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National Signing Day Thread


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#76 Tweeder

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 02:58 AM

Ha and you do realize that Butch Davis' record at Miami was:

8-3
9-3
5-6
9-3
9-4
11-1

So with ALLLL that talent he managed one season with more than 9 wins. How can you possibly argue about wins with me when your coach has a 66% winning percentage and my coach has a 60% win percentage at a WAAYY less talent dense part of the country in the same conference? Its not like Butch has been a football god everywhere he has gone. He inherited a college football powerhouse that had won 4 national championships in the previous 12 years before he got there. Not exactly like taking over a school like BC. So don't argue wins with me anymore there isn't that big of a difference and there was a huge difference in the talent pool that the coaches had to pull from.



Now I will start taking up for Butch Davis now.......F1P2 is correct when he took over Miami, he had nothing but the NCAA watching the program like a hawk, and had to rebuild that program from scratch. Look at Beamer it took him 10 years to get a 10 win season, granted it was and is much harder to recruit to VT compared to Miami, but VT hasn't looked back. If Butch would have stayed at Miami he would have won the NC, and probably kept the program going in the right direction rather where it went after Coker took over.

Will he put Carolina in contention for a title run?? Only time will tell, all I know is he has them going in the right direction with making believers out of them, and having great success with recruiting. We just have to sit back and wait and see how he and his coaching staff develops these players.

#77 unicar15

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 10:32 AM

You realize he had 31 scholarships pulled? He didn't inherit sh*t. Miami was on so many probations when he took over. He turned Miami back into a national power. STFU if you don't know what you're talking about.


Now I will start taking up for Butch Davis now.......F1P2 is correct when he took over Miami, he had nothing but the NCAA watching the program like a hawk, and had to rebuild that program from scratch. Look at Beamer it took him 10 years to get a 10 win season, granted it was and is much harder to recruit to VT compared to Miami, but VT hasn't looked back. If Butch would have stayed at Miami he would have won the NC, and probably kept the program going in the right direction rather where it went after Coker took over.

Will he put Carolina in contention for a title run?? Only time will tell, all I know is he has them going in the right direction with making believers out of them, and having great success with recruiting. We just have to sit back and wait and see how he and his coaching staff develops these players.


He lived in the MOST fertile recruiting state in the country and played in the same conference as TOB and won like 10 more games in the same time period. All I'm saying is that to say a team is a "sleeping giant" is stupid because they have been asleep for going on 50 years and nobody has woken them up. The UNC football program is no better than the NCSU football program, or the Wake program, and the only reason anyone wants to believe it is is because it is a BANDWAGON UNIVERSITY with a high-profile coach.

And as for him winning the national championship that is hard to predict. I could potentially say the same thing if O'brien had stayed at BC and kept coaching Matt Ryan right?? That team was ranked in the top 2 at one point the year after he left. It was essentially the same thing as Coker taking over for Miami when Jagz took over BC...

#78 chbright

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 10:58 AM

Now I will start taking up for Butch Davis now.......F1P2 is correct when he took over Miami, he had nothing but the NCAA watching the program like a hawk, and had to rebuild that program from scratch. Look at Beamer it took him 10 years to get a 10 win season, granted it was and is much harder to recruit to VT compared to Miami, but VT hasn't looked back. If Butch would have stayed at Miami he would have won the NC, and probably kept the program going in the right direction rather where it went after Coker took over.

Will he put Carolina in contention for a title run?? Only time will tell, all I know is he has them going in the right direction with making believers out of them, and having great success with recruiting. We just have to sit back and wait and see how he and his coaching staff develops these players.



miami gets walk ons that offers for a full ride elsewhere. florida has the best athletes period. hell UF proved it when multiple students tried out and ran sub 4.5 40s. they always get the tallent down there with or without the scholarships. can you really say that about vt, unc, nc state, or bc?????? and on the recruiting note, its not like VT gets top recruiting classes to this day. mid teens sure, but fsu, florida and UM almost always whip everyone just with the recruits they pull from florida alone.

#79 Falcons1stPanthers2nd

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 11:56 AM

link to said walk-ons when Butch was coach.

#80 monstercat

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 12:22 PM

You realize he had 31 scholarships pulled? He didn't inherit sh*t. Miami was on so many probations when he took over. He turned Miami back into a national power. STFU if you don't know what you're talking about.


Yep, and those 31 scholarships were taken away over his first 3 years as HC there. That's about as tough as it gets for a new HC trying to build a team with his recruits, regardless of what state he's recruiting in.


BTW, nobody has even mentioned how long it's been since Miami was a national powerhouse, or how they aren't producing several 1st round draft picks every year like they were when BD's kids starting entering the draft. Not to mention that BD was recognized for having one of the better graduation rates while at Miami.

#81 Tweeder

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 12:24 PM

He lived in the MOST fertile recruiting state in the country and played in the same conference as TOB and won like 10 more games in the same time period. All I'm saying is that to say a team is a "sleeping giant" is stupid because they have been asleep for going on 50 years and nobody has woken them up. The UNC football program is no better than the NCSU football program, or the Wake program, and the only reason anyone wants to believe it is is because it is a BANDWAGON UNIVERSITY with a high-profile coach.

And as for him winning the national championship that is hard to predict. I could potentially say the same thing if O'brien had stayed at BC and kept coaching Matt Ryan right?? That team was ranked in the top 2 at one point the year after he left. It was essentially the same thing as Coker taking over for Miami when Jagz took over BC...



I would say hard to predict if Coker had not of won the NC the year after Davis left.....unlike Jags he kept the same team/talent, and did not change anything that Davis did. The problem with Coker is that he lost the recruiting battle to UF and FSU and while they all were still getting talent....Maimi started getting the problem children again

miami gets walk ons that offers for a full ride elsewhere. florida has the best athletes period. hell UF proved it when multiple students tried out and ran sub 4.5 40s. they always get the tallent down there with or without the scholarships. can you really say that about vt, unc, nc state, or bc?????? and on the recruiting note, its not like VT gets top recruiting classes to this day. mid teens sure, but fsu, florida and UM almost always whip everyone just with the recruits they pull from florida alone.


Oh I am not denying that the state of Florida is loaded with talent, and the same is said for Texas and Cali.....Those are the reasons that schools from those states are consistantly top programs. All I am saying is that it takes years for programs to develop under new coaching. I agree there are some on this board that has really high hopes for Carolina right away, but IMHO opinion I am trying to stay under control for a few more years and see how this coaching staff develops players. If they can develop players like VT has in the past 10-12 years and keeps getting top recruiting classes then yeah the expectations are going to very high every year.....If they develop the players like Groh's staff does up in UVA, then Carolina will be a middle of the road team.


Let's just get this straight, I have never said anything bad about TOB or NCSU, except from a rivalry stand.....I did not want TOB going to NCSU, because I know what he did with BC and I did not want the same success to happen to NCSU. I also knew TOB would get recruits that Carolina recruits which was another bad thing. Hell Carolina has already lost a lot of talent to out of state schools such as Tennessee and VT, now they have to also compete with in state of NCSU and hell possibly Duke.

My whole argument was just backing up the success that Davis has shown at a college level, he has been no Nick Saben, Pete Caroll, or Urban Meyer.....but he is still a good Coach for Carolina to have and only time will tell how successful he really can be there.

#82 monstercat

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 01:56 PM

Well, it's pretty obvious that BD was better at finding, acquiring, and developing that Florida talent than the coaches the have come after him. Larry Coker was great right up until BD's players started graduating and/or leaving for the NFL, and the jury is certainly still out on Randy Shannon, despite the fact that he has all that Florida talent available to him.

#83 Panthro

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 02:12 PM

I :heart: and :hate: Tweeder

#84 unicar15

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 03:10 PM

Well, it's pretty obvious that BD was better at finding, acquiring, and developing that Florida talent than the coaches the have come after him. Larry Coker was great right up until BD's players started graduating and/or leaving for the NFL, and the jury is certainly still out on Randy Shannon, despite the fact that he has all that Florida talent available to him.


Shannon had the 5th best class in the country last year and is #11 this year...not too shabby for a guy that has been on the hot seat and rumored to be getting fired at some points in 2007 and 2008. If you can't recruit to Miami then there is something wrong with you. Outside of USC it is probably the easiest place to recruit to in the country. I was listening to the radio the other day and the head of football scouting for CFN was on and he said that a 2 star in Florida is equivalent to a 4 star anywhere else in the country. The reason was because their talent is so dense that its impossible to rank everyone...the walk-ons at Miami are not your average walk-ons.

#85 monstercat

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 04:06 PM

Coker had highly ranked recruiting classes too, but he was only able to win a championship while he still had the BD players. That's a fact.

Bottom line...the only place where Butch Davis has ever failed as an assistant or as a HC, was Cleveland, and even Bill Belichick couldn't turn that team around, so I'm willing to give him a pass for that one.

I too would like to see a link, and more importantly, some names of all these super talented Miami walk ons that turned down scholarship offers from other schools.

Anyway, evidently the massive nationwide conspiracy to overrate UNC football doesn't include ESPN. Here is their pre season top 25...

http://sports.espn.g...mark&id=3893994

Notice how GT is #13 even though Carolina beat the crap out of them last year. I promise you that I don't believe that there is a nationwide conspiracy to overrate GT even though we beat them, because I have enough sense to know that one game doesn't mean that much.

Edited by monstercat, 09 February 2009 - 05:48 PM.



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