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Sammy Watkins, 2014.


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#46 DaCityKats

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 12:45 PM

i guess we are just going to keep pushing back the need to find a WR.nobody knows if anybody out of this last class will turn into a #1 WR, but that should have no way stopped you from picking one. AJ Green types dont last outside of the top 10, so the only way the panthers are going to draft a Watkins or Lee is if they have a pick in the top 10.



#47 panthers55

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 02:41 PM

you can say that about any position except maybe guard.
 
sure things don't get out of the top 10 unless you are really lucky.
 
you say "project to be a number 1" but the standard that people arguing against drafting one have been using is the incredibly rare types like megatron and aj green. they don't have to be that caliber to be a number one. you should get the best player possible, but you should also be realistic out the expectations for the guy you draft mid to late first round. you may want elite talent. they may wind up being elite talent. but you don't not draft someone because they aren't assured of being elite talent. you want the best players you can get, but the later you pick in the draft, the less of a sure thing they are and the lower the ceiling might be. if you need someone to come in and take over that top spot, you don't sit around and wait for that sure thing and if you want to try and answer that need you don't take a timid approach and take low risk high reward guys hoping that you'll luck out with one. if it's  important to find that guy you understand that you might have to take a risk...esp. if you don't have a very early pick.


Again I am not at all saying I am against picking a receiver. I am saying that given who was there and our needs, I think that picking Star was a no brainer and picking Short will help the team more this year than picking a wide receiver or a defensive back in the second. Frankly I figured we would go WR/DB and said as much in my predictions. I would all for taking a wide receiver next year in the first if there is a guy who we think can be a number 1. I personally didn't see any receivers at number 44 who would be appreciably better than LaFell or Hixon if he holds up physically. But clearly Star will be better than whoever we had at nose tackle last year, if not this year then next. If we had a third rounder this year, that is where I would looked for DB or WR in this draft. Each year is different though.

#48 panthers55

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 02:43 PM

i guess we are just going to keep pushing back the need to find a WR.nobody knows if anybody out of this last class will turn into a #1 WR, but that should have no way stopped you from picking one. AJ Green types dont last outside of the top 10, so the only way the panthers are going to draft a Watkins or Lee is if they have a pick in the top 10.


If we had 7 or 8 picks I am sure we would have gotten one. But who from the 4th round on down would be better than LaFell or even Hixon? I am fine we went DT in the first and second.

#49 panthers55

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 02:48 PM

We were 14th!!! Against the run. That was better than 4 playoff teams including the Super Bowl champs. Hopkins is better than Lafell right now period so no he wouldn't have been 3rd or 4th. Star was a need Short was not.


How can a guy who has not even taken a snap in the NFL be better than a guy who has had 2 solid years in the league? Be serious.
As for Short, he was a big need. Edwards is 34 and can't hold up on every down. He needs to be spelled and Short is a great option. Both will rotate in and together make the 3 technique position very good. Short was a great value at a position of need. WR is not a position of need this year with all the guys we have brought in. It just isn't. I know all the down the road we need to replace Smitty and that is true. But with the cap problems and only 5 picks Gettleman plugged what he could and that was at DT. Next year might be completely different.

#50 DaCityKats

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 03:10 PM

If we had 7 or 8 picks I am sure we would have gotten one. But who from the 4th round on down would be better than LaFell or even Hixon? I am fine we went DT in the first and second.

 

the amount of picks should not determine what positions you pick. i have no problems with the DTs being picked in the 1st or 2nd, but several WRs could have came in competed i think with Hixon and LaFell. remember everybody was saying this class was not top heavy but deep.

Patton #128

King #161

Boyce #102

Harper #123

Swope #174

Wilson # 236

Stills #144

Mellette #238

 

just to name a few, could have pushed some of the WRs on this team.



#51 carolina-chuck

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 06:52 PM

Physicialy, Lee and Woods are on two planets. I hope he does fall.


Believe and it will happen.
Lee has a better chance to fall than Star, and Star fell all the way to 14. I just don't know how far Lee will fall. Probably not out of the top15. Let's hope we're not drafting that high.

#52 carolina-chuck

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 07:09 PM

the amount of picks should not determine what positions you pick. i have no problems with the DTs being picked in the 1st or 2nd, but several WRs could have came in competed i think with Hixon and LaFell. remember everybody was saying this class was not top heavy but deep.
Patton #128
King #161
Boyce #102
Harper #123
Swope #174
Wilson # 236
Stills #144
Mellette #238

just to name a few, could have pushed some of the WRs on this team.


I think or would had hope that it would have been Patton. Even though I like the Kugbila pick, if we had a 5th the panthers possibly could had taken Patton in the 4th and hoped that Kugbila was there in the 5th or took someone else. If we had a 7th, I think it would have been Robert Lester.

#53 carolina-chuck

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 07:10 PM

How can a guy who has not even taken a snap in the NFL be better than a guy who has had 2 solid years in the league? Be serious.
As for Short, he was a big need. Edwards is 34 and can't hold up on every down. He needs to be spelled and Short is a great option. Both will rotate in and together make the 3 technique position very good. Short was a great value at a position of need. WR is not a position of need this year with all the guys we have brought in. It just isn't. I know all the down the road we need to replace Smitty and that is true. But with the cap problems and only 5 picks Gettleman plugged what he could and that was at DT. Next year might be completely different.


Couldn't be said any better. Exactly how I feel.

#54 carolina-chuck

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 07:15 PM

Exactly and please lets not forget that ATL traded up to get Julio. I hate that sit back and take whoever is there mentality. I would have rather we traded back into the first round to get Hopkins then draft Short in the 2nd. Or at least trade into the 3rd to get Allen instead of going back to the fuging hotel room after drafting Short that poo is ridiculous.

Were you the dude who Gettleman blew off by asking him to give up a next year 1st for a 2nd this year?

How many time does Gettleman have to repeatedly say that he's not trading up in the draft for guys like you to understand?

#55 wwgd

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 08:58 PM

As much as I'd like Lee or Watkins on the team, I pray to God we aren't in position to draft them.



#56 panthers55

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 10:03 PM

the amount of picks should not determine what positions you pick. i have no problems with the DTs being picked in the 1st or 2nd, but several WRs could have came in competed i think with Hixon and LaFell. remember everybody was saying this class was not top heavy but deep.

Patton #128

King #161

Boyce #102

Harper #123

Swope #174

Wilson # 236

Stills #144

Mellette #238

 

just to name a few, could have pushed some of the WRs on this team.

One question.  When if ever have we developed a 4th round receiver or lower into a player who was better than LaFell??  In 17 years I can think of none. But we should have ignored the offensive line and put our eggs in the WR basket.

 

Got it!!!!



#57 carolina-chuck

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 11:03 PM

One question. When if ever have we developed a 4th round receiver or lower into a player who was better than LaFell?? In 17 years I can think of none. But we should have ignored the offensive line and put our eggs in the WR basket.

Got it!!!!

I would have hated to add another late round receivers.

If we needed a receiver in the later rounds, we mind as well just signed UDFA. They probably have a better success rate in the NFL than guys taken in the late rounds. :)

#58 DaCityKats

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 08:46 AM

One question.  When if ever have we developed a 4th round receiver or lower into a player who was better than LaFell??  In 17 years I can think of none. But we should have ignored the offensive line and put our eggs in the WR basket.

 

Got it!!!!

so since it hasnt been done we should keep ignoring? developing players is apart of coaching, so how does that speak about this team. again this class was considered deep, and you could have found guys later in the draft that could contribute.



#59 panthers55

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 09:11 AM

so since it hasnt been done we should keep ignoring? developing players is apart of coaching, so how does that speak about this team. again this class was considered deep, and you could have found guys later in the draft that could contribute.

 

You miss my point as usual.  Why try to develop a 4th or 5th rounder into a starter when we are not good at it and there are plug and play players at other positions who we do have better success developing at positions of bigger immediate need?  Gettleman is fine with who we brought in at wide receiver.  Wiith GInn and Hixon as well as LaFell and Smith we have the plenty of guys who will have big roles as well as plenty of developmental guys already here. Deep doesn't mean they are better than what we have already.  It means that there are lots of guy with similar talent all through the draft. It also doesn't mean any of them will develop into starters although they could in time.  Time Rivera doesn't have.

We didn't go wide receiver and went another direction. Next year we might go WR in the first 2 rounds like we did DT this year. How many more pages are you going to keep arguing when it is a moot point.  You keep beating a dead horse. They didn't feel a need to pull the trigger on a WR.  Lets see how it works out before arguing another 10 pages. 



#60 DaCityKats

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 01:51 PM

You miss my point as usual.  Why try to develop a 4th or 5th rounder into a starter when we are not good at it and there are plug and play players at other positions who we do have better success developing at positions of bigger immediate need?  Gettleman is fine with who we brought in at wide receiver.  Wiith GInn and Hixon as well as LaFell and Smith we have the plenty of guys who will have big roles as well as plenty of developmental guys already here. Deep doesn't mean they are better than what we have already.  It means that there are lots of guy with similar talent all through the draft. It also doesn't mean any of them will develop into starters although they could in time.  Time Rivera doesn't have.

We didn't go wide receiver and went another direction. Next year we might go WR in the first 2 rounds like we did DT this year. How many more pages are you going to keep arguing when it is a moot point.  You keep beating a dead horse. They didn't feel a need to pull the trigger on a WR.  Lets see how it works out before arguing another 10 pages. 

 

i see your point but i just dont agree with it. big difference in that and not getting it. again we do not know if those guys are better then Hixon, Ginn, or LaFell, so that should not have played a role in not selecting a player. Again i am cool with going with 2 DTs this year, but to keep a blind eye at certain positions is what the last GM did, and we seen how that ended. This team is not built to compete with the playoff teams.

 

im not arguing with you, you responded to me. i think one thing, while you do not.
 




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