Growl

I’ve already named multiple, if two to three guys can reliably be found as capable veterans each offseason then I’m probably never drafting a tackle ever again.

do you not remember the genesis point of this entire discussion? i am not looking for a “ten year” player at that spot because there’s no added value in having it. I would gladly take a one or two year rental at that position, over and over, indefinitely, because the impact it has on my squad would be the same. There’s no such thing as a “franchise” left tackle because there’s no added value in having the same face there.

*fast forward* Willis and Corral were in contention for Top 5 picks when they came out, do your research! Need to lock down that right side! Only a few more tackles away from glory!” tradition at this point

Duane brown probably already has a deal in place with a team and I hope it’s the panthers, he’s exactly the kind of player you can find from year to year in free agency.

also lol at using Allen and mahomes as examples this board had those pegged as guaranteed busts under the same auspice that they have Willis pegged as one. if Josh Allen and Patrick mahomes were in this class, the same people decrying it as “weak” would still be branding it the same label

pretty sure you said tackles but whatever, I was referring in the former half to Trenton and in the latter portion to Duane

so you think waiting until later in the draft is preferable for finding a franchise QB? are we really still here? Is this about to be a Tom Brady in the 6th kind of thing? there is a clear mathematical track record reiterating that the higher you pick, the better your chances of success at the QB position. The best prospects are going to go there. They aren’t going 9th overall. We can find outliers, but, as with Tom Brady and the 6th round, you don’t use outliers to build a battle strategy.

I would gladly take a player like terron armstead, thanks, and the team should’ve been willing to get involved in the Collins and Brown discussion. The pool of available OTs still has a number of guys I’d like to see them team sign, with teams no doubt waiting so they don’t have to guarantee their contracts but deals likely already in place in principle.

okay to reiterate again the kind of QB you want isnt getting to 8 or 9 overall nor is the team possessing those top picks giving them to us just because you want them to

what a throwback

why don’t you leave then and go lock some more threads full of your awful QB takes so nobody can see them.

which, again, is not nearly good enough to acquire the kind of QB you want.

those players weren’t acquired in free agency (except the Brady anomaly) they were acquired in blockbuster trades that saw nearly historic amounts of capital being moved, same with the Watson trade. to argue both the ideas of restraint, and age, as being red flags standing opposed to value and then to cite those example is quite the contradiction. they were also rare occurrences I might add and if you move past the flurry of the past couple seasons you’re not going to find many examples of it

literally this years free agency crop was chock full of them. “age” isn’t a red flag at the OT position, because, again, I’m not looking for a long term investment when I can routinely find a player of that caliber.

did you or did you not just endorse the notion that the panthers may win 6 games next season A plain answer would be refreshing for once instead of some ad hominem followed by an attempt to move the argument around

now the plan is to just get an elite QB in free agency everyone lol. but don’t dare suggest you can find offensive linemen that way, it’s unheard of!

of course. now to be clear, when I say good, I’m not talking about the ALL PRO TALENT that many here fixate on as a necessary component of a Championship roster, and the reasoning is simple: it isn’t necessary. the disparity in wins between a capable veteran tackle signed on a one year deal each offseason is going to win me as many games as the Joe Thomas types that so many are fixated on having. i don’t need that kind of player on my roster (as Joe Thomas proved.) what I need at that position is good enough.

I enjoy watching you dismantle your own arguments

Wow… I had never considered it in this light before. So QBs are like spinning rims and hog mollies are like engines. If only I had known. the insult to my intelligence aside-no, there is no such thing as a franchise left tackle. I am aware of what good LT play looks like, and what bad LT play looks like, and the maximum contribution it can make to a team. I don’t need to hear the announcer say a name to comprehend it, thanks. now that we’ve gotten that out of the way, the panthers lack of a second round pick is a moot point because you wouldn’t be taking a QB there anyways. you don’t wait around to find a guy there-you take the highest rated guy as soon as possible-bypassing ancillary positions to do this. Good left tackles can be found in free agency every offseason, and there’s no substantial benefit to getting them in their prime-a good rental at the position of a decent veteran player is going to add as many wins to your win total as a major financial commitment to a player coming off a rookie contract into his first deal-there is no added significance to returning a player at this position yearly. Outside the confines of free agency, we will be having this exact discussion next offseason about the four or five “generational” tackles that will be available then in the draft as well. The panthers will almost certainly not, however, have their pick of the QBs. The former is an annual occurrence, the latter is rare and very difficult to come by.

I don’t care about getting a “stud” to “anchor that o-line!” or whatever other boring cliches you’re spitting at me here. there is no additional value to having “your guy” at that spot, as opposed to having a revolving door of average veteran LT’s acquired each offseason over the course of a decade. I’m going to win the same number of games. There’s no such thing as a “franchise” left tackle, whatever that is even supposed to mean. there is such a thing as a franchise QB. There is value in having an individual at that spot in perpetuity, there is value in having a QB on a rookie contract, there is value in having him master your system, there is value in having him become the face of your city, and on and on and on and on. he isn’t going to be replaced just because there’s a “new coach” and “that’s what happens,” because that isn’t what happens. Good or promising QBs stick around, bad ones don’t. If he’s good, then the panthers will be good, and Matt rhule may stay and you may have to accept that, and if he’s bad, then I’m grateful for multiple opportunities to draft a QB and thanking my lucky stars we didn’t Build That O Line and Prepared The Roster Around The QB and worked my way out of contention for a top QB prospect. It is always better to be awful than average in the NFL. You should be much more afraid that the panthers get stuck in average with a new coach than the idea that Matt rhule might save his job.

They aren’t trading up. Clearly I’m not Matt rhules biggest supporter, but I’m not going to let my loathing for him scare me into worrying about such things or scare me off an opportunity to draft a QB just because I’m scared it might save his job.

“Guys a QB needy team is going to give us a great prospect because we’ve been so patient and deserve it!” other teams aren’t “building the roster” to “prepare for a QB,” they aren’t undervaluing the position the way people here do. they are getting that guy as they can and spending copious amounts of money and picks to support him while he is cost effective. Nobody is giving the panthers a QB next season just because that’s the moment we find it convenient to want one, if the next class is “better,” then every other team in the league knows that and there’s an 99% chance the top picks will be locked into taking those guys regardless of the cost and a 1% chance a team that is amicable to a trade will hold that spot and the panthers will have to compete against 12 other teams-and be selected from amongst them, better hope it’s not a division or conference foe!-by the team for trade. it is L-O-L worthy that people still operate under this delusion of “well we can just go get our guy when we want him.” the league doesn’t work this way, you don’t just get what you want when you decide you want it, something Dave tepper has had to choke down over and over again, and will probably have to do so a few more times. you have to take chances when the opportunity presents itself. You can’t miss your moment. The panthers did last season. They probably aren’t going to get many more chances if they keep “preparing the roster.” We’ll see if they learned their lesson.

this is a good post and something to consider, but I really don’t think teams draft a QB they don’t believe can be great. I’m not capping Pickett’s ability or whatever, but if that’s what the team believes then they should just take Willis.

what I’m saying is that Rhule has been painted as the “go get a veteran” (like Mayfield) guy from every leak we’ve heard and nugget we’ve gleaned, and if the team drafts a QB, the decision is likely revolving around the scouting axis of Fitterer/McAdoo. in conjunction with Rhule, yes, but if he hypothetically loses out on the push to acquire a veteran, then logic would follow that the primary evaluation of the prospect selected came from fitterer/mcadoo, who we’ve gathered have been more focused on acquiring a guy via the draft.

this is the other component of this if your logic is “rhule is going to get a QB to save his job” then you better hope they draft one at 6, because if not then they are giving up future draft assets for a middle of the road player to assure them pick #17 in the draft next season