Hogan

18 minutes ago, tukafan21 said:

Oh, and again, we won 2 late season games in OT.

Are you telling me that if we had lost those games, we wouldn't have had the same development of the players that we had?

That's absolute utter nonsense, pulling out the win has literally ZERO affect on the development of the players.

That's what I think a lot of the "pro late season winning fans" seem to miss in this argument.  I'm not arguing for us to tank, that's nonsense, I'm arguing for us to do exactly what we did, fight hard and stay in games, but I'm wishing the other team would have pulled out the wins in the end.

If we lose the coin toss and give up TD's in those OT games, we have the #1 pick that we can trade and still 100% of the development and improvement of the players over the course of the season.  

In what world is that not better for the future of the franchise to have that #1 pick to trade than the very very very minor good feelings of a couple extra wins?!?!?!

I think you are confusing me with someone who is celebrating today. If the Panthers had lost and had a higher pick, I'm fine with that.

My point, which you ignore: You don't build a great team with year after year of Top 10 picks. The Panthers have the 8th pick instead of the 6th. IF the gm and coach know what they are doing, they will get a good player.

1 minute ago, tukafan21 said:

Howie Roseman is literally the best GM in the league at identifying talent, using them as an example is extremely flawed.

The problem is we keep trying to patch the holes on a sinking ship, hoping for a quick fix turnaround, but all it does is keep us in NFL purgatory.  We haven't been good since Cam got hurt in Pittsburgh and yet we haven't embraced a re-build in all those years since then either.

That's not how the NFL works, we have such a bad overall roster, but people are pinning their hopes on a guy who is never going to be an elite QB.

Make it make sense

Who is we? Canales and Morgan? You have no idea what they will do. Hopefully, they will be a bit more organized than the previous group. All the history you site is with the previous group, going back to Newton getting hurt in 2016. That was 8 years ago. A lot of dysfunction happened from 2016 to 2023. 

Positive change started when Hurney was FINALLY gone. Then, the organization FINALLY hired a GM who then hired the coach. And they seem to be on the same page. THAT is crucial.

Young? I'm not pinning my hopes on him. I'm pinning my hopes on the front office and coach. And I'll say again: Unless you're Jerry West, you don't build a great team with year after year of Top 10 picks. You build a great team by developing draft picks, undrafted free agents, and signing free agents. And Morgan and Canales haven't been around long enough to know how they will do. It's ridiculous  to base the Panther future on what the organization has done in the past. 

2 hours ago, tukafan21 said:

I don't care that this will get poo all over, but I called this before we even took him and I'm now even more confident it will be the case...

People need to stop getting excited about a guy who has a max potential of maybe the 20th best QB in the league and doesn't have the arm talent to will your team into contention every season.

It's the definition of QB and NFL purgatory and how you get stuck drafting in the 12-15 range every year with no shot at ever actually being a contender.

Poo away on this post all you want, but it's true and everyone getting all excited over Bryce rigth now better not complain 3 years from now when we still suck because Bryce just isn't that guy.

2 OT wins in the last month of the season cost us the #1 overall pick, as that's where we'd be if we lost both of those games.  

Hope that temporary moral boost is worth it

Go and look up Minnesota's draft picks over the past 10 years. And Philadelphia. Neither have continuously drafted in the Top 10. I think they have each had one maybe two Top 10 picks.

The point: You DON"T build a great team with Top 10 picks. Why? Because the goal is to improve every year. And with improvement every year, the lower your draft pick is.

By your reasoning, you'd rather have a coach and gm who suck so you can draft high every year.

The goal this year: IMPROVE. Develop players. That has definitely happened. IF Canales and Morgan and the scouts know what they are doing, everything will be fine. 

I would have much rather gone 5-12 and see hope than 2-15 and see no hope. 

18 hours ago, electro's horse said:

The packers org clearly does 

Good point. However, that proves my original point. That is, if you have an organization that knows what they are doing (Green Bay), the Panthers will be fine. If Canales, Morgan and scouting don't know what they are doing, it doesn't matter how many early draft picks you have. 

Also concerning Green Bay, aside from picking Rogers and Love late in the first round, the organization was also confident they could DEVELOP these players.

Both Darnold and Mayfield have proven to be pretty good QBs with time and development. Obviously, NO ONE with the Panthers saw this. Hopefully, as things move forward, the organization will recognize who can be developed and who can't.

26 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

Jordan Love is absolutely an elite qb, and Sam darnold was the best panthers qb of the past six years. 

NO ONE knows how ANY college QB will do in the NFL. If you have a track record of saying before the draft who will be the best QB, then you need to quit whatever job you have and get an NFL gig. 

Bottom line: If Morgan and Canales know what they are doing, the Panthers will be fine. If not, they won't be fine. That simple. If they know what they are doing, they will draft enough talent and sign enough FA to be very good. Green Bay is 11-4 and Minnesota is 13-2. Nether have elite QBs. What they apparently do have is a coach and a GM who know what they are doing.

All you can hope for with a first year Coach and GM is IMPROVEMENT. The team is definitely improved. 

Also, the QB has also showing improvement. 

Things are looking up.

21 hours ago, CarolinaRideorDie said:

Some of his play calling has been questionable, like not give Chubba the ball more when he is dominating. But definitely something to build on. 

In my opinion, at this point, Canales can't be judged on his play calling. He knows the limitations of his QB and has to call every play with that in mine. Again, my opinion, he's doing the best he can under the circumstances.

2 hours ago, NAS said:

Him failing means Panthers fail, can’t have it both ways

Not necessarily. What I'm looking at right now is the Head Coach and GM and how their plan is progressing or not. I see improvement. Whether Young is the guy or not, at this point, isn't the biggest issue/question.

I personally don't think he is accurate enough to be a franchise QB. But...the Panthers can improve whether he is or he isn't. 

2 hours ago, My Goodness My Guinness said:

Serious question for the box score folks? Did you actually watch the game or are you criticizing purely off 125 yards? An if you did watch the game, what would you say Bryce did poorly?

I watched the game and I pull for him like crazy. That said, realistically and objectively, he simply is very inconsistent concerning his accuracy. The over throw down the side line on third down. He has got to complete that throw. Making that throw is the difference between being an NFL starter and a career backup. That is, he'll have a career but he simply is not accurate enough to have a great career. I said this two years ago.

I admit, I have not watched every minute of every game beginning in September 2023. That said, in what I have seen, I have yet to see a wow play, where I said this guy has potential. Not one. 

Time to forget about the past and move forward. 

Canales. His first win as an NFL Head Coach. No brainer.

On 9/17/2024 at 4:24 AM, kungfoodude said:

Yeah, this is a pretty irrelevant thing, IMO. I really could care less what he was working on. It does show he doesn't seem to have much passion for the sport. At some level, I think that is a core issue. Not that it would make him more talented but if you don't live, eat and breathe football, it's going to be a tough to excel in this league. Especially without elite talent.

There weren't many people I grew up with who were more passionate and more competitive than I was. 

But, I had a couple of issues that led to my not playing in college and beyond. 1) I grew to be 5-7; 2) I'm a good athlete but not a great athlete. Point: No matter how much I cared, my size and talent level were only going to take me so far. So, I had to find another dream. That's the story for most of us. We have to find another dream. It isn't the end of the world.

Concerning Bryce Young, I posted this last January. I don't think I saw one play last year from him where I said "Wow." As a rookie, I wasn't expecting miracles from him. But...as the number 1 pick, I did expect some Wow moments. MOST number 1 picks will have some Wow moments as a rookie. I just didn't see any from him.

5 hours ago, CRA said:

Yeah, need to keep in mind Andy Dalton isn’t a good QB at this point in his career.  Just better than Bryce.

also….

 

Not developing him? Young does not have an NFL arm -- neither in strength nor accuracy. HOW can you develop a player like that?

Oakland was 2-14 in 2006, earning the first pick in the 2007 draft. Thus, they gave nothing away to get Russell. The Panthers traded the ninth pick in the 2023 draft AND their best receiver, D.J. Moore to get Young.

WOW!

Clearly the worst piick in NFL history. 

5 minutes ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

You say you played football, and you never had teammates who didn't care?

 

Bro I seen players get scared the moment they step on the field. I was watching a documentary with the Notre Dame LB Manti Te'o said his teammates were shook the moment Alabama came out of the tunnel. He openly admitted he knew his team had no shot.

 

Yes some players don't care. Not all, but some do that is fact. Some people are good enough to get paid. Some don't really care for the game they just care what the game brings them off the field.

 

Cmon bro it's like this in every sport. Some players care more than others. We have seen athletes admit they didn't really care much for a particular sport they just happened to be good at it and chose it for a career path.

 

 

I started this post to address the people who made blanket statements that "the team just didn't care." I don't agree with that and I believe a statement like that is ludicrous. Are there some in every sport who don't care? Yes. Is it the norm and can be applied to an entire team? No.

Concerning the "putting food on the table" comment. I'll stick by that. Most of these guys realize they have a very short amount of time to make life changing money. And most of these guys ARE NOT set for life after playing 3 or 4 years in the league. So, they are motivated to "care" about their job and their income in order to take care of their families.

"Oh, I don't care about the game today. Even though I want to buy my mother a house and I have two small children." Yeah, that makes lots of sense.

2 minutes ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

The score says they didn't care. At least be competitive bro.

Ok. Got it. Guys who have been the absolute best at what they do since they were 7 years old...just don't care. 

How about the front office hasn't had a clue in how to put a team together and the team sux. You think that might be a possibility?

And yes, I played all sports and some of my best friends are coaches at the highest level. They would tune someone out who said "players don't care." It's ludicrous. Yes, you have some who are just in it for the money. But the majority? No. 

2 hours ago, Ricky Prickles said:

Allow me to retort. There appeared yesterday to be some players who did not care on the field like it or not unfortunately. The proof is in some of the individual players body language, lack of apparent fire, smiling after mistakes, giving up and refusing to chase down a WR who just beat them or even not seeming to care in their physical play and almost going through the motions just to get it done and over with sort of like when we were all young and took an ugly chick home from the bar. Once we were actually in "action" and realized how ugly she was, we just had to at that point go through the motions, knock them boots and get that lass on her ugly ass way out our door.

So, someone spends six weeks working out in 100 degree heat and they don't care? Got it.

5 hours ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

Exactly 

 

If you ever played football you would understand that some players just don't care. Most take it seriously, but you can't convince me some of these players don't take their job seriously. Once they get paid some will just disappear.

 

Brown was nowhere to be found and he's supposed to be our best player. 

So you believe they came out yesterday in the first game of the season and didn't care?

I felt the need to start a post with this. I have read it several times here today. ANYONE who writes that and means it immediately loses credibility. One guy wrote this and then four paragraphs of his opinion. Pal, you immediately lose credibility when you write "these guys just don't care."

Seriously?!?!?! These guys are working to put food on the table and a roof over the heads of their families and they "don't care." Working their butts off to have a job in the NFL and they "don't care?" I can 100% assure you they care way more than you ever will. 

Anyone who writes that cannot be be taken seriously.

4 hours ago, Wanderlai said:

We were sold he is a super computer at reading defenses…I knew that was BS after the first few games last year but how did those responsible for analyzing his skills f’up so bad. His brain was his only selling pint but it’s mush 

THAT is exactly what I remember. He was a super computer at reading defenses. I never saw tapes where he had an elite arm.

39 minutes ago, Lame Duck said:

NFL analyst officially labeled Young a bust.  They said his biggest issue is he can’t read defenses.  He’s clueless of what’s going on around him.

Someone said that? I thought THAT is what made him elite coming out of college. Anyone with eyes knew in the Spring of 2023 that it WASN'T his arm.

9 minutes ago, Castavar said:

I don't either, but maybe some team think they could fix him or something and we can get a 3rd or 4th (I know, not happening).

Sigh. Another long season incoming.

Can't be fixed. Does not have NFL accuracy. 

2 minutes ago, csx said:

Young's biggest problem is that he is not accurate 

No matter how well you can process the game/read the defense, it doesn't matter if you are not accurate. WOW!