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Jonathan Stewart The Most Elusive Rb In The Nfl?


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#16 MHS831

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 07:58 AM

It seems to me that building the OL is smarter than piling 18% of the cap room into RB. If you took DWill's salary, for instance, and brought in 2 stud guards at $3.5 million per year each, an average back could parallel DWill's yardage. In addition, the passing game is made better.

Having 2 stud RBs is Foxball.

#17 PhillyB

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 07:58 AM

If Stewart is not here it won't be because Hurney didn't try and sign him, it will because Stewart wants to go elsewhere. It is Stewart who is supposedly not negotiating. Tolbert was brought in because Stewart wouldn't negotiate from what I can tell. Could we keep both of them? I think so. Williams will count around 8 million cap space next year (4.75 million salary). Stewart will count his prorated signing bonus next year and a nominal salary which is very typical the first year of a contract. If it was like William's contract he will cost 3.2 million in prorated signing bonus and likely 1.5 million in salary. His will be backloaded while WIlliams was somewhat front loaded. So between them it will likely be roughly 13 million. With Tolbert it will be 15 million. How is that much different than this year where Williams costs 8.5 million cap space, Stewart is 2.6 million and Tolbert is 2 million? So we can afford 13 million this year but can't afford 15 million next year??

The reality is that if we can't afford them next year, we can't afford them this year. I think we can afford them this year and can do so again next year. With the increased cap space in 2014 and likelihood that Wiliams will be done in a few years, it makes keeping Stewart both very doable but desirable. If he isn't here it will be by his own making not Hurney's.


15 mil for the NFL's best backfield? i'll take it

#18 CatMan72

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:00 AM

We need to get this guy re-signed... nothing against Tolbert, but Stew is on a whole different level.

#19 DeAngelo's #1 Fan(CRA)

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:01 AM

If Stewart is not here it won't be because Hurney didn't try and sign him, it will because Stewart wants to go elsewhere. It is Stewart who is supposedly not negotiating. Tolbert was brought in because Stewart wouldn't negotiate from what I can tell. Could we keep both of them? I think so. Williams will count around 8 million cap space next year (4.75 million salary). Stewart will count his prorated signing bonus next year and a nominal salary which is very typical the first year of a contract. If it was like William's contract he will cost 3.2 million in prorated signing bonus and likely 1.5 million in salary. His will be backloaded while WIlliams was somewhat front loaded. So between them it will likely be roughly 13 million. With Tolbert it will be 15 million. How is that much different than this year where Williams costs 8.5 million cap space, Stewart is 2.6 million and Tolbert is 2 million? So we can afford 13 million this year but can't afford 15 million next year??

The reality is that if we can't afford them next year, we can't afford them this year. I think we can afford them this year and can do so again next year. With the increased cap space in 2014 and likelihood that Wiliams will be done in a few years, it makes keeping Stewart both very doable but desirable. If he isn't here it will be by his own making not Hurney's.


Stewart will play here if we pay him....if he doesn't play here it won't be bc he doesn't want to....it will be bc we don't pay him what he thinks he deserves.

Stewart shouldn't negotiate now. If he doesn't play here it will be bc of Hurneys deal with Williams and the fact Carolina can't dump the cash Stewart deserves into someone who accounts for 20-30% of our ground production.

#20 PantherBrew

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:01 AM

Maybe Hurney and Rivera are trying to stay ahead of the curb ( no pun intended), in regards to the NFL zeitgeist. Instead of trying to catch up.

If it is their plan, its risky, but we could be trying to take advantage of smaller and quicker defenses.

This is all speculation, but I am just trying to rationalize.

#21 jarhead

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:02 AM

I would LOVE to keep Stew. hell, I would drop DWill in a heartbeat to keep him. However, DWill's contract is a done deal. The cap hit is too extreme to cut or trade him. In addition, I just don't see how we can invest that much Cap Space into teh RB position and be able to invest in other areas of the team.

Like it or not, this situation was pretty much decided the day that DWill signed.

I agree ...we made our choice when we signed DWILL to that enormous contract.I guess the question is could we have paid Dwill in a manner to keep both? and the 2nd question should we have let Dwill go and kept the younger Stewart?

#22 panthers55

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:02 AM

Can't spend that money in the backfield. Too much. Hurts ability to build the rest of your roster. Don't forget they will be looking to pay Cam likely the next year as well.....


Cam is signed through 2014 with an option year already built in 2015. There is absolutely no reason to worry about extending him before 2014 at the earliest. We only have to worry about 2013 and as I just showed a few posts ago, the increase next year to keep Stewart will likely be around 2 million dollars. Not the king's ransom some of you suggest or that much more than we are spendiing this year. With the cap space likely to go up by 20-30 million in 2014, there is not a huge crisis here.

#23 MHS831

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:03 AM

If Stewart is not here it won't be because Hurney didn't try and sign him, it will because Stewart wants to go elsewhere. It is Stewart who is supposedly not negotiating. Tolbert was brought in because Stewart wouldn't negotiate from what I can tell. Could we keep both of them? I think so. Williams will count around 8 million cap space next year (4.75 million salary). Stewart will count his prorated signing bonus next year and a nominal salary which is very typical the first year of a contract. If it was like William's contract he will cost 3.2 million in prorated signing bonus and likely 1.5 million in salary. His will be backloaded while WIlliams was somewhat front loaded. So between them it will likely be roughly 13 million. With Tolbert it will be 15 million. How is that much different than this year where Williams costs 8.5 million cap space, Stewart is 2.6 million and Tolbert is 2 million? So we can afford 13 million this year but can't afford 15 million next year??

The reality is that if we can't afford them next year, we can't afford them this year. I think we can afford them this year and can do so again next year. With the increased cap space in 2014 and likelihood that Wiliams will be done in a few years, it makes keeping Stewart both very doable but desirable. If he isn't here it will be by his own making not Hurney's.


Good info. However, I do not see us, in this offense, affording even $13 million. If you base all other logic on the assumption that $13 million is affordable, then your argument is logical.

I am guessing that $13 million is roughly 1/8 of the entire cap. We have 21 other starting positions. We have huge needs elsewhere.

I liken it to lunch money. If I have $20 and five children going to school, this is like giving $10 to one child and expecting the other 4 to split the rest. Gotta feed the entire family.

#24 panthers55

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:04 AM

I see your point, but even if Tolbert was not on the roster, Hatter is right--$16 million-That is $1 million per game--for 20 carries? That means every time Stew or DWill run the ball, they are paid $50,000. That comes to $10,000 per yard gained during a good year.

People on here (not you) think they can have everything. They fail to consider the fact that keeping 3 RBs at nearly $20 million takes away from other positions. You gotta spread the wealth.


20 million is way overstated. we will spend 13 million this year and likely 15 million next year assuming we keep all three. If we can't afford them next year, we can't afford them this year either,

#25 PantherBrew

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:05 AM

Kudos to this thread so far for having rational, polite discussion without calling anyone retarded.

*Cue someone to call me a retard*

#26 DeAngelo's #1 Fan(CRA)

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:07 AM

Tolbert plays into our passing scheme....not a sign we are trying to run over small defenses. Tolbert is a great blocker and reciever....and will lessen the blow if Stewart walks. Williams fits more of a Fox ground and pound. So losing Stewart hurts....really hurts without someone like Tolbert to take some of his reps.

#27 panthers55

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:07 AM

Good info. However, I do not see us, in this offense, affording even $13 million. If you base all other logic on the assumption that $13 million is affordable, then your argument is logical.

I am guessing that $13 million is roughly 1/8 of the entire cap. We have 21 other starting positions. We have huge needs elsewhere.

I liken it to lunch money. If I have $20 and five children going to school, this is like giving $10 to one child and expecting the other 4 to split the rest. Gotta feed the entire family.


Remember this is cap space which can be easily manipulated. If we extend Smitty in the next few weeks we could free up around 4 million which when added to Wharton's June 1 release will add around 9 million in cap space. We have money for what we want to do which is sign our own.

#28 MHS831

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:08 AM

15 mil for the NFL's best backfield? i'll take it

u

You endorse spending 13% of the cap space on one position?

#29 panthers55

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:11 AM

I agree ...we made our choice when we signed DWILL to that enormous contract.I guess the question is could we have paid Dwill in a manner to keep both? and the 2nd question should we have let Dwill go and kept the younger Stewart?


I think we talked to both last year when we made the contract to Williams. From what has been rumored, Stewart didn't want to negotiate. Why would we have let Williams go when Stewart wasn't even willing to discuss contract terms? I still think we can keep both of them.

#30 DeAngelo's #1 Fan(CRA)

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:11 AM

20 million is way overstated. we will spend 13 million this year and likely 15 million next year assuming we keep all three. If we can't afford them next year, we can't afford them this year either,


Stewart is on the last year of a rookie deal. Affording him this year and next aren't the same.

This year, Stewart is cheap and the best RB on the roster. Would be dumb to trade him pending a team didn't offer something crazy for him. Get what we can out of him this year.... No reason not to


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