KSpan

8 minutes ago, jb2288 said:

Hahahaha. Yeah buddy keep telling yourself that. Totally were a playoff team last year 

Expectations were already low for folks who weren't caught in nonsensical hype, and Bryce still underdelivered. Both things can be, and are, true.

Reasonable. 

3 hours ago, Mage said:

I literally said in my other post that we still deserve criticism, so what are you talking about?  Do you even know what my initial post was about?  Never once did I say it was okay to draft a bust because other teams draft busts.

Mods, feel free to put me in my place if I'm going too far.  But it needs to be said.

Some of you need to start reading posts in full instead of making it ALL about Bryce every single damn time.  Ultimately my point was that drafting QBs is hard, and if it wasn't the Panthers mistake, it would have been another teams.  Just like Trey Lance, just like Mac Jones, just like Blake Bortles, just like Blaine Gabbert,... I can go on and on.  

Yes, Panthers screwed up (assuming Bryce doesn't improve).  Yes, we should be criticized.  But it happens.  The guy asked how it happens and I was just answering his question.  That teams miss on QBs every year, because getting a QB is hard and teams will take every opportunity they can to get one. 

But I'm not about to sit and discuss this with someone who thinks Levis even had .001% chance of going ahead of Bryce.  That tells me all I need to know.  No reasonable person would even throw him in the discussion.

The whole point is that neither you nor I have any idea what the Texans would or wouldn't have done, and unlike some posters I'm not pretending that I do. I'm simply acknowledging possibilities. And since the post you're referencing popped up AFTER the one I responded to and in response to someone else no, that wasn't part of what I read. That's just the nature of message board conversations sometimes.

18 minutes ago, Mage said:

Okay.  I don't care to argue about who the Texans preferred.  My point still stands.  Had the Panthers taken Stroud, Texans would have taken Young.  Either way a team was going to make the "mistake" because drafting QBs is hard.

Seems to be the case, but we really don't know that either for sure. Maybe AR or even Levis (doubtful, but just for the sake or argument) would have been their choice if Carolina takes Stroud.All we know is that they were not concerned about not having control of the pick, and even if Young would have been their pick that doesn't absolve Carolina of any legitimate concerns that they may have overlooked. Having more than one team/person/etc willing to make a mistake doesn't automatically make it a good thing to do.

1 hour ago, jayboogieman said:

 

The overwhelming majority of this board were swearing up and down the Texans wanted Young leading up to that draft because that's what all the reports and rumors said. Only a few of us said the Texans could be blowing smoke too and were shouted down. Did the Texans play the Panthers and the other QB needy teams that were looking to move up? Maybe. Were the Texans just happy to take either top QB? Maybe. But none of that matters now since it's in the past and each team has a QB they at least claim they wanted.

Carolina has been played more than once over the years in situations like this, so that's my cynical default assumption at this point. Not to say that other teams don't get played as well, but this is the only one who I prefer not fall for it...

43 minutes ago, Mage said:

Because drafting is hard, especially at the QB position.  The same "mistake" the Panthers made was the exact same "mistake" the Texans had every intention of making had they picked first overall.

BS. They clearly thought Stroud was at LEAST as good as Young or they wouldn't have stood pat, and wouldn't shock me at all if Stroud was the target all along.

1 hour ago, CanadianCat said:

I agree with you. I also appreciate how The Franchise Guy has better perspective than probably everyone on this board as he has watched every play from every team. If he says we had the worst coaching, scheme and execution I put a lot of stock in that. 

Im also going into this year with a blank slate for BY. All the guy has ever done is win. I'll bet he bounces back in a big way. 

I don't really think there is anyone here arguing that Carolina wasn't bottom of the barrel in any/all of those areas. However, it doesn't change that the execution of all of the individual players sucked as well, Bryce absolutely included. None of this is mutually exclusive. 

7 minutes ago, JawnyBlaze said:

Haven’t watched it yet, but whining about the line (which wasn’t nearly as bad as the Young fanboys’ narrative says it was) and the pass catchers is the siren song of people who refuse to admit they were wrong about Young during the draft process. I still hope Young is able to develop, but I’m not expecting it. 

The OL, receivers, and Bryce were all terrible in non-exclusive fashion. That said yeah, Bryce's play in particular sure compounded some of the issues. 

9 hours ago, Shocker said:

216 at the combine but keep making shet up

Texas has him listed as playing at 207. Combine weight doesn't mean crap, with Bryce being Exhibit A.

https://texassports.com/sports/football/roster/jonathon-brooks/12405

Even if he is 216 off-season, that is still 19 pounds lighter and unlikely to be maintained in-season. But feel free to keep being wrong and posting moronic nonsense while doing it.

30 minutes ago, pantherclaw said:

So every player that is over drafted is a scam artist.  Interesting perspective.  

Bryce absolutely gamed the system at the combine, but players are supposed to do what they can to increase their draft stock. That's their motivation and (typically) in their best interest. Any fault lies with Carolina/any other team for not seeing through it if there was indeed valid internal concern.

2 hours ago, strato said:

It’s like a traffic accident, but I can’t not look. I have taken to watching replays and and not live games, and just enjoying my Sunday afternoons rather than donating every Sunday to the NFL. Who I have grown to despise as an entity. But football is a lifelong interest and difficult to move on from, entirely.

Tepper has pushed me to the fringes of fanhood. 

On the whole, I share the exact same sentiments. Tepper has pushed me to 'academic interest' status but it's hard to turn off 30 years of overall interest. Have to say though that the continued fractionation of the product and the ubiquity of gambling around the NFL in general is sure a growing turn-off.

6 hours ago, Mage said:

Obligatory Jonathan Stewart stiff arm gif

6 hours ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Most nfl ready since luck.   Cerebral.   Point guard.  Elevates all around him.  Mini mahomes.   

 

 

Damn the narrative has changed in a year.  

That coming out of Tepper's mouth was way up there on the list of stupid things he's said/done since taking over. 

2 hours ago, mrcompletely11 said:

I swear I thought stewart and dwill both had 1000 yards one season.   And that offense should have been unstoppable circa 2011-2015ish.   Not sure why they didnt load up on oline help during those early cam years with all that running firepower

They did in 2009. That was the only one though. 

26 minutes ago, PanthersGTI said:

 

Bro people here act like he isn't even fit to be in the NFL. I think he will show he is a franchise QB, take that for what its worth. Don't really care what you think he will achieve, you like all the other posters here including me don't actually know fug about poo or poo about fug when it comes to what Bryce can and can't do and how to evaluate and train a QB. No matter how much we like to think so. 

Andy Dalton was a franchise QB... just sayin'. That's not impressing anyone.

And I explained what my expectations were as framework for the meaningless "doubters" comment that is almost as bad as "haters" being tossed around. This type of response adds nothing to a conversation where you yourself issued a challenge and I simply asked what the criteria were. It's not hard to see that a guy like Bryce has a bigger hill to climb than the average player and may not have been the smartest investment with that pick, but it's exactly that investment that drives up the expectations and sets the bar high. Dude was individually terrible last year, as was the offense as a whole - gonna take more than middle-of-the-pack QB stats and for multiple years to "prove the doubters wrong".

43 minutes ago, PanthersGTI said:

Just to answer the question plainly : Yes I do. I think Bryce is going to prove the doubters wrong and all the naysayers will line up with their excuses and won't eat the crow. Kids gonna ball. 

As an honest question here, what level of performance "proves the doubters wrong"? Guy was the #1 overall pick and came at a tall price. I fully expect him to achieve Bridgewater-like numbers and eventually be at that level of player, but that sure doesn't justify the #1 overall and doesn't prove anyone wrong. Are we talking something like consistent years of top 10 QB play as the threshold for "proving the doubters wrong"?

1 hour ago, pantherclaw said:

Yes. Both players were undersized compared to NFL standards, who had to prove themselves in the NFL. 

Was 3 years for Steve Smith. 

Mills had a longer route. 

That is a legitimate comparison, I don't care what you think. 

I never once compared their careers. 

Learn how to fuging read. 

And again with something completely out of touch with the reality of what your posts are doing, which is creating potential parallels between Smith, Mills, and Bryce. And yet you argue that you aren't...

Your posting attitude has sucked for a good while but has hit insufferable lately. Blech. Happy Thursday. 

5 hours ago, Pejorative Miscreant said:

I think the act of spotting the ball will still be done by a person as there was no mention of that. The spot is where you would find the vast amount of judgement and mistakes imo.  I think you have a valid point though. 

Exactly. How would a chip in the ball know when a player was down? That element will absolutely still be a referee determination.

11 hours ago, pantherclaw said:

Steve Smith was told he didn't belong on an NFL field.  

Sam Mills was told he didn't belong either. 

Yes, being bigger and stronger is helpful, but that doesn't ensure a long career in the NFL either, just ask Cam. 

This is you, bringing Smith and Mills into the conversation about Bryce.

11 hours ago, pantherclaw said:

Steve Smith rookie year is worth mentioning as a receiver? 

Really?

Sam Mills couldn't even get drafted. He had to prove himself other places first. 

I get your point, but give Bryce the chance to succeed or not. Please don't bring up last season as a chance. 

This is you again relating those two to Bryce 

3 hours ago, pantherclaw said:

Nobody is comparing him to rhe career of Smith and mills. fug Y'all are stupid. 

You are absolutely relating these players, possibly the only one doing so, and then somehow calling other posters stupid about it. But don't let that pesky fact stop you - by all means, please continue to demean us/others in your responses.

7 hours ago, strato said:

1st two search results said Brooks was 216. Just sayin’.

Texas listed him as playing at 207.

https://texassports.com/sports/football/roster/jonathon-brooks/12405

216 may have been a combine weight, and those are of course always reflective of real-world 

1 hour ago, pantherclaw said:

Every NFL team owner is going to be a part of the FINIAL decision on any drafted QB that is to be the starting QB and potentially the face of the franchise. 

That's not a problem. That is how it's done. You'd be no different if you owned the Panthers. Don't argue otherwise, because it would be complete bullshit on every level. 

Nowhere did I say an owner shouldn't be/isn't involved at all, so an unnecessary strawman there on your part. Your last paragraph is also idiocy because, as I said in my initial post, it's about priorities. If an owner's priority is to win then they may need to set the ego aside sometimes. Just because 'that's how it's done' doesn't mean it's for the best and some owners are sure better at things than others. Isn't that really the crux of it and what Carolina fans have been living since Tepper took over?

16 hours ago, pantherclaw said:

I, honestly don't care. 

If I was a team owner, they'd draft the QB  I wanted. Period.  End of discussion.  This isn't a democracy.  

And that's a problem. What is the owner paying their football people for if not to be the most knowledgeable about football-related decisions/items in their organization? Guess it just depends on what their priority is.

On 5/18/2024 at 2:13 PM, mcsmoak said:

What’s a good price to pay for uppers?  Curious as to when I’ll know that it’s a good time to pull the trigger.  Looks like it’s their home opener so I imagine it won’t be super cheap

I've heard meth is pretty cheap these days, especially in Vegas, but adderall might be hard to find.

Oh wait... you mean upper deck seats. Never mind.