kungfoodude

And, similar to in LA....Goff was a big reason they lost the NFC championship game. That's going to be Goff's rep until he proves he isn't gonna choke on the big stage.

It goes beyond the QB, as well. He has to prove that he can put together anything resembling a competent offseason. So far, we don't know if that has happened or not. I remember the early Fitt years and the "in on every deal" BS. I also saw how that ended up working out. Color me EXTREMELY skeptical of Dan Morgan the GM until he shows me something worth trusting.

Most of their scrubs from then would be in our current two deep, if not a healthy chunk starting. Do yourself a favor and look at the 2021 Lions. Literally almost every single starter on offense there would be the starter here immediately. At least a few of the defenders would be too. That's what I am saying. We aren't there yet. We have some more successful offseasons ahead of us to be where they were in 2021. Believe me, I fuging wish that was the shape we were in.

Well I mean, who would trust someone like Proehl to scout NFL WR's? That guy doesn't know anything about that. Gettlemen is the smartest guy in the room, just ask him.

You might want to take a gander at the Lions when Campbell got there. Any of us would kill to have that roster. I would say we are closer to the 2014/2015 Browns. That's more likely the trajectory that we are on in terms of rebuilding. The timeline is about right, IMO.

The one thing I will give credit to Fitterer for is that the Hurney vs. Gettleman arguments are forever retired. Our worst GM in team history is cemented at this point. No argument to be made against him.

I think even so our coaching staff shooting themselves in the foot was the bigger factor. Do I believe this went to script for the NFL? Absolutely.

IF we didn't make a bunch of bad roster decisions in this past offseason/draft it's conceivable it could take as little as 3-4 years to rebuild a top 12 caliber NFL roster. I think a lot of us are not appreciating how unholy bad this roster is, especially when you get past the starters. Additionally, look at the roster and who would even still be here in 3-4 years. It's more holes than core members. This is why any hope of building a lasting and GOOD roster are future hopes. It will take years of good drafting and solid FA moves to build something like that. You all watched the horrifying drafts, epic free agency blunders and terrible trades/wasted resources from trades over the past few years. This is the cost. We aren't magically going to conjure up a good roster from that kind of poo. But we have to know it's actually STARTED first and that remains to be seen. Otherwise we are still floundering around waiting for an actual rebuild to start.

You know, normally I would agree but this roster is so fuging bad I might be inclined to try and build the team first. Of course, that requires a competent FO and we haven't proven that is there yet.

Are you talking about broken Cam or alternate universe healthy Cam? Because the latter means we never are in position to take Fields in the first place, nor would need to. Secondly, IF Fields could be developed(I am not convinced of that) would we be able to develop him? I rather doubt it. No one here developed Cam effectively. Cam was Cam from day one and he learned on the job. The improvements(which he needed) didn't come until far later in his career and seemed to be self initiated rather than franchise initiated.

Yep. The warning signs were there. And even having a HOF QB didn't matter. He was the worst stsrting QB in the NFL that season and played terrible. It was our game to lose and we fuging lost. That's one I will never forgive Ron & Co. for.

IMO, 2015 was more so. The Broncos were so clearly the worst team we had played all postseason. Then Rivera and Co. decided to fug the pooch as hard as possible.

Yeah, that violates a long running rule I have. Never buy a jersey until the player gets their second contract.

Yep. A win in 2003 or 2015 woukd have forgiven a lot but alas, here we are.

Anyone else doing a full Panthers merch boycott? I am sticking with that until Tepper is gone or he proves to not be a fuging idiot.

Yeah, I started noticing a trend when I was tabulating and thought, "surely not." Whelp....

100% agree. If the "preseason" or camp was at fault then we would suck early and then get better late. If we maintain the same level of suckitude the entire year, that's a pretty safe bet that it was coming no matter what. People are just putting the cart before the horse here. We have 17 games to watch this nonsense and bitch. Everyone needs to chill out for a couple more weeks. But, you know.....maybe this is the Huddle in preseason form too? This could be Huddlers getting their reps in for the regular season. You know what, I have reversed course. This is good practice. Bitch away.

If that happens, the "Fire Dan" train will be at high speed in mere seconds.

I have always considered he and Jake as 2A and 2B in Panthers history. I was a big fan of his and wish we had gotten him earlier in his career.

I personally don't think there is much debate between Cam/Jake. Jake, although beloved had many roster benefits that Cam didn't enjoy. Cam was on track to a HOF career and we really can't say that about Jake. Plus if you go best versus best, Cam's 2015 MVP season is something we will likely never experience again(sadly). Jake had an amazing career arc, however. Still will be a beloved player.

I know a lot of people got wildly fixated on BC as a starter but I have always maintained and believe that his true value is a OT/OG high caliber backup. This is where he really helps the team out most.

I don’t think you are allowed to call a ginger "Rusty."

I don’t think making any of those moves would have mattered at all. Remember that the one thing that wouldn't have changed it the idiots coaching, idiots making FO decisions and the idiot owning the team. This is why I don't get too invested in the "what ifs" under Tepper. This mess starts at the top.

I don't really think there is any danger of our starters looking comfortable, so that seems like an unfounded worry.