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Continuity not Capability


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#76 Sloth

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 05:21 PM

You do realize the manner in which you compared them is hysterical.

I mean for example....you cherry picked his offensive rankings when his team was in the postseason yet when given the opportunity for Jackson said simply coached under someone (when his team lost and ranked poorly in pts and yards)


CRA, I have to apologize. I assumed anyone following the thread could read and had noticed teeray point out Hue's crash in Washington and Atlanta about an hour ago.

#77 Ivan The Awesome

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 05:21 PM

These conspiracy theories about Rivera picking a guy that wouldn't take his place are getting ridiculous..

#78 Sloth

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 05:23 PM

Also CRA, are you still pushing the "coaches don't matter" schtick?

#79 captfluoro

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 05:27 PM

CRA has a point.

2003: Washington 23/32 in points, 22/32 yards
2007: Atlanta 29/32 points, 23/32 yards

Personally I'm ambivalent about the hire. Wait and see is how I look at it.

#80 DeAngelo's #1 Fan(CRA)

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 05:31 PM

Also CRA, are you still pushing the "coaches don't matter" schtick?

In the NFL? I'd rather have very good players and average coaches then above average coaches and bad players.


#81 DeAngelo's #1 Fan(CRA)

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 05:33 PM

CRA has a point.

2003: Washington 23/32 in points, 22/32 yards
2007: Atlanta 29/32 points, 23/32 yards

Personally I'm ambivalent about the hire. Wait and see is how I look at it.


Both also had losing records. Shula had a losing record once in 4 years.....so did enough with what he had (which wasn't much)....but it fit what Dungy asked

#82 Marguide

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 05:36 PM

I feel like we would excel in a simple run first offense...just my opinion. Ride Stew, Tolbert, and maybe Williams all day and make Cam a glorified game manager. He's never going to be Brady or Manning and there is nothing wrong with that.

Cam's accuracy is still horrible, I am far from being anti Cam, but the guy struggles to hit RBs on screens, overthrows intermediate routes, and leads his receivers out of bounds when throwing deep towards the sidelines. You can score on the ground, we do more than we pass for scores.


I guess somebody better tell the folks in Indy they might as well go ahead and just make Luck a game manager, because he sprays balls all over the field.

Oh, and that Manning guy couldn't even hit 60% of his passes the 1st two years. Over the same period, his completion % is a whopping 0,5% better than Cam's. That means for every 1000 passes, he would only complete 5 more than Cam. Should have just made him a game manager too.

#83 rodeo

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 07:08 PM

In the NFL? I'd rather have very good players and average coaches then above average coaches and bad players.

False dichotomy.

#84 Growl

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 07:25 PM

the run run sack punt has returned to the Carolinas baby!

#85 FastNFurious

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 07:30 PM

I'm not so sure just winning 9 games will save his job... Jerry wants his team in the playoffs

#86 Happy Panther

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 07:40 PM

While they might consider that as a benefit, it won't be a driving factor. They expect to win next year just like they did this year. Expectations will be even higher. If this year looked like a repeat of 2004, then we can all hope that next year will resemble 2005, at least in terms of making the playoffs. Richardson hired Gettleman to get the talent and manage the cap. He kept Rivera because he thinks he is trending upwards and realizes we were a half dozen plays from the playoffs in 2012. With even better talent we might make those half dozen plays or at least make our share.


You are right. I also think there is Gettleman and Richardson trying to give Rivera every chance he can get to do well with the continuity...so that there are no excuses next year.

#87 KendrickPanther

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 07:53 PM

I agree with Zod. This was a short sighted move where playoffs is the ceiling. Forget glory and Super Bowls we can't out gameplan the best in the business with Mike Shula.

#88 DeAngelo's #1 Fan(CRA)

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 08:09 PM

I agree with Zod. This was a short sighted move where playoffs is the ceiling. Forget glory and Super Bowls we can't out gameplan the best in the business with Mike Shula.

Cam Newton can however become a one man wrecking crew regardless of OC if we are lucky

#89 Happy Panther

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 08:12 PM

I agree with Zod. This was a short sighted move where playoffs is the ceiling. Forget glory and Super Bowls we can't out gameplan the best in the business with Mike Shula.


I think the bigger issue is who we brought in.

Shurmur is terrible and Jackson had big red flags.

We couldn't find one better candidate? Shula was arguably the best of the three given our situation.

Recall what Richardson said about Harbaugh:

I had not thought about talking to him about a head coach,



#90 GRWatcher

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 08:37 PM

Isn't that obvious?

Shula is Rivera's best hope at keeping his job. Not because he is the best OC available, but because he does not have to completely overhaul the current offense.

Hiring an outsider offensive coordinator would mean the entire offensive staff would be gone and a completely new offensive system in place. A new playbook. New terminology for the players to learn. New chemistry to be developed between players and coaches. Often, this can take more than one season to start yielding results.

Rivera does not have more than one season. If the Panthers do not win this year, he is gone. He knows it, everyone knows it.

So put yourself in his shoes. Knowing you can only lose 7 games next season or your ass is fired, would you

1: Hire a completely new offensive staff and implement a new system knowing in all likelyhood it will take a good of time to develop into a good offense if ever at all. or...

2. Promote from within and hope the current offense can be good enough to get you 9 wins. No learning curve, fewer variables.

Lets be clear here. The Shula hire was not made because he was the best candidate. Shula was hired because it presented the best option for Rivera to possibly win 9 games next season. It was a last ditch short term job saving hire. Any considerations past 2013 are an afterthought.


Admittedly I have not read the entire thread. So maybe this question has been asked.

But logic rears its ugly head to beg the question:

If promoting Shula instead of hiring from outside will give the Panthers the best chance to win the most games next year (which is what you are implying), why wouldn't that be true beyond next year?

OR

If next year the Panthers end with a winning season and Coach Rivera keeps his job, what are you saying would change that would make him change his OC?

Your statements have only one basis in reality, that head coaches will always hire the coordinators and coaches that they feel will help the team win. Something you are attributing only to Coach Rivera?


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