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Should we keep Rivera for another Season?


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#1 Doc Holiday

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:10 PM

I know what you're thinking already "this guy is out of his mind" and sometimes you would be correct. but hear me out on this.

I'm arguing that the Coaches aren't the issue

First think what is wrong with the Panthers

Offense:
1)O-line
2)Receiving options.
3)Running game

Unlike some in the National media I don't think Cam has had quite that bad of a season, now there have been a few games here and there but nothing outside of the Normal growing pains of a QB in the NFL.

The Offenses biggest issue this season have been the Offensive line, it wasn't playing great this season and then we went and lost our all-pro center Ryan Kalil, and since to say they have played badly would be an monumental understatement. they have been horrible in run blocking and almost just as bad in Pass blocking, I think if we had a less mobile QB you would understand better just how badly they have played this season. If you want to know why we have not had a running game this season, they are it.

Receiving Core: what do we have? Smith, while still decent isn't a #1 threat anymore, and LaFell is a solid #2 but not #1 material, the only receiver with any exceptional skills is TE Greg Olsen with his size which by itself creates miss matches with defenders. This is where loosing Shockey hurt us most. Our WR's are neither exceptionally speedy or big which makes it difficult for them to get separation, add to that the O-line plays like crap meaning less time for Cam Newton to pass means less time for an already limited Receiving core to get separation.

Running game, the reason the Panthers have focused on switching to Stewart over D-Will is because of the Oline, no push, no lanes, Williams has always been known for making players miss, not breaking Tackles and thats why Stewart the sole Starter now.

The realization of just how bad the Offensive line is becomes just that much more astounding when you realize that we have been trying to game plan around it pretty much since our by week. the Shotgun snaps, multiple pump fakes and attempts at miss direction have all been to give Newton more time and try and get our WR's open.

The best example I can think of for this is the Denver Game, the Reason why Olsen had a really good game was because he was the only one the entire time constantly getting open.

Defense:

We have an emerging quality Defensive line, and a Solid LB'er core, the main issue is that our DB's are crap. what many have thought was the recent improvement by our Defensive backfield has been in large part due to Mr. Hardy and Mr. Johnson, two men that have been pulling more then their weight around here. a great pass rush in the DB's best friend and that's what has been going on here lately. there is only 1 DB that I would even Consider true NFL starter Quality playing right now and that's Charles Godfrey and even with that said he's middle of the road nothing special.

Special teams

the Special Teams coach was fired last week, and many here myself included think it was long over due. need I say more?

Coaching.

The Offense this year started out way to gimmicky and they for the most part put an end to that after the bye week.

Overall they have kept the offense manageable and the Defense has been on the up swing for a while now, only problem is our Horrible defensive backfield always tends to show up when we need it least at the end of games.

Here's my train of thought on this, the issues with the team are well known, and considering the issues with the Oline and DB's I think that our coaching have done a decent enough Job keeping us in games to win, it's not that far of a grasp to say that we shouldn't at least be sitting at 6-4 right now still in the playoff hunt with the easiest part of our schedule ahead of us. remember that Coaching can only go so far, and players still have to play the game.

And with that said outside of the Giants game I haven't really seen anything that I would say the Coaching staff just straight out blew or messed up. I think when you look at the team for what it is and not rose colored glasses you will see that.

#2 Sean Payton's Vicodin

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:12 PM

Short Answer: No
Long Answer: fug no

#3 Doc Holiday

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:17 PM

Short Answer: No
Long Answer: fug no

but why? what are they doing wrong that you would do different? saying no is easy, explaining it is something else.

#4 Baby Andy Reid

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:17 PM

1-11 in single score games. Yeah not the coaching.

#5 koolkatluke

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:17 PM

Short Answer: No
Long Answer: fug no


We have a winner.

#6 Cary Kollins

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:18 PM

No.

#7 Baby Andy Reid

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:19 PM

Every important decision at important times is the wrong one. They are a day late and a dollar short everytime. One mistake is correct THE NEXT TIME but in a different situation

#8 Doc Holiday

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:20 PM

1-11 in single score games. Yeah not the coaching.

ok, the game is close you have 2 minutes to go and you need to score to send the game into over time or win.

What are you going to do? rush the ball? hell no you are going to pass it you don't have time to rush the ball.

see where I'm going?

it's all in the Defensive backfield being poo, which we've know for a while now.

#9 Doc Holiday

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:23 PM

Every important decision at important times is the wrong one. They are a day late and a dollar short everytime. One mistake is correct THE NEXT TIME but in a different situation

when, where, what? general statement. give me something to argue with

#10 Baby Andy Reid

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:23 PM

Ummm most times we have been ahead and cant close not we cant come from behind. I feel like our qb has failed there but can be taught. Ron is not the guy to teach him.

#11 Sean Payton's Vicodin

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:23 PM

but why? what are they doing wrong that you would do different? saying no is easy, explaining it is something else.


Coaches have won more, with less. Talent wise, we are about on par with some .500 teams. Rivera has shown absolutely no improvement since the Arizona game last year. He cannot adjust and is a choker. We have been in multiple games this year, only to have Mo Ron blow it in the end. Look at the Colts, their team was gutted and arguably have WORSE talent than us, but they are still in the playoff hunt.

This whole coaching staff has got to go. No one is happy, and the players do not like Rivera. They lost his trust.

#12 R0CKnR0LLA

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:27 PM

I know what you're thinking already "this guy is out of his mind" and sometimes you would be correct. but hear me out on this.

I'm arguing that the Coaches aren't the issue

First think what is wrong with the Panthers

Offense:
1)O-line
2)Receiving options.
3)Running game

Unlike some in the National media I don't think Cam has had quite that bad of a season, now there have been a few games here and there but nothing outside of the Normal growing pains of a QB in the NFL.

The Offenses biggest issue this season have been the Offensive line, it wasn't playing great this season and then we went and lost our all-pro center Ryan Kalil, and since to say they have played badly would be an monumental understatement. they have been horrible in run blocking and almost just as bad in Pass blocking, I think if we had a less mobile QB you would understand better just how badly they have played this season. If you want to know why we have not had a running game this season, they are it.

Receiving Core: what do we have? Smith, while still decent isn't a #1 threat anymore, and LaFell is a solid #2 but not #1 material, the only receiver with any exceptional skills is TE Greg Olsen with his size which by itself creates miss matches with defenders. This is where loosing Shockey hurt us most. Our WR's are neither exceptionally speedy or big which makes it difficult for them to get separation, add to that the O-line plays like crap meaning less time for Cam Newton to pass means less time for an already limited Receiving core to get separation.

Running game, the reason the Panthers have focused on switching to Stewart over D-Will is because of the Oline, no push, no lanes, Williams has always been known for making players miss, not breaking Tackles and thats why Stewart the sole Starter now.

The realization of just how bad the Offensive line is becomes just that much more astounding when you realize that we have been trying to game plan around it pretty much since our by week. the Shotgun snaps, multiple pump fakes and attempts at miss direction have all been to give Newton more time and try and get our WR's open.

The best example I can think of for this is the Denver Game, the Reason why Olsen had a really good game was because he was the only one the entire time constantly getting open.

Defense:

We have an emerging quality Defensive line, and a Solid LB'er core, the main issue is that our DB's are crap. what many have thought was the recent improvement by our Defensive backfield has been in large part due to Mr. Hardy and Mr. Johnson, two men that have been pulling more then their weight around here. a great pass rush in the DB's best friend and that's what has been going on here lately. there is only 1 DB that I would even Consider true NFL starter Quality playing right now and that's Charles Godfrey and even with that said he's middle of the road nothing special.

Special teams

the Special Teams coach was fired last week, and many here myself included think it was long over due. need I say more?

Coaching.

The Offense this year started out way to gimmicky and they for the most part put an end to that after the bye week.

Overall they have kept the offense manageable and the Defense has been on the up swing for a while now, only problem is our Horrible defensive backfield always tends to show up when we need it least at the end of games.

Here's my train of thought on this, the issues with the team are well known, and considering the issues with the Oline and DB's I think that our coaching have done a decent enough Job keeping us in games to win, it's not that far of a grasp to say that we shouldn't at least be sitting at 6-4 right now still in the playoff hunt with the easiest part of our schedule ahead of us. remember that Coaching can only go so far, and players still have to play the game.

And with that said outside of the Giants game I haven't really seen anything that I would say the Coaching staff just straight out blew or messed up. I think when you look at the team for what it is and not rose colored glasses you will see that.



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#13 TheRed

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:30 PM

Even if you ignore all our pissed away games in the 4th qtr this season, you've gotta remember last year too. Not to even mention all his bone headed and recurring mismanagement of the clock and making adjustments in game. It's the same poo from last season, and we have regressed under his watch. He's not the guy, plain and simple.

#14 Doc Holiday

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:31 PM

Coaches have won more, with less. Talent wise, we are about on par with some .500 teams. Rivera has shown absolutely no improvement since the Arizona game last year. He cannot adjust and is a choker. We have been in multiple games this year, only to have Mo Ron blow it in the end. Look at the Colts, their team was gutted and arguably have WORSE talent than us, but they are still in the playoff hunt.

This whole coaching staff has got to go. No one is happy, and the players do not like Rivera. They lost his trust.

Colts are playing inspired football for their coach and probably played the easiest Schedule in the NFL so far while we have played one of the Hardest. it flips from here out though, theirs gets a lot harder and ours has been getting easier, I bet you are going to see them get a rude awakening.

I think our talent is that on pare with a .500 team right now I would agree with that. but our schedule has been horrific only 2 teams below .500 in the first 10 games.

#15 Baby Andy Reid

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 03:33 PM

Lets see. Atl. Cam rush on third and 1 easily gets the first down but fumbles. Instead of going 4th and one we punt.

We have murdered ryan all game. Hes on the one yard line. We put no pressure on him. Let him sit back and launch a duck. Ok seemingly ok. Except we have a 5'4 safety playing 30 yards off that still lets a wr behind him then miss times his jump. This is the time for a systematic 10 yard at a time pass defense there was one minute and no time outs.

Then bears 2:30 left and now we play defense like we should have played against the falcons.

These two losses end our season and rons career.

He doesnt understand end of game situations.


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