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#31 The Answer

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Posted 29 January 2009 - 09:30 PM

Another Cpt. Obvious post.

:D

#32 jaybee1182

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Posted 29 January 2009 - 09:42 PM

I could care less about bone jarring hits and ending peoples careers if we are winning. Should Beason be like Ray Lewis? Ray has one superbowl a while ago and beats a murder charge the same year, that team has barely been competitive in the last 9 years. We have been up and down but never below 7-9 in that same span and our first beast MLB cant tie his shoes anymore. Beason is ok, natural leader, let him do his thing

#33 Mr. Scot

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Posted 30 January 2009 - 01:49 AM

Not that Pep ever was a leader, but it was his team according to the Big Cat.(at least that's what JR wanted) So Now the door is wide open for a new guard and I think we have been seeing him take over anyway, might be part of the reason why Pep wants out.

Interesting theory.

Doubt Peppers would ever admit it even if it were true, but it's something to ponder.

Gantt posted yesterday that the position coaches would likely be in place in the next couple of days. Nothing on day one, and no one mentioned as a potential hire has been signed by anyone else.

We'll see what the next few days bring.

#34 Woodie

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Posted 30 January 2009 - 01:13 PM

Do you guys even remember the previous few years when our defense often went for the big hit? Sure, they would smack someone back a few yards, eliciting instant oooh's and aaah's from the fans...at least until the offensive player regained their momentum and ran for another 10 yards or more because we didn't wrap up or make sure he went to the ground. Hard hits are fine, but that's not what wins games or makes defenses great, or even good. It's solid fundimental play that differentiates the good defenses from the bad, not the number of oooh's they get during the game.

Fans like the big hits, and many mistakenly think that is the way to intimidate an offense. However, to counter that thought, how many big hits did Asumagha have for Oakland this year? Not many. Yet, he was one of the most intimidating defenders in the league. Why? Because offenses were afraid to throw his way and changed their gameplan to avoid him. He intimidated with fundimentals, not by jacking people up. Of course, he was the biggest example, but it was the same for pretty much all of the players who play fundimentally sound football (with starter quality talent, obviously). So, give me a team with good solid fundimentals every single time.

#35 Mr. Scot

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Posted 30 January 2009 - 01:26 PM

Asomugha used to be a regular on ESPN's "Jacked Up" when they had it.

Hard hitting and solid fundamentals are not mutually exclusive. The best defenses have both, and there's no reason why we can't.

One of my big complaints about Trgovac is that fundamentals and discipline declined steadily under his watch.

Edited by Mr Scot, 30 January 2009 - 03:47 PM.


#36 rayzor

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Posted 30 January 2009 - 02:54 PM

Not that Pep ever was a leader, but it was his team according to the Big Cat.(at least that's what JR wanted) So Now the door is wide open for a new guard and I think we have been seeing him take over anyway, might be part of the reason why Pep wants out.

Interesting theory.

Doubt Peppers would ever admit it even if it were true, but it's something to ponder.

i think there could be a lot of truth to that. peppers could easily have been one of the focal points of jenkins famous "no heart" comments. He certainly wasn't showing much that season, was he?

if it was peppers team then it could be that his example was to not give it 100% all the time. people said he led by example...it wasn't the example that beason was giving. i don't know that peppers was feeling like the team was passing him by or anything but i do know that i would much rather have the defense led by the hard work of beason, davis, harris, and godfrey. those guys learn all the time how to be better and give it everything they have on the field and off.

peppers doesn't really fit there.

#37 Mr. Scot

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Posted 30 January 2009 - 02:57 PM

Sometimes I think there's nothing more disheartening than a guy who could be great.

#38 Mr. Scot

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Posted 30 January 2009 - 03:09 PM

Finally decided to research Meeks past a little more. Found this tidbit.

When he was interviewing for the Redskins head coaching job, he listed Greg Blache as a top choice to be his DC. Blache was formerly with the Bears, who tend to prefer aggressive defenses. He was named Redskins DC under Jim Zorn this past season.

Looking for more...

#39 mountainpantherfan

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Posted 30 January 2009 - 03:12 PM

The Patriots always go for smart players on defense, which is a good strategy.

The fact that we had to simplify our scheme to be effective doesn't speak well, honestly :(


It doesn't but I wonder if that had more to do with all of the young starters/new faces and the fact they changed the defensive line gaps.

I think the core of this defense, Beason, Davis, Kemo and Harris, all have the potentiel to fit into either the "nasty" or "smart" defense.

#40 Mr. Scot

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Posted 30 January 2009 - 03:43 PM

A little info, not much insight.

The Colts LB coach was actually there before Meeks, but the DL and DB coaches were hired the same year. How much input he had, unknown, but reasonable to expect he had some say.

The DB coach's name is Alan Williams. he came from the Tampa school and had worked with the DBs there under Kiffin's scheme. Not a huge surprise given the Cover 2 style.

The DL coach is John Teerlinck, a guy I personally think is a POS but who had a history with Dungy from his days in Minnesota. Teerlinck is the defensive version of Alex Gibbs, a coach who's effective, but questionable. He's been accused of coaching dirty play more than once. Likely more a Dungy hire given the past relation.

Was hoping for more, but other than this and the bit about Greg Blache, not much.

Edited by Mr Scot, 30 January 2009 - 03:48 PM.


#41 Woodie

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Posted 31 January 2009 - 01:38 AM

Asomugha used to be a regular on ESPN's "Jacked Up" when they had it.

Hard hitting and solid fundamentals are not mutually exclusive. The best defenses have both, and there's no reason why we can't.

One of my big complaints about Trgovac is that fundamentals and discipline declined steadily under his watch.

Don't know about Asomugha on Jacked up (I found that segment totally useless, so rarely watched), but nevertheless, it is irrelevent to my point. He is so fundimentally sound that teams usually choose not to throw his way, which limits his chances for jacked up plays (which is why I used the example). The reason for this is that his man up defense is very sound and the chances of completing a pass on him is small, not because of any sort of reputation as a fierce hitter.

True, hard hitting and solid fundimentals do not have to be mutually exclusive, however, most times they are. Teams that do both well are very rare. Teams like the Steelers are the exception, not the rule. Typically, most teams known as big hitters are also teams known for poor tackling and inconsistent play, not strong fundimentals. The reason is simple, most players that are known as big hitters tend to lead with their shoulder while tucking their arm in order to make that bone jarring hit. However, that is, by definition, poor fundimentals.

As for the Panthers, within the last year or so, there has been a general shift in their hitting. In previous years, players such as Mike Minter and Thomas Davis (basically the players known for their jaw rattling hits) often tackled using the exact form described above. But what the team is doing a better job of now is making sure their arms are wrapped around the offensive player when they make a hit. So while the players do make some hard hits, they are not going for the slobberknocker like they used to. As a result, the hits are more fundimentally sound and only rarely do you see guys bounce off them to gain additional yards. Which, IMO, is what you want. I couldn't care less if we make the SportsCenter highlight reel, I just want to make sure that when we have the chance to stop a guy, that he goes no further.

Edited by Woodie, 31 January 2009 - 01:41 AM.


#42 top dawg

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Posted 31 January 2009 - 02:17 PM

Our defense suffers from a lack of heart, intensity and consistency which is in part due to shortcomings in coaching, a lack of experience in battle, and brain farts while playing.

Hopefully with another season under their belts, the youngsters will have a better handle on WTF is going on, the leaders will inject an endless stream of energy into the defensive culture, and the coaches will be there to preach consistency and demand accountability for soft and so-so play.

#43 Mr. Scot

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 11:32 AM

The opening line of Charles Chandler's story on the Steeler defense says it all here.

Bend but don't break? Puh-leez.


Enlightening.

The Pittsburgh Steelers believe in playing defense the old-fashioned way, unlike many NFL teams nowadays that don't mind giving up chunks of yardage between the twenties as long as they hunker down near the goal-line.

The Steelers gave up fewer yards per game (237.2) during the regular season than the legendary 1985 Chicago Bears, and led the NFL in total defense, pass defense, and scoring defense. Pittsburgh was second in run defense, falling 55 rushing yards shy of becoming the first team since the 1970 NFL-AFL merger to lead in all four categories.

In the NFL's highest-scoring season since 1965, the Steelers held opponents to 13.9 points per game and 3.9 yards per play, best in the league since 1979.

They did it against one of the league's most difficult schedules, facing 11 teams that finished .500 or better.

Facing a different monster

So the best defense in the league did it with a hard-ass approach, the kind of approach that once got a DC named John Fox an opportunity as a head coach.

An approach the Panthers have since abandoned.

:nonod:

#44 top dawg

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 02:11 PM

The opening line of Charles Chandler's story on the Steeler defense says it all here.



Enlightening.


Facing a different monster

So the best defense in the league did it with a hard-ass approach, the kind of approach that once got a DC named John Fox an opportunity as a head coach.

An approach the Panthers have since abandoned.

:nonod:


Scottie, who are you kidding?:) The Panthers haven't abandoned this approach. They never had it. **amusingly argumentative**

#45 Steel Panther

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Posted 04 February 2009 - 02:12 PM

Spot on, dude!


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