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Al Bundy

Hines Ward or Steve Smith? Tired of seeing this garbage, to smack wih you

398 posts in this topic

*Sigh*

From one Website. Surely you can do better?

And lol at "top XX" lists.

Translation: "You totally destroyed my arguement and I have nothing else to say therefore Im going to attack the link you have provided instead."

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Hines has had Rapemoreburger and Tommy Maddox throwing the ball.

Smith has had Delhomme throwing the ball.

Smith has done more with much less.

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LOL, if numbers aren't important why do you keep talking about the NUMBER of Smiths fumbles, or the NUMBER of 1000 yard seasons Ward has. It seems the numbers only matter when they are in Wards favor.

You ain't just on Wards dick, you're having his baby.

Just throwing out "fun facts"... as stated in the post. Until monster, no one was able to say anything other than SMITH GOTS DEM SPEEDS.

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Hines has had Rapemoreburger and Tommy Maddox throwing the ball.

Smith has had Delhomme throwing the ball.

Smith has done more with much less.

LOL. Tommy Maddox. Because he was a great quarterback. -_-

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Zero. Because I don't have to.

You need to dig up information to make a point. My points are widely known.

OK, #1, you asked for analysts' opinions. How do you expect me to give you an analyst's opinion if I don't dig up information?

#2, I linked to one website because I had to weed through page after page of analysts talking about Muhsin Muhammad not returning to Carolina and Brandon Lafell being a good WR to replace him. I chose not to use webpages from back when Moose was in his prime.

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OK, #1, you asked for analysts' opinions.

I.. did? :confused:

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LOL. Tommy Maddox. Because he was a great quarterback. -_-

So basically you want to argue opinions endlessly. One person has already brought your argument to the ground yet you linger like a bad fart to argue the minor points.

Shoo away newb.

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LOL, if numbers aren't important why do you keep talking about the NUMBER of Smiths fumbles, or the NUMBER of 1000 yard seasons Ward has. It seems the numbers only matter when they are in Wards favor.

You ain't just on Wards dick, you're having his baby.

He's been having it both ways for the entire thread.

His best 'evidence' are these completely subjective statements.

He talks about Ward being surrounded by talent and then disregards what that means for coverage schemes. He talks about numbers of fumbles and then disregards how many were lost based on the ratio to catches. Talks about how their o-line hurts their passing game and disregards Jake's ability as a hindrance to Smith's success.

This was a stupid argument when he started it.

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Fantastic post, Monster!

Finally, one of you were able to bring out a LEGITIMATE argument. :hurray:

But.. you brought in numbers. In the OP, I stated that "this isn't about numbers".

Ward is capable of more than his numbers show. He has constantly had talent around him that take away from his numbers. If he were the only guy, his ability would show in his numbers. Smith has been the only legitimate receiver the Panthers have had for quite some time. So, that makes his numbers shine a bit more. But in the same breath, Ward puts up equal numbers, while being surrounded by big time play makers.

That is why I believe Ward packs more ability. If he didn't have others hogging the light, he'd shine.

I have news for you. 'Numbers' are the recording facts of what a player is doing in the game. If you disregard what they have actually done and merely hypothesise about what they COULD do, based on a completely subjective and unknown commodity in their 'ability', then you can argue JaMarcus Russell is the most naturally gifted quarterback in the league.

You asked who has the most ability, I answered. I even broke it down into sections

Athletic ability = Smith

Mental ability = Equal

Technical ability (hands/fumbles/blocking) = Equal

So you have gone from beating the dead horse about the fumbling issues to deciding Smith has been the only legitimate receiver on the Panthers, whereas Ward has had a supporting cast. Considering that, I want you to answer the following question.

What other receivers has Ward had?

Bare in mind that Smith has had Proehl, Muhammad, Johnson and a couple of productive seasons from Carter.

Holmes has put up steady number 2 numbers which were eclipsed regularly by Muhammad until this last year. Randall El did no more than 40 catches a season. I honestly can't think of too many more...

However, that is all pointless. You are arguing about 'what could have been' with Ward and in the same breath dismissing the better things Smith has actually achieved, which is completely backward logic. Here is a different spin on Smith's situation. How much more damage could he do if there was a consistent young threat opposite him? Or how about giving Smith a QB of Roethlisbergers calibre?

See? It's easy to make arguments based on things that could have happened. However, all we can actually do is judge this on what both receivers have actually done in their careers. When you do that, Smith wins.

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He talks about Ward being surrounded by talent and then disregards what that means for coverage schemes.

When were coverage schemes mentioned?

He talks about numbers of fumbles and then disregards how many were lost based on the ratio to catches.

Yeah? Where? Exactly. I disregarded the lost because they can't control that. Go back and read that post...

Talks about how their o-line hurts their passing game and disregards Jake's ability as a hindrance to Smith's success.

Yeah? Where? Exactly. Jake has taken his team to the Super Bowl. Yet it's ok to bring up Tommy fuging Maddox?

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