I think a lot of you must have got smacked in the head with two-by-fours growing up. Cam has 1 game of missing a few more than usual deep throws and everyone nows says "OMG, HE'S NOT EVEN MAKING BASIC THROWS!!!! WTF!!! MECHANIX SUXORS!!!!!"
When you factor in drops he is currently 3/9 on deep passes this year, and yet you all act like that tiny sample size is indicative of anything but your own ignorance.
Hardy has disappeared.
Olsen is as good as we thought he would be, not better.
Gamble, no comment.
Johnson, I will give you.
Kuechly, not buying it, he got better with position change, not coaching.
Star, previously projected #1 doing well? Kind of expected.
Me and you 'till the end FP but I want to see discernible improvement, not improvement that can be possibly attributed to a human being being one year older.
I will let it go, you win.
Rivera and staff are doing well. I just don't see it.
The one area I'm really wondering where the heck the coaching staff has been is the offensive line. Bell took a small step forward last year but has looked almost as bad as his rookie self this year. Silatolu made strides late last season and now seems to have fallen off, Gross has continued to decline (to be expected with age) and Hangartner was a weak link that got cut and now is probably being begged to return. I can understand the secondary being abysmal because the talent back there is just not on par with the rest of the league, and as a whole the front seven has improved from its atrocious state in 2011 (even if a lot can be attributed to talent and not coaching) but the offensive line just seems to have dissipated.
And Cosell is absolutely correct. Which is the whole point on the emphasis on having Cam play more from the pocket. You don't become a more precise quarterback by running around all the time, you do it by making throws downfield.
What you are saying is that Cam hasn't progressed at all from his rookie year or not as far as you would think he should. What I am saying is that your expectations are not realistic even for an elite QB like Peyton, whose mechanics still elude him from time to time, particularly on unscripted throws where he's not working from muscle memory. And you're not recognizing the reality that's Cam has actually made huge strides compared to his rookie season, even if he has occasional lapses into the playground-style of play that both hinders him but also makes him special. It's not that we should try to shoehorn Cam into a Peyton Manning type of passer, but that we don't hold him back from his full potential by letting him run around like Brett Favre and rely on sheer talent to make plays. But 2013 Cam can actually take a seven-step dropback without looking like the flailing gazelle that embodied 2011 Cam, and will look off a safety or give a little pump fake before targeting the other half of the field, and not sidearm passes for no good reason. There's ample progress, he just goes through phases of growth and mild regression, and the Buffalo game over-accentuated it because he was being asked to go deep too often, as if a team can really split deep balls between two separate games to make up for the lack of downfield throws the week before. The indecisiveness I'm seeing from Cam right now seems driven more by the fact that he is trying to avoid mistakes (and therefore leading him open to getting read by defenders like Alonso did) than an inability to read the play. As he loosens up and gets more comfortable with the new scheme I think he'll do very well.
Aristotle he ain't, I will agree. My whole point was, where is the progression? Where is the evidence of any coaching whatsoever? Where is the progression on this team at any position?
Name any player at any position that appears to have progressed because of coaching on this team during the Rivera era AND BEFORE YOU GUYS GET ON THAT BANDWAGON, Kuechly progressed because he was "forced" into his natural position. Coaching has nothing to do with Kuechly.
Every player we have is treading water or regressing. No one appears to be making strides and that includes the WR Corps so I will also step on the toes of our sacred cow, Mr. Proehl also.
Coaches...........do your damn job! For most of you, you waited too late.
Hopefully Morrison and Gettleman can fix this moving forward.
Hardy (even though he has been MIA of late) definitely progressed under Rivera. Olsen is playing better than he ever did with the Bears. Gamble had one of his best seasons in 2011 under Rivera. Johnson posted his best season under Rivera. And it's not fair to separate Kuechly from the coaching when the whole defensive scheme has been built around him since he made the move to MLB. And Star has shown almost none of the typical rookie struggles, which is almost unheard of for a DT. And I wouldn't say that Cam has regressed so much as he has been put into a system that may hold him back initially but allow him to succeed better long-term if it can instill more consistent habits. Everyone here may dislike the new "pocket passer" Cam but the fact is that the game will always be played first and foremost from the pocket, so he must acclimate himself to it.
Kirwin is not the expert on quarterbacks, he focuses on what he knows which is being a GM, the cap, play calls, Xs and Os and overall dynamics of the team but I am sure you know that if you talked to him. When Tim Ryan was there he deferred to him on line issues and specifics on player technique which was Ryan's specialty. He defers to Miller on quarterback specifics such as we are talking about. It doesn't mean Pat doesn't understand those things simply that he tries and stays within his areas of expertise.
I have never said he couldn't have good mechanics or was unable to read defenses simply that he still struggles with basics which he should have mastered long ago. As to why he hasn't, I haven't a clue.
Your first indication that you really don't understand quarterbacking is with the statement "should have mastered long ago." No one "masters" quarterback play. Hell, watch Peyton Manning, after his many years in the league, throw a brain dead pass right to a defender in last year's Denver playoff loss that basically killed their season. QBs are constantly making poor decisions, misreading coverages, throwing off their back foot, overthrowing and underthrowing receivers, etc. The best simply limit their mistakes to a minimum, and this is a process that takes lots of time and practice. I get immensely frustrated at Cam's poor footwork but I would be really worried if he never had another bad dropback again because that would mean he was paying more attention to his feet than the actual play. It's always going to be a cyclical process, and as long as he continues to steadily improve (and so far he's really seemed to make strides in cutting down on his spates of turnovers) than he'll be fine.
Again why so defensive. Sure he sometimes anticipates receivers but the knock on him since the combine is that he has always struggled to anticipate where receivers would be and waited to throw to them once they get open.
Besides this is not my analysis but guys like Miller and Kirwin who watch film and analyze players all the time. In fact Kirwin has written a book called take your eye off the ball. A very good ball many here could benefit from immensely.
I own the book, and have talked with Kirwan on several occasions. He was worried about Cam's play not because he doesn't feel Cam couldn't do these things but because he's worried the offensive struggles are affecting other areas of Cam's game because he's focusing too much on his decision-making at the expense of reaction.
What part? That he doesn't hold the ball longer than any other quarterback? That was a fact in 2012. Doubt it has changed. That he doesn't throw off his back foot sometimes even when not pressured? Watch him. He uses mostly arm and will often throw without moving his feet or stepping into the throw at all. That he holds the ball until he feels pressured forcing him to throw off his back foot? That seems self evident.
Truth is that he is slow to recognize defenses and has trouble knowing where to throw it until the receiver is wide open.
Every claim you have made is incongruent with the most basic of film study. Does he have struggles of some sort from play to play? Yes. But it's not always and a lot of times it's a miracle he can even make the plays he does make.
Why take a timeout and give the Bills free time to decide on a play when they're the ones playing against the clock? And how are the coaches supposed to know that Norman didn't understand what Moore clearly indicated to him? It was only after the game was over that Norman claimed to have not gotten a signal while the rest of the defense was like "WTF, you were right there!"