t96

We're not talking about locking a guy up.

 

We're talking about paying a guy a few million dollars and depending on that guy to play a significant role for our team.

 

You can bet your ass I'm gonna have some pretty high standards for someone we'd be investing that much in.

I guess we're talking about two different things then, because I'm just talking about DV in general, not specifically in regards to DGB. As I've stated many many times (and your eyes seem to pass right over), I don't want us to draft DGB. He's going to go in the first 2-3 rounds and I would never think to invest that much in him. But it would be foolish to completely rule out having a player like him on your team at all just because of one DV incident and some pot, if you've checked him out extensively and feel he can change and contribute to a positive atmosphere.

Very good point. I was going after the people who were taking the position that character doesn't matter--better take him or our NFC S rivals will.

 

I think you are correct--we don't know why he had red flags--if he can explain them and you are satisfied, then you have removed the character issue so that you can draft him.  Drafting someone with character issues, however, is a bad idea.  Same page, brother Thomas!

 

Right on.

So you talk about a straw man argument, then compare five year olds stealing and high school kids cheating to an adult committing domestic violence?

 

Yeah

 

He may be an adult in your eyes and in the eyes of the law, but the brain doesn't fully develop until at soonest 25. People CAN learn and mature. Not advocating drafting DGB since there's too many red flags and in a post-Rice NFL he won't see the field, but you seem like a guy who wants anybody who commits any crime of any nature to be locked up for life. No second chances. Maybe not but that's how it's coming across.

How about a scenario where a guy breaks down a door, shoves a pregnant woman down the steps and drags his girlfriend around by the throat?

How does that one stack up?

Like I said I'm not talking about DGB. I don't want us to draft him.

Pretty sure one incident of murder makes you a murderer and one incident of rape makes you a rapist.

Funny how that works, huh?

But hey, let's wait till somebody hits a woman at least three times before we start accusing him of being a woman beater. That's fair, right?

(just when I think the posts on here couldn't possibly get any dumber...)

I don't agree with what he said but not all incidents are the same or can be judged equally. For sake of argument, let's take two different scenarios. A man and woman are in a vocal argument and it escalates to a physical struggle when the woman starts throwing things at the man and beating on him and the man runs towards the stairs. She is still hitting him and he pushes her down the stairs (not saying this is DGB by any means). Would that be the same as a man who beats the crap out of his wife with a closed fist regularly? I would not consider the man in that first incidence a "woman-beater" by any means. The second scenario? Should spend his life in prison. Both are "DV."

What some people do not seem to get is this:  Character matters.  It matters in the locker room, the weight room, the film room--they are all connected.  A TEAM is genuinely only as strong as its weakest link.  A teammate who does not value you on the field or off it shows that by getting into trouble.  If you have ever been on a team playing at a high level (high school-pros) you understand character and its relationship to commitment.  

 

Now to address the many stupid comments I read here:

• Jerry Richardson is the only owner in the league who played in the NFL and he values character.
• Many of you are the same people who raised hell when the Panthers did not exercise the option to keep Steve Smith here until age 37 at a cost of about $19m.  He was a cancer in the locker room.  No WRs ever brought in after he was here ever prospered because he was a dick.  But you saw the glitter, the on-field fights and the spinning of the ball after a catch and thought, "Hall of fame!!!"  No.  750 yards, 35 years old, and a locker room cancer.  Not a hard cut.
• If I am in the news and totally innocent and it is learned that I am partying with a crack ho, driving a car 100 mph, and have a collection of assault rifles on my furniture at home, I imagine I would lose my job even though I was not caught or convicted of a crime.  How in the hell do you all think you should keep your job when you are tarnishing the name of the company you work for?  Are you so stupid that you think Goodell is a judge and is operating under the constraints of the legal system?  Here are some guidelines that most people with a brain seem to get: 1. Don't drive 50 miles per hour over the speed limit.  2. Don't date crack hos and hit them when they are acting out on crack, 3. Keep your gun collection locked up. 

 

Now, if your experience on a team was narrated by Madden and involves a joy stick, you probably won't get this.  If leadership experience on your resume features the words "fantasy football" you probably won't get it.  But these players live together, work together, and depend on one another.  Character is very important, something that is difficult to see if you lack it.

This is absolutely true but what you read and hear about DGB doesn't tell you about his character. The team must determine that through talking to people associated with him and doing all their possible research. Hardy's supposedly a "woman-beater" and the majority of our players wanted him to return.

I can get in my vehicle and drive down the interstate at 100 mph. If I don't get pulled over it doesn't mean I didn't do it.

If you wanna argue legal semantics or stick up for him then go right ahead. The only thing more pathetic than a woman beater is someone who defends the actions of a woman beater.

DGB busted down a door at 3am (felony burglary), shoved a teenager down stairs (aggravated assault), and drug his girlfriend outside by her neck (felony assault).

The police saw the busted door. The victim told them what happened and it was corroborated by a 3rd witness. The victim was pressured by DGB's girlfriend to keep quiet. Police have the phone records of his girlfriend apologizing for it and also saying he assaulted her.

You are either trolling or an idiot.

Is it possible he's guilty and is a woman beater? Sure. But is it possible that he's not guilty of any wrongdoing whatsoever? Absolutely. You don't have any idea whatsoever what happened and neither does anybody else who's not involved. Let him handle his personal business and if he's breaking the law let the law deal with it. And if you feel so strongly about not having these type of players in the league and not wanting them on your team, then I'm sure you refuse to watch any movie or tv show that has an actor who's a "woman-beater" (or any other crimes) and you go and cross-reference every single actor in the entire film, extra, supporting actor, or star, just to make sure. If not then you're a hypocrite.

Not really. He's got the best skill set of any WR. By far. He also has the most baggage, which is why he will be Drafted much lower than his skill set warrants. 

He could have Thomas Davis character and Cooper and White would still be ahead of him. He may have the most potential but that's not always realized.

Clayton Geathers. Will be an all-pro.

Full?

That was a good post Batman. Got me slightly aroused.

Fixed.

Save the Children concert.

I'm just stating my opinion of gentleman's team-building philosophy... Not a personal attack, and yet some of you at like I just spit in your dad's face. Chill out.

And Thomas, if you can't have an adult conversation without insulting someone, over people and things you personally don't know, then I have to say, no, my good sir... You are pathetic.

Seems like you're the one getting worked up over a simple word typed on a message board... You're not "stating your opinion," you're whining, bitching and moaning. Saying "you're pathetic" is hardly a personal "attack." Man you young politically correct people kill me.

4 min a year is vet min for Jennings and I'm sure nick got more than the min also he is not FAST.......

Vet min for Jennings is not $4mil/year. It's not even $1M per.

Both have been vastly overrated by most on this board so far. Kelvin is gigantic and slow, with a serious case of dropsies. Philly is small, not as fast as people think, and injury prone. It is very likely that Philly is a career #3 and KB has yet to prove he's even a reliable #2. Yet, everyone here have deemed them the #1 and #2... That's not acceptable. Both could be great and in more appropriate roles if they had more talent around them, specifically a legit #1 or #2 who has proven themselves already (e.g.,Jennings, Moore, Nicks, Britt, even Crabtree).

But what am I talking about? WR was taken care of as soon as we signed all-world Jarrett Boykin and his blazing speed.

I'm the highest on Philly here and even I haven't ever said Philly should be our #2... And Kelvin has already proved he's a capable #1 having carried our entire wide receiver corps last year going against double coverage every play and walking over the legion of boom like no other wide receivers have. You're pathetic.

I love the end zone view. Only sat there a few times (not in Dallas, at games in general) but you can really see the plays develop. Obviously when the play's at the other end of the field it's not as good but overall i like the end zone. Typically cheaper too. Not sure about that Dallas game but I'd bet it's cheaper than what you're looking at. Never sat in the corners either.

Are you suggesting that Cam doesn't need more offensive weapons? If so, history and a lot of people that know football say otherwise. More weapons on defense and offense are not mutually exclusive. In fact, anyone should desire both. Balance across the board is the bigger picture.

I don't like when people suggest "Cam" needs more offensive weapons. The TEAM needs more offensive weapons for overall success. When people come on here whining and bitching (obviously not you, but others) about "Cam needing weapons" it makes them seem like Cam fans who want him to put up 5000 and 50 every year to become the GOAT, instead of wanting the team to win. Defense and offense are both a part of the equation and morons who suggest that drafting defense is "sabotaging Cam" are ridiculous.

Agreed.

Have you ever PIE'd anybody?

We're comparing two different types of wideout with different values attached to them. Parker is a high point specialist with very good mobility and is a natural fit at X or Z receiver on the outside. Agholor uses route timing and angles to his advantage from the slot. Different receivers who naturally have different value, regardless of who we think is going to be more productive.

True, but I don't think Agholor will be limited to the slot. He'll be a guy that can play, and dominate, from any spot on the field. May be my favorite wideout in this draft outside of Cooper. Don't love White or Parker. DGB exlcuded because he's not on our radar.

There's every chance you're right and I have a lot of faith in Agholor, but right now Parker is 3 inches taller, just as fast and quite a bit stronger. I get the feeling Agholor would be a great fit in the right system, while you could build your system around Parker.

I just wouldn't trade up for any wideout but Cooper and only if he falls into the mid-late teens.

Why on earth do we need more draft picks? There is a significant drop off in talent between the top 3 receivers and the rest. If Parker falls beyond 18 you make a move for him if you're serious on a 1st rd WR.

Agholor will be a better player than Parker.

Your so wrong on this, get a law degree and come back here. Till then stop spouting nonsense

He should probably go back to 3rd grade so he can learn the definition of the word 'fact' before he even thinks about getting a law degree.

In the spirit of pot, I just blocked the motherfuger.  

 

Thanks.

Unfortunately he'll get banned soon and come back as another alt.

Last 3 years...

366 Yd 4 TD

804 Yd 4 TD

742 Yd 6 TD

Pedestrian.

Those are #2 WR numbers....

Would have liked him here and he got a reasonable deal, but oh well. No big deal. Agholor please.