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#11 Matt Foley

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 10:40 AM

So who is worse, Lyndon Johnson or GWB?


Or Jimmy Carter?

#12 Jase

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 10:41 AM

Finally the country gets to pull the handle and flush away the worst president in a generation, so we can drop a new, freshly polished turd in there.


:conehead:

#13 Kevin Greene

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 10:44 AM

Come on economy!

#14 Davidson Deac II

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 10:56 AM

Or Jimmy Carter?


I was only using presidents that got us into unpopular and costly wars. :)

#15 cookinwithgas

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 10:57 AM

Well Jimmy didn't start any stupid wars. He inherited a terrible economy from a lame duck presidential replacement and did not do much to help (my position is that the President can't control this too much anyways), and to his credit brought Israel and Egypt to the table, something that no other President has had as much success at.

Johnson did a lot of bad things (Vietnam escalation) but also did a lot of good things (equal rights). At least he had the humanity to realize that his Vietnam decision was wrong and it caused him a lot of anguish later on.

Dubyas choice to go into Afganistan (his best decision maybe), IMHO, would have been the course of action of any person sitting in that chair. Economically he had no problem with cutting taxes without cutting spending, led us into massive debt and refused to check it, added a gigantic unneeded war, and then kind of retreated into a shell during the election cycle. He was in fact a terrible leader, relied on people more interested in conservative dogma than practical reality, and IMHO used the highest office in the land to prove himself to his daddy.

People don't seem to remember that Reagan won because he made a deal with the religious right - something that the Republicans were not interested in before, as republican "free choice" ideology does not work well with far right Christian "do as we say!" attitudes on many subjects. Dogmatism in the Republican party led to the same on the left, which explains the complete polarization of the parties, despite their both really being in the middle on most subjects, that we see today.

Bush is the ultimate representation of the Reagan sell out philosophy based on "the good old days" that never really existed - he wore his contradictions on his sleeve and people could finally figure out that they didn't make a lot of sense. Now the Republicans are trying to "reinvent themselves" which I am all in favor of - dump the moral high ground crap, become more Libertarian, and embrace the issues of the people that will be the majority by the end of the century if you want to provide a true counterpoint to the Democrats, as sheer numbers will continue to roll in their direction and will cause them to get complacent and further away from what the people may actually want.

#16 Davidson Deac II

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 11:04 AM

Bush did some good things outside of Afghanistan.

Africa Aid

The president has tripled direct humanitarian and development aid to the world's most impoverished continent since taking office and recently vowed to double that increased amount by 2010 -- to nearly $9 billion


Although some activists criticize Bush for not doing more to end the ongoing genocide in the Darfur region of Sudan, others credit him for playing a role in ending deadly conflicts in Liberia, the Congo and other parts of Sudan. Meanwhile, Bush has overseen a steady rise in U.S. trade with Africa, which has doubled since 2001.


Bush launched his $1.2 billion malaria initiative in June 2005 with the goal of reducing malaria-related deaths in 15 African countries by 50 percent. The disease kills more than 1 million people a year, most of them African children under age 5.


The number of lives Bush has been responsible for saving in Africa is probably greater than the number of casualties from the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.

I still don't like him, but I do feel he deserves credit for the good things he did.

Edited by Davidson Deac II, 19 January 2009 - 11:07 AM.


#17 Delhommey

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 11:06 AM

On what planet could LBJ be considered worse than Bush?

#18 Davidson Deac II

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 11:11 AM

On what planet could LBJ be considered worse than Bush?


Well, the primary criticism of Bush is based on Iraq, and getting us into the war on false pretenses. LBJ escalated our involvement in a far bloodier war in Vietnam also based on false pretenses. So imo, its a valid comparison.

#19 Davidson Deac II

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 11:16 AM

Also, with all our losses in Vietnam we accomplished nothing except for delaying the inevitable North Vietnam victory. In Iraq, there is now a stable functioning government that might actually last.

#20 mmmbeans

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 11:30 AM

The number of lives Bush has been responsible for saving in Africa is probably greater than the number of casualties from the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.


it's unfortunate that he could never figure out how to save peoples lives without killing others.