grimesgoat

10 minutes ago, CanadianCat said:

Yeah, football discussion happens less and less around here. Its more about trying to dunk on others. 

I was just thinking to how set up teams are when they can acquire multiple 1st round picks. How that suddenly becomes a very valuable currency if used correctly that can be traded and re-traded for years. 

Given Fitter's ability, I could see how he could really do well with that bargaining power. But the only way to be able to do that is if you already have a QB on the roster. Until that happens nothing else is more valuable. 

I agree.  Grabbing a guy like Willis, who you know will have some growing pains, may be the best move.  The combo of he and Darnold, without a shiny new LT, could propel us into a very interesting 4-13 type campaign.

But with our QB of the future in place, and probably a new coach after that lousy record, a top 5 pick in hand, and a strong QB crop - we'd be in prime position for a trade rape.

35 minutes ago, CanadianCat said:

Im more in the 'wait for 23' crowd but this post has me thinking. 

Our 'best' situation might be to pick a QB this year and ride with him all year. Assuming we finish top somewhere in the 3-6 range, given the draft capital from the Eagles and Giants we might be in the best position to trade with them for a kings ransom... but only if we already have our QB. 

If we draft a QB this year we might be able to trade our 1st next year for a king ransom. 

Kudos.  But that's out-of-the-box thinking, which is usually frowned upon around here.

Panthers are not ready to win 10+ games.  Best thing they can do is trade back a few spots, ideally for a future first and draft an OT (Cross/Penning?).  Then draft a DE in the 4th and call it a day.

Next year, there are a number of QB options that can be dropped into an almost finished product.  The 2 firsts may not be enough to get our guy, so we may need to give up a future first, but we should have a pretty solid roster all around - just waiting on a good QB to finish the product. 

2 hours ago, rippadonn said:

Thanks. Two in the last 40yrs. The most recent got the job at LSU. The other was 1978. Pickett is not Montana nor is he Burrow or he'd be in discussion before #6. I was on the Herbert train that year forgive me, wasn't into Burrow like that.

Thanks though, only two in almost 50yrs and Kenny Pickett is the next ONE!?

Quick google search shows Tom Brady, Matt Ryan, Eli Manning, Kurt Warner all spent 5 years in college.

Fun fact - Warner did not start for his college team until his final year and went undrafted.  Late bloomers do exist.

10 minutes ago, CRA said:

he didn't stink.  But he wasn't good.   He had 1 good season in a 5 year career. 

I'd characterize it as a couple good years, then a freakishly good year.

Again - not advocating for him.  I would much rather wait a year as the next class looks stacked.  But if Pickett is picked, I will remain positive and learn to live with it.

Just wanted to say Paradis isn't on the roster anymore.

I don't want to draft Pickett, but calling him a 1-year wonder is a little disengenuous.

I went back and looked at the covid-filled 2020 season.  Pitt was 6-5, but he did not play in 2 of the losses.  2 of his losses were by 1 point to BC and NC State.  So he was a couple points away from an 8-1 record.

His only bad game was against Clemson, where he tossed 4 of his 9 ints.

Again, not interested in him - rather go with Darnold.  Just trying to be fair.  He didn't actually stink in 2020.  I did not look at 2017-2019.

1 hour ago, stbugs said:

How are we getting 10-15 more players? We’ve got 1 pick before pick 137 this year. How many contributors do you think we’ll get this year? You know why so many of the 11 picks we had this year made the team? We were devoid of talent and depth. Sure, we could add 20 UDFAs, cut Shaq and Anderson and be absolutely fine cap wise.

No one in here is saying we can’t manage the cap but it’s delusional to think we’ll have a team to compete if we cut Shaq and add an UDFA.

We better hope our drafts starting knocking it out of the park. That’s the only way we can right this ship. We don’t have enough extra cap to really enhance this roster through FA with a bunch of 1 year deals. We aren’t the Rams or NO with Brees. We are a level or two below that. 

we have 6 picks this year.  we have at least 7 picks next year.  we're not drafting anyone knowing they will not be contributors.  they are all expected to compete for a spot.  most will make the team.  Some will be backups, but I imagine we can find 2-3 starters this year.

Almost all of our starters on defense are signed for 2 or more years.  Same with the offense.  There are only a handful of 1-year deals.

And I wasn't suggesting we cut shaq.  I like shaq.  But are you telling me we can't replace him with the 13m savings cutting him would produce?  Will terrace marshall be as productive as robbie anderson allowing a savings of 12m in cap?

Its a small sample, but it looks like Fitterer is focused on getting the expensive guys in the early rounds, as opposed to the prior regime that drafted LBs and RBs early.  CBs, T's, Edges, WRs, and QBs are expensive on the open market and I think Fitterer will want to maximize his dollars by drafting these players in the first few rounds.  Last year we went CB, WR, and T in the first 3 rounds.  This year its looking like a T, QB, or Edge.  Next year will probably be QB and Edge.  We'll see.

This thread is revealing.

Cut Shaq and Anderson: 25m

Restructure Moton and CMC: 15m

Meanwhile, if we draft well in the next two years, we will have 10-15 more players on nice low cost-controlled contracts (including an LT and QB).

The details are available.  Take a look.

12 minutes ago, frankw said:

When he's still throwing backbreaking interceptions will you Darnold fans be gone finally? It might be worth it for that.

I don't know him personally ,but I'm pulling for the guy.  He's probably the starting QB for my favorite NFL team.  I guess that makes me a fan?

1 hour ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

If that's the case than we wasted a ton of money on decent free agents.  Why sign all these players if we are playing for 2023.  

I imagine the NFL frowns on teams not competing.  The guys on a 1-year (Haynes, Bozeman, Littleton, and Loanidas) are all on pretty cheap deals.  I imagine they can find similar players next year or maybe these guys return. 

We have 6 picks this year and we should have a full complement next year.  We only roster 53 guys so everyone can't be on a 2+ year contract and expect all draftees to make the team.  Keep your homegrown talent and build through the draft means a few 1-year contracts along the way.

I think they believe they can be competitive throughout the year if things come together and CMC plays a full year.  If we are hovering around .500 and in the playoff picture, fans will remain engaged and tuning in.  Hell, we were above .500 last year when CMC played, despite the Darnold and a horrendous offense (scheme and OL).

This roster will not win a superb owl, but hopefully it will compete.

Continue the rebuild.

Trade back with Seattle.  Let them take Willis.  Draft Corral at 9.  Grab a DE, G, or T with the extra pick.

Start Darnold for 9 games.  If we are 4-5 or worse, make the change to Corral.  If we have a winning record after 9 games, wait until we are eliminated and make the switch.

After 2022, we will be off Darnold.  We'll have a decent idea who Corral is.  Our Offense and defense will be in good shape.  And we'll have a full complement of picks.

2022 is dark, but the future is bright (for those with patience).

17 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

There isn't gambling. Gambling is drafting based on need and not grade. If you don't think one of these QB's is going to be elite, you don't take them at 6. That's the math. 

Take the best combination of need and best player that suits the team. You don't reach for a need or reach for a player if you don't think they will be elite. 

IMO, none of these QB's are worth taking in the 1st round because they are all very long shots to being elite QB's. So, if it's me, no chance I take one at six, no matter how much we need them.

2nd or 3rd round? Sure, we can gamble there. 

This draft success quite literally hinges on our 6th because we are unlikely to get anything out of the remaining picks(barring a trade down scenario). So, if it's me, I don't dummy this up and get cute. Take a player that is likely to be elite and preferably at a position of real need. 

If you want to make panic moves, Jimmy G and Baker are likely to be available after the draft. 

I agree with some of  your opinions.  If Ekonwu or Neal are there at 6, I think those are good picks.

But I disagree with your assessment of these QBs.  Many folks are mocking these guys in the top half of the first.  They all have the tools and smarts for success.  And history has proven you can win a championship with a QB that was not taken in the top 5.  Other than Peyton, Eli, and Stafford, I believe that every QB that has won a SB since 2000 was drafted at pick 6 or later.  For example Mahomes (10th), Rogers (24th), Roethlisberger (11th), Flacco (18th).  Hell, Foles, Johnson, Wilson, and Brady were picked in the 3rd round or later.

Point is, NFL teams have been winning SBs for years without the best QB on the planet on their roster.  No reason to think Panthers can't build around one of these 3 guys and get where they want to go.  Strong OL, Strong D, and an above average QB is a formula that has proven to work.  

Just now, Jon Snow said:

that's an awesome gif.

1 hour ago, Snake said:

I'm in the minority but I don't have a huge problem with him starting to begin with. We might even be able to trade him if he does well. 

15 minutes ago, Chad_Cota said:

I completely agree. I say start darnold with an improved line and see what happens. 

 

I agree with you guys, but I'm surprised the poo police hasn't been by.

10 minutes ago, Aintmsbhavn2da said:

The 49ers this week were talking about trying to talk the Panthers into an even trade of Darnold for Jimmy G. 

I'd take that trade even with Jimmy's surgery. Push the eject button on PJ Walker, re-sign Cam for 1 yr, and either draft Willis in round 1 or make the OL and skill positions the focal point of our limited draft options.

If true, that would be much better than sending out a draft pick to get rid of Darnold's contract.  Heck, you could immediately cut Garapollo (none of his salary is guaranteed) and be in the same place as if you never guaranteed Sam's 5th year option. 

Then you'd have about 50m in cap.  Sign a LT, trade for Minshew, and draft your QB.

I'm one of the few people on here that think there is some value to Darnold.  He probably will not take anyone to the SB, but he could still be a bridge to better times.

In Darnold's last 8 games of 2019, he went 6-2.  He was 163-267 (61%) 2,047 yds, 13 TDs (4 ints) and was sacked 15 times.  That's actually pretty good.

The next year, he was hurt and the Jets were horrifying.

Then he comes to Carolina and he's saddled with a below average coach and OC and a historically bad offensive line.  

Point is - there is something there.  Someone will believe he can get it out of Sam.  He's not worth 18m, but no reason to just flush it.  Unless he's some kind of huge douche, I don't get the desperation to "get him out of the building".

Sign a LT.  Draft a QB at 6.  Start Sam for 8 games.  Keep starting him if we are still competing for the playoffs.  By the 11th or 12th game, turn the reins over to your draftee for some on-the-job training.  

It ain't that hard.  

1 minute ago, Jon Snow said:

That's not going to get a FA LT.

Our draft picks will be cheap.  We only have one that will cost anything.  The others will just replace guys already making the minimum.

Also depends on how you structure the contract.

Offer 2-year, 30m with a 14m signing bonus and 1m salary in year 1.  He gets 15m in cash in year 1, but salary cap hit is only 8m.  Year two, his salary is 15m.  You can keep him and the total cap hit is 22m, or cut him and the dead cap hit is 7m and you save 15m.

The hope is they don't fall in love with any of the top 3 QBs.  That way a trade down is risk-free because at least 1 of these guys will be around in the mid-first (if not all of them).

1 minute ago, grimesgoat said:

 

 

51 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

That's part of what I'm wondering, whether there are some contracts not fully processed yet.

I think Hekker, Loannidas, and DJ extension are not accounted for.  The Hekker and Loannidas signings will be negligible since they will replace other players that were already accounting around $1m.  The DJ extension will be expensive, but with a large signing bonus, may actually increase the available cap.

5 minutes ago, uncfan888 said:

He is a defined dumbass. 

Yep - that's me.

1 minute ago, MHS831 said:

Did I say he'd be good?  That would be a big a bowl of "nope".  What I was saying--and what you read were different.  If Darnold improves behind a better OL--and it is logical to assume that he will--then don't blow the #6 pick on a mediocre QB in a bad draft year.  Let Darnold play--you are paying him to do so.  Instead of trying to bring in a scrub again to fill the void.  It is too late to go QB shopping.  Build the OL, the DL and then, if Darnold has not improved dramatically (he probably won't) you should be in position to draft a good QB in a good draft--

Absolutely.  Take a year, gather assets, hire a new coach, then strike.

10 minutes ago, uncfan888 said:

Thanks for the grammar lesson. 

Those are words and definitions.

We can talk grammar another day.

11 minutes ago, uncfan888 said:

@LinvilleGorgewhy do yall let these obvious trolls stay? 

Trolling: to antagonize (others) online by deliberately posting inflammatory, irrelevant, or offensive comments or other disruptive content.

Irony: a literary technique by which the full significance of a character's words or actions are clear to the audience or reader although unknown to the character.