in the top half of the 2nd.

Strong might drop into the 4th.  A small move up using a 5th might get him, but he did not come in for a visit so I doubt he's in play.

It seems most likely that Zappe will be there when we pick at 137.  I think we grab him.

fug yeah. Let’s go. 

Saucing up. Ready for anything. 

They need to come out of this with QB competition for Darnold, a difference maker on defense, and solid rotation/future starters at LB, TE, and G. 

This is what we'll do:

1. Trade back with Philly.  6 for 15, 51, and Minstache.

2. If Cross is still there at 15, Take him.  Otherwise trade back with Pittsburg.  15 for 20, 84, 138.  (Pitt moves up for Willis).

3. At 20 we take Devin Lloyd, LB (alternative - Kenyon Greene G or Penning T)

4. At 51 we take Cole Strange G, Rasheed Walker T, or Petit-Frere T (assuming we did not go G/T in First).  (Alternative - Muma LB or possibly Troy Anderson LB).

5. At 84 I could see Barno DE, Cross S, Kolar TE, Robinson RB, or maybe Bruss G/T. 

We would still have 137, 138, 144, 149, 200, and 243 for more projects - but I think the top 2 picks (plus stache) would see the field a lot in 2022.

1 hour ago, Shotgun said:

We should take the player that either of those teams want to trade up for. Instead we will get fleeced by a much smarter team.  

So if someone wants to trade up for a CB, we should grab him instead?

I think we really want to trade down, but if no offers are worth it, we'll stay and take an OT or Edge at 6.

I've gotta believe with the draft capital Philly has, they are a prime target.  Picks 15+51+83 is almost exactly the point value of 6.  Philly can get a difference-maker at 6 in a position of need (sauce, stingley) and we can get much needed draft capital.

I could see this going one of two ways, either we drop down and pick one of our 2 favorite QBs at 15 or they throw in Minshew instead of 83.

With a new QB in hand, we are free to get a play-making LB at 15 (Lloyd?) and OL help at 51 (or vice versa).  I think this is the best path to improve this football team.

Next year we target our long-term franchise QB.

2 hours ago, thefuzz said:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/which-nfl-head-coaches-are-on-the-hot-seat-these-eight-have-reason-to-worry/ar-AARNFWm

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/with-urban-meyer-gone-which-nfl-coaches-are-now-on-the-hottest-seat-161925604.html

 

I'm just saying...that took me 10 seconds.  He's on the hotseat, and he had taco bell for lunch.

Doesn't matter what the talking heads say.  They are out for clicks.  Only one person can actually make his seat hot.  Tepper.

8 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

Dude...he's on the hotseat...I'm not sure how that can possibly be debated, if he's not been told playoffs or fired...then Tepper is worse than I imagined.

And that saying a lot.

He's definitely on the hot seat in huddle world.  Not sure about outside the bubble.

1 hour ago, MHS831 said:

If all 3 tackles are gone, we might trade back.

I sure hope so.  Too early for a QB.

25 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

Drafting a QB and developing him over the next year or two to be your guy for the next 10.

Vs.

Needing to win this season, no matter what, or you lose your job...possibly mid season.

It was a silly question.  Winning more games results in job security.  "Desperately trying to save their jobs" has a negative supposition that he is on the hot seat, which we do not actually know.  If Tepper gave him an ultimatum, he did tell us about it, and is not consistent with a 7-year contract.

When he was hired, he said it would take 5 years to establish the culture/program, but would lead to long-term success (like Pittsburg, New England, etc.).

If he was given an ultimatum and decided to mortgage the future, he could have sent multiple firsts for Russell Wilson, or sent our first rounder to Atlanta for Matt Ryan.  All are clear upgrades to what we have, but would have been short-term temporary solutions at best.  Point is, he's really not acting that desperate.

He's had plenty of time to offer 3 firsts for Kyler Murray if he's "just trying to save his job".

Just to be clear, I'm not a Rhule fan and believe we can do better.  I'd love a new coach after next year.  But he's not acting desperate.  I'm seeing modest overall roster improvement each year.  Whether it results in more wins is still unknown.  We'll see. 

25 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

It's not gonna happen. These guys are desperately trying to save their jobs and they know damn well that Sam Darnold ain't gonna do it.

What's the difference between "desperately trying to save their jobs" and "trying to win NFL games"?

Asking for a friend.

51 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

I think it would be cool if we focused on the QB musical chairs game that has left Baker Mayfield standing in silence, and has left the Panthers with an empty chair.

Of course we don't know what is happening behind the scenes, but I thought it was interesting that Fitterer would say, "in on every deal" and that the Panthers will "Keep swinging until they get a QB."  It has simply been too quiet on the Baker Mayfield front and I think there is a potential analytical discussion here that   we must discuss WITHOUT forcing our preferences and external variables into this very simple situation.  Based on what I am hearing on TV while working, the Panthers (NFL Network) are the real focus of the draft.  They are saying that #6 is where the drama begins.  I agree--and it is really more intriguing with Baker Mayfield waiting to sit in our empty QB chair.   For these purposes, let's pretend that they have eliminated all variables and the decision comes down to Mayfield/draft a T or draft a QB at #6.

Correct my logic if you find it faulty: 

Baker Mayfield seems to have 1 potential suitor at the moment:  The Carolina Panthers.  Love him or hate him, that is not what this thread is about--so stay focused, y'all.  The Panthers have a few options, thanks to the situation with Baker.  There is no need to draft a QB desperately at #6 and bypass on that LT.  Here are a few of the Panthers' options:

1. They could wait and see who is left at #6 and draft (or trade back).  As soon as they make the pick, they could call Cleveland and make a deal for Baker if the pick was not a QB , but to me, that is showing your cards and might increase the price Cleveland will take--right now, we know they want to move him desperately, but that advantage changes when they know we don't have a pick until 137 and we passed on the QB pick at #6.  They know we need a QB desperately.

2.  If we take a QB at #6, we could sign Baker for a year to groom the new kid, but Baker is not going to play that--he'd become a distraction.  If we take a QB at #6, Baker is pretty much off the table.  We start Brady Christensen at LT.  Sam probably starts the season and Rhule starts interviewing at various colleges.

3.  If we decide to keep Cleveland on hold during the draft and then trade back to recoup some picks, every time a QB is selected, Baker's asking price increases. 

That is why I think the Panthers are negotiating for Baker, using the start of the draft as leverage.  This takes me to option 4 of 327:

4.  To me, the obvious play here is to decide right now if you are willing to give Baker a season in Carolina.  If you are, you can likely draft the LT you have wanted and you get an NFL starting QB on a one-year rental.  If he plays well, he will want a $40m per contract, and that is phase II of the Baker decision.  This system could favor his playing style.  If he doesn't play well, we draft his replacement in 2023 and start a rookie. 

Personally, I think there will be a trade made just before the draft--a week from now. Here is why:

• Baker's salary for 1 year (once Cleveland eats some of it) would not be much more than the #6 pick overall.
• Baker is better than any QB in the draft right now.  Rhule and maybe Fitterer are playing for NOW.
• Baker's contract gives Scott F. an out.  We can still draft a QB.
• Imagine the OTs are gone at #6.  If we could trade back (an edge will be there) into the first round, add a second, we could still end up with an elite OL and a QB--and we'd still have Baker for a season.

So I think the Panthers are considering Baker Mayfield and how we could get him for a sixth rounder and pay him about $9m.  There is a fear that if he is not traded before the draft, he might have to wait for an injury once the season begins.  Cleveland does not want that distraction. That would allow the Panthers to address OT, in all likelihood, and possibly land a starting QB in the process.  This is a bargain--an opportunity for the Panthers to get value in the draft and the QB they desperately need.

I know all the locker room crap and girl beating stuff--but let's assume they are rumors and the Panthers have done their homework like they did with Watson.

 

You put a lot of thought into this - thanks.

I think Cleveland is highly motivated to get him out of the building at any cost.

They have a backup already in case Watson is suspended (Brissett), so he serves no purpose and will likely be a no-show to camp if he is not traded.

Cutting him will cost 18m dead, so they will be desperate for a trade.  

The only other team that may have an interest is Pittsburgh, who is in their division.  They are sitting on about 15m in cap room and could probably make it work.

The guy is coming off surgery, a bit of a headcase, and his play has been very inconsistent.  I have no idea why we would have any interest there.

Unless Cleveland offered to pay half his salary and gave us their 3rd rounder (#78), I would consider it.  If he plays decent, maybe he becomes a comp pick for us next year.  Otherwise, its a hard pass from me. 

6 hours ago, MHS831 said:

Brady's system was a joke.  It was as if he was using the Madden 2015 playbook at times.  He lost CMC on offense and our #1 CB on defense--his offensive line was a putrid pile of crap. 

I am not sure he can do it even with CMC, Horn, and three new offensive linemen--and the new OL coach and OC.  However, he has never played in good conditions that he trusts--

We can feel confident that he will (if he gets the opportunity) be improved.  Enough?  I dunno.

In the second half of 2019, Darnold went 6-2.  He completed 61% of his throws for 243 yds/game.  He had 13 TDs, 4 picks.  And he was 22.  His "supporting" cast was Le'veon Bell (<800 yds for the year), Robbie Anderson (779/5) and Jamison Crowder (833/6).

That's the guy I want, at least for 2022. Maybe a real offense/coordinator can find that guy or even improve him.

If that guy shows up, we'll have a competitive team.  If not, we'll have a new coach next year and probably picking in the top 5.

3 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

The problem is they moved Brady all over the place. He only started his last 2 games at LT (his natural position) and looked pretty solid. The question is why didn’t we play him there sooner as Erving/Scott weren’t good at all there. 

I can't disagree.  I'll just say he was a mid-third round rookie playing one of the most difficult and important positions on the football field.  I think he got a little banged up in there at some point as well.  There was an abundance of caution, but I don't believe malice or incompetence.  In the end, he got the live experience and they got the tape to evaluate.

Having said that, I'm glad they got Campen to develop these guys, as well as signing a couple other guards that seem to know their business.  I believe christensen will flourish this year with a better cast around him.

Brown may take longer.  He may sit another year, then slide into Bozeman or Elflein's spot in 2023.

13 hours ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

Brady, and Brown should have gotten playing time last year. Especially once we were out of Play Off contention. All the kids should have. That's a coaching blunder. It sure would be nice, at this time, to know what exactly they are capable of. B

Brady Christensen started 6 games, including 4 of the last 5.  They should have a decent idea of what he is capable of and hopefully with a full off-season of professional conditioning, he will be ok.

No clue why Brown didn't get a shot.  These guys practice during the week.  Maybe he just wasn't ready, although Miller/Jordan/Scott were certainly subpar.  Hard to imagine not cracking that lineup with those guys ahead of you.

I would prefer to wait for next year address our long-term QB solution.  We'll almost surely have a new coach and it would be nice for him to have a say.

I think what will happen is we will move back 3-5 spots and select Pickett.  He will be given a chance to start at some point, but I believe he will eventually be a solid #2.

With the 2nd we pick up, we'll draft an OT (Raimann or Tyler Smith) or a DE (Mafe or Ebiketie).  The rest of our picks will be TE, G, LB/S, WR.

Huddle will implode.

9 minutes ago, jfo89 said:

Probably not but you never know. It doesn’t necessarily have to be a QB that a team is looking to trade up for either.

I think it comes down to who’s on the board, and how desperate you are to acquire additional resources.

Maybe the criteria for being blown away by an offer this year, is less than what it was last year. iirc last years depth was considered weak where as this years seems to be stronger. Although we’re picking 2 spots higher so I would expect the offers to be better.

I agree.  If Neal, Gardner, Willis, or Thibodeaux are still on the board at 6, I could definitely see someone offering a second to move up a few spots for their guy. 

I doubt anyone lower than WFT would be interested, but all of the teams picking 7-11 may have their eye on someone in particular and be willing to give up something for it so they don't get jumped.  ATL or SEA may have their eye on a particular QB.  WFT may want the best WR available.  Jets may pass on a DE at 4 but are willing to move a little to get one at 6.  All moves could net us an extra 2nd.

As long as we remain flexible and don't fall in love with one guy, we'll be ok.  We need a lot more than 1 guy.

If you have an opportunity to trade back, you have too.  

Just because some goofball on ESPN provides his ranking of players does not mean all 30 teams feel the same way.  We have no idea what the panthers board looks like.  Their favorite QB in the draft may be Howell, but they would be stupid to pick him 6th when they can probably get him later.

Seattle may want Willis and feel they need to jump Atlanta.  Give them 6 for 9 & 41.

At 9, you can get Pickett, Howell, Cross, Hamilton, J Johnson, Penning etc.  All likely starters and all most will be available at 9.

Then you have found money at 41.  If you still need LT, grab Tyler Smith or Raimann.  If you still need QB, Corrall, Howell, or Ridder could still be there.  

Don't fall in love with one guy.  Talent level between 6 and 40 may be fairly equal.  If so, I'd rather grab 2 of them instead of 1.    

10 hours ago, Carl Spackler said:

It’s so hilarious how everything I predict ends up getting flamed and then 6-12 months later, people say the same thing. 

Me, Fall 2020: Matt Rhule is the worst coach in the NFL.
Huddle, Fall 2020: Shut up idiot. Be patient. Matt has a plan. 
Huddle, Fall 2021: Matt Rhule is the worst coach in the NFL. 

Me, Fall 2021: Tepper is gonna end up moving the team to a different city. 
Huddle, Fall 2021: Shut up idiot. Be patient. Tepper would never move this team. 
Huddle, Spring 2022: Tepper is gonna end up moving the team to a different city.