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OneBadCat

2003 Panthers vs 2015 Panthers

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1 hour ago, cptx said:

its all about matchups and not simply numbers. the 15 team had a tendency to let teams make it close in the 2nd half and I think 03 team could have taken advantage of that. 03 team scraped and clawed their way to sb 38 and i think it affected the way the game unfolded. 15 team got punched in the mouth and never recovered.

Sure thing. I could say the same thing about Cotchery's overrule, our 4 turnovers and all the bad calls. It was a 6 point game until the last fumble with 4 minutes left and we had 2 possessions down 6 to take the lead before the fumble. It was a close game even though we played like crap and the refs fuged us.

The numbers don't lie. We were the most dominant team all year and lost the SB just like the 2003 team did. Also, yes, some close games, but every team has them and more. It's almost like a 49-15 NFC Championship win over a very good team is a bad thing. 

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2 minutes ago, dave-o said:

Its crazy that San Fran was in our division back then...  Seems like we had their number too....

I don’t think most remember just how good the teams were that we beat to get a first round bye, Steve young with Terrell Owens and company,.then dominant Dallas with Troy, Emmitt, Dion,.. 

All hall of fame.

Brett Favre MVP, Reggie White, And Lambeau were what it took to stop the 1996 team. 
 

and again, 2nd year expansion team,.. the impossible made possible,..

99% of Carolina fans are not Carolina fans without that season and the “Dom-inating” Defense, Howard Griffith, Mark Carrier, Anthony Johnson, Kevin Green, the Rocket and the bunch,..

pioneer badasses

 

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4 minutes ago, JARROD said:

The 1996 team beat Steve Young’s 49ers who were all but unstoppable 2 times,.. probably cost them the Super Bowl that year since they didn’t get a bye and had to play Green Bay in Lambeau. Not many remember just how good those teams were

Oh i def agree with you there. not really tryna poo on the 96 team at all. as far as fun seasons as a whole they would be top of my list. the first year they played in the new stadium and won every game at home, it was magical. honestly if we are doing winning seasons and not just SB years id say 96, 03, 05/08, 15 in that order.

15 was a monster year willed into existence by QB1 and that defense, but something was just off about it and i think that it was ron fkn rivera. we always seems to jump out to a nice lead then let the other team back into it and end with a score that was way closer than it ever should have been . I feel like all of the tests that the 03 team faced, along with that mid-season slump prepared them for the SB and it showed on the field. I almost feel like that 15 squad walked into the SB expecting to win and just didnt know how to recover from being handled. the coaching just killed them. 

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Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, cptx said:

Oh i def agree with you there. not really tryna poo on the 96 team at all. as far as fun seasons as a whole they would be top of my list. the first year they played in the new stadium and won every game at home, it was magical. honestly if we are doing winning seasons and not just SB years id say 96, 03, 05/08, 15 in that order.

15 was a monster year willed into existence by QB1 and that defense, but something was just off about it and i think that it was ron fkn rivera. we always seems to jump out to a nice lead then let the other team back into it and end with a score that was way closer than it ever should have been . I feel like all of the tests that the 03 team faced, along with that mid-season slump prepared them for the SB and it showed on the field. I almost feel like that 15 squad walked into the SB expecting to win and just didnt know how to recover from being handled. the coaching just killed them. 

Well in the 2015 defense,... like someone else said, we were fighting refs,.. NFL was not going to allow Peyton Manning to exit without a Super Bowl.

that last fumble was the game much like John Kasays kick(although in his defense the defense did have a chance to shut them down for overtime).

that team was also fighting refs— the Patriots were over using and abusing the 10 yard rule back then... something that eventually caused it to be 5 yards FB feather touching.

the 2003 team though with Ricky Manning JR, Chris Jenkins, Moose and Steve Smith just had an attitude of not quitting. 

Personally,.. I believe the 2003 team wins on heart. If the 2015 team plays on 2003 rules... they have 10 yards to smash receivers? Steve Smith, Moose and Proehl versus Funchess and the bunch? Funchess and company would catch nothing because they would not have gotten off the line!!

Cam would have to make the difference and I don’t think he and Stewart overcome Stephen Davis and Foster when Cam can’t complete a forward pass and Jake can pass it to Moose and Steve,.. 

old rules were much more ruthless than new rules.
 

 

 

Edited by JARROD

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, SurvivalSloth said:

https://www.whatifsports.com/nfl/default.asp

This website allows you to simulate a game between those teams. So far the 2003 Panthers are waxing the 2015 Panthers.

You can do almost any sport and any time from any year and simulate a game between them.

Simulations are only as good as the nerds that create them. I know it’s the best we have but it’s totally ridiculous. How is a nerd with a joint in his hand supposed to understand the rule differences,..(probably the biggest part of the game), size and strength and athleticism of the players etc? The X factor that Cam, Steve Smith have?

but,.. just from observational belief,.. and what I posted about attitude and the rule differences I believe the 2003 team wins if they play by 2003 rules

2015 rules mean cam can pass successfully just like the 2003 team but who the hell thinks 2015 can stop the 2003 receivers if they can’t grab them under 10-11 yards like the Patriots we’re doing?

steve smith playing now would put up numbers no one has ever heard of.

But the 2003 corners played by the old rules too... Ricky Manning Jr would penalty his way to 2015 winning playing by modern rules for example.

so if 2015 plays by 2003 rules... 2003 wins.

2003 plays by 2015 rules,.. 2015 wins..

it’s that simple 

Edited by JARROD

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6 minutes ago, JARROD said:

Well in the 2015 defense,... like someone else said, we were fighting refs,.. NFL was not going to allow Peyton Manning to exit without a Super Bowl.

i truly hated everything about how that game went down, except just the fact that they made it that far. just a train wreck from start to finish. I still haven't re-watched it.

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The 2003 team is one of the worst teams to ever play in a Super Bowl.

The 2015 team is one of the best teams to never win a Super Bowl.

2015.

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1 minute ago, cptx said:

i truly hated everything about how that game went down, except just the fact that they made it that far. just a train wreck from start to finish. I still haven't re-watched it.

No... I mean No,..

the same reason I can’t watch even great episodes of Game of Thrones.... the last 1.5 episodes are like the ref tosses, Ron flubs,.. and last fumble in that game...

dracarys GIF

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1 minute ago, JARROD said:

No... I mean No,..

the same reason I can’t watch even great episodes of Game of Thrones.... the last 1.5 episodes are like the ref tosses, Ron flubs,.. and last fumble in that game...

dracarys GIF

thats a pretty great analogy haha

 

I do still dust off the cardiac cats dvd every once in a rare while.

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Posted (edited)
11 hours ago, cptx said:

thats a pretty great analogy haha

 

I do still dust off the cardiac cats dvd every once in a rare while.

Oh the 2003 Super Bowl,.. if you want a Rocky 4 moment when we can’t move the ball, the patriots keep gaining field position and then jump out like they are invincible...

the most pumped moment will always be Jakes record 85 yard Super Bowl touchdown to Moose,..

 

Edited by JARROD

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12 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

The 2003 team beat 'The Greatest Show on Turf' on the road in the dome.  The 2015 team beat a good, but not great, Seahawks team in Charlotte and a Cardinals team that heavily limped into the playoffs. A lot of luck and fortune went into that 2015 team.  It must have been the year of the black cat because we were winning the close games instead of losing them.  That said, aside from two games, we were in a ton of tight contests.  It really was our year, but the team was far from dominating.

Limped into the playoffs? Since when is a 9-1 finish limping into the playoffs? The only loss was to Seattle in a pretty much meaningless game since they needed us to lose at home to a 6-10 TB team and before halftime we were already up 24-3.

Also, we beat Seattle twice that year and they lost the SB the year before only because they didn't want to run Marshawn Lynch at the goal line. We can't give credit to other teams beating good teams but not the 2015 team.

It's funny that a lot of "luck and fortune" went into the 2015 team with a ton of tight contests yet the point differential was +192 and the 2003 team's was +21. The expected win/loss of the 2003 team was 8-8/9-7. I think people enjoy the finish of the 2003 season and the close wins and the bitter taste of SB 50 taints the entire season making it seem like the 2015 team wasn't as good. From 2003 to 2015, only 5 teams had a better point differential. The 2015 Panthers weren't really lucky. Even the 2007 Patriots had close games and ended up losing the SB. Anyway, enjoy the memories.

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12 minutes ago, cptx said:

i truly hated everything about how that game went down, except just the fact that they made it that far. just a train wreck from start to finish. I still haven't re-watched it.

That's the main reason why people would think the 2003 team was a better team. The SB ruined that season, but it doesn't mean they weren't our best team and fell on their face. We saw the team they could be in the NFC Championship game.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, stbugs said:

It’s funny how people remember things. The 2013 team won 5 of 12 games by 4 or less. The 2015 team won 4 of 17 games by 4 or less.

The 2013 team had a better D but the offense was far worse. The points differential was +125 for 2013 (+192 for 2015) even though the 2013 team gave up 67 less points. The 2015 offense scored 134 more points, 8+ more per game.

We can stop dissing the 2015 team. It’s the best team we’ve had.

I’m not dissing the 2015 team at all, and why are we using a random number of 4 points or less? Forget the stats and think back on 2015. How many times did we have to get bailed out by Cam being Super Man, or relatively lucky late game heroics that generally even out over a season rather than happen all the time like they did in 2015? We almost lost to some horrible, horrible teams that year, including Saints with Luke McCown (5 point game that came down to a ridiculously athletic Norman pick in the end zone, not counted in your stats for some reason). That 2015 team was obviously amazing and all great teams have some degree of luck, but I think 2015 was more of a special thing we had going for a while, rather than being so talented or outcoaching teams left and right and being a really great team.

2013 we had close wins because that’s the type of game we played with our defense. Look at the Niners game for example (regular season, we got completely cheated in the playoffs). That Niners team under Harbaugh was great and we just punched them in the damn mouth and held them to nothing and there was never any doubt that we were going to win that game, and we won. We didn’t need to score a ton that year, just looking at raw numbers is silly. Also, took the division from the Saints who were amazing that year too. 2013 the D was an all time great defense and the offense was really pretty well rounded and put up point when needed. 

Looking at raw offense numbers is silly because in 2015 how much did our D just completely poo the bed only for us to have to try to put up 35+ points and be saved by Cam’s heroics? It was a lot. 2013 offense played ball control because the D was so damn good that we could. Also if you put 2015 Cam on that 2013 team we win the SB no doubt. Put 2013 Cam on that 2015 team and we’re probably 10-6 or 11-5 and don’t do much.

Edited by t96
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41 minutes ago, cptx said:

i truly hated everything about how that game went down, except just the fact that they made it that far. just a train wreck from start to finish. I still haven't re-watched it.

Me neither and I won’t until we win one. Even then may not watch it again. No reason to. Better to just pretend the Cardinals game was the SB.

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