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Something mildly interesting

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Looking at Cam's stats, there are a few things that I've overlooked, numbers-wise, and perhaps you all have as well.



Obviously, through the first 6 games, we were running a gimmicky, BS offense. Cam struggled. The two games in that span that he DID perform very well (again, strictly on numbers), he was expected to. Those teams were TB and NO. He also had a solid performance in Atlanta (though everybody wants to overshadow that with the fumble).

Cam's best games, dating back to his first game last season, seem to be when he throws the ball less than 29 times. Best two games this season, statistically? NO and Atlanta. Pass attempts in those games? 20 and 24, respectively.

The point? Keep Cam's pass attempts down, we have our best chance to win. Against NO, our defense played well enough to win, we won. Atlanta, defense did enough to win until the final drive.

If we can keep Cam's passing attempts down (comes down to running the ball effectively and defense), that is where Cam is most comfortable. Cam can take games over, for sure, but he doesn't HAVE to.

This may be something we all know, but I just found it interesting. Stats only say so much, but why is it that Chud can't see those stats and say "maybe there is a reason he does better when we throw less"?

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Another case of running the ball to run out the clock lowering the overall pass attempts?

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I would say run it, but our run blocking is horrid. Kalil was a big loss.

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[quote name='Panther17' timestamp='1351877208' post='1976339']
Another case of running the ball to run out the clock lowering the overall pass attempts?
[/quote]


Perhaps. That was a thought. But the Washington game last season, we won by a 13 point margin, so it wouldn't make sense there. Same goes for the Indy and both TB games last season.

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Of course less pass attempts means we are controlling the game, but for a QB to be a Qb he needs pass attempts. Since this season is over lets let him throw like crazy and improve on the job.

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[quote name='lightsout' timestamp='1351877312' post='1976343']
Perhaps. That was a thought. But the Washington game last season, we won by a 13 point margin, so it wouldn't make sense there. Same goes for the Indy and both TB games last season.
[/quote]


I wouldn't count the TB games for anything else but a W on the schedule last season. Watching those games were like watching the dirty ATL vs Panthers games where Vick treated us like one of his dogs. 72-0 or something like that for the 2 games that season. It counts in the record book but the other team wasn't even trying.

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[quote name='jtgreensboro' timestamp='1351877300' post='1976342']
I would say run it, but our run blocking is horrid. Kalil was a big loss.
[/quote]


It is bad, but we saw last week that as long as we run some more conventional runs and just keep at it, even if it doesn't result in much early, eventually we wear down the opposing team's DL and Stew breaks through for a solid gain. Maybe we need to focus less of our game-plan on trying to find the big play in the pass game and focus more on grinding games out the hard way and running the ball. Take a shot here and there, but for the most part, keep the passes short and simple and move methodically down the field.
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[quote name='Panther17' timestamp='1351877475' post='1976348']


I wouldn't count the TB games for anything else but a W on the schedule last season. Watching those games were like watching the dirty ATL vs Panthers games where Vick treated us like one of his dogs. 72-0 or something like that for the 2 games that season. It counts in the record book but the other team wasn't even trying.
[/quote]


Fair statement, they were terrible last season.

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A little different spin on the same data...when we commit to running the ball, Cam plays better. Sticking with the run until there is no choice but to abandon it is the best thing for the team as a whole. The o-line loves it and they play better. The D loves it as it chews up the clock. Cam loves it as it keeps the other team's D honest.

Until we're down by 2 scores, we need to run at least 50% of the time.


Edit: Lightsout, I see that you came to pretty much the same conclusion 2 posts earlier while I was typing. We are in agreement that sticking to the run early is the key.
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[quote name='usmcpanthers' timestamp='1351877358' post='1976346']
Of course less pass attempts means we are controlling the game, but for a QB to be a Qb he needs pass attempts. Since this season is over lets let him throw like crazy and improve on the job.
[/quote]



Cam is still a QB, even with lower passing attempt numbers. He can improve his game, for sure, but we are in the "easier" part of our schedule from here on out. Why not try to see if we can get on a run? Why throw away the season now and further hurt the psyche in the locker room with not just Cam, but with the whole team? Run the football, see if we can tear off a winning streak, and see what happens. We saw last season what happens when this team is playing confident. They're deadly.

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Also, when we throw the ball 29 or less times, since the first game of last season, Cam has thrown 1 (one) interception. 1. Uno. Singular.

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I honestly believe this team could go on a tear the rest of the year if Chud would just get his head out of his ass. He needs to pretend he has Derek Anderson as his QB when he draws up the gameplan.

Our D is starting to get it together. We just need the right gameplan and this team could rip off 3-4 wins in a row.


Edit: Okay, this is getting scary. Every time I type a response, I come back into the thread and Lightsout has already posted the same thought.
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Cam could excel passing more than we run, BUT, as with any QB, there has to be some semblance of a running game to keep the defense honest. What we were doing the first 6 games or so provided no balance so defenses had a relatively easy time defending us. As the old adage goes, "the running game is a QBs best friend."

I still say Cam has shown signs of progress and has had a good year, but it has been overshadowed by press conference analysis, bootleg sports psychologists, mistakes that may or not have been his fault at clutch moments often because he was being asked to be our entire offense, AND it has been marred by horrible coaching. If people would look at Cam's play just for what it is, without trying to pick at what kind of person he is or what's going on in his mind, you would see he's doing fine and if we just got some breaks to go our way, he'll be even better.
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Wasnt there a disgustingly one-sided stat when Stew has over 14 carries? I know most of that is from a different era, but it does fall right in....

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One other point...we still are in the shotgun way too much. It would be great to see us run no more than 60% of our plays out of the gun. Yes, that's still a high number, but it would be a 15 to 20% reduction from what we have been doing.
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[quote name='Marguide' timestamp='1351878691' post='1976370']
One other point...we still are in the shotgun way too much. It would be great to see us run no more than 60% of our plays out of the gun. Yes, that's still a high number, but it would be a 15 to 20% reduction from what we have been doing.
[/quote]



Agreed. It seems like Chud just doesn't trust the players to execute under center, and I'm not really sure why. Cam isn't AS comfortable handing off from under center, but hell, he hardly does it. Anybody would be awkward in doing it if they NEVER do it. That gets fixed in practice. You don't REALLY know how to do something until you do it 1,000 times. Rep that poo in practice and run it in the game. The success of the offense and the team depends on it.

Either all of that....or Chud really is just THAT dumb.

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[quote name='lightsout' timestamp='1351878839' post='1976371']
Agreed. It seems like Chud just doesn't trust the players to execute under center, and I'm not really sure why. Cam isn't AS comfortable handing off from under center, but hell, he hardly does it. Anybody would be awkward in doing it if they NEVER do it. That gets fixed in practice. You don't REALLY know how to do something until you do it 1,000 times. Rep that poo in practice and run it in the game. The success of the offense and the team depends on it.

Either all of that....or Chud really is just THAT dumb.
[/quote]

I do remember Delhomme saying one time that it was easier to see and read the defense when he was in the shotgun rather than under center. Maybe it's the same for Cam.

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[quote name='GRWatcher' timestamp='1351879085' post='1976376']
I do remember Delhomme saying one time that it was easier to see and read the defense when he was in the shotgun rather than under center. Maybe it's the same for Cam.
[/quote]


Well, that's true for a lot (maybe even most) QBs. You're back further, you're upright, so it makes sense that you can see it all better. However, Jake was still under center most of the game, and he should have been. I don't see any good enough reason to keep Cam in the shotgun other than stubbornness.

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[quote name='lightsout' timestamp='1351879289' post='1976379']
Well, that's true for a lot (maybe even most) QBs. You're back further, you're upright, so it makes sense that you can see it all better. However, Jake was still under center most of the game, and he should have been. I don't see any good enough reason to keep Cam in the shotgun other than stubbornness.
[/quote]

Seasoned vets like Manning and Brady can play out of the gun at a high % because those guys are so good they can pass successfully even when the opposing D knows a pass is coming.

In our case, we're trying to run pretty much our whole offense out of the gun, and doing so with an inexperienced QB. Most RB's will tell you they run better out of an I formation rather than running from the gun, so it hurts our run game and that in turn keeps the whole offense less efficient.

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[quote name='GRWatcher' timestamp='1351879085' post='1976376']
I do remember Delhomme saying one time that it was easier to see and read the defense when he was in the shotgun rather than under center. Maybe it's the same for Cam.
[/quote]
it's the same for pretty much all QBs, which is why most of them, esp the best ones, are taking so many of their snaps from the shotgun and that's something that has been a growing trend for several years now.

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[quote name='rayzor' timestamp='1351880866' post='1976411']
it's the same for pretty much all QBs, which is why most of them, esp the best ones, are taking so many of their snaps from the shotgun and that's something that has been a growing trend for several years now.
[/quote]

The difference is, we've been over the top. Going into the Chicago game, we had taken something like 83% of our snaps out of the gun year to date. That is just too much.

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[quote name='Marguide' timestamp='1351881241' post='1976419']
The difference is, we've been over the top. Going into the Chicago game, we had taken something like 83% of our snaps out of the gun year to date. That is just too much.
[/quote]agreed there.

chud's problem is that he got stuck in a rut. even the dreaded read option itself isn't all that bad of a play call. the problem is running it so much.

it's just as bad as jeff davidson's predictable offense.


i think that chud's playbook is great. i just wish he would use more of it.

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Sticking to the run isn't the solution, being balanced and being able to run when we want to is the answer. As long as we are putting ourselves in manageable third down situations and converting on third and short to medium we would be fine. Looking at attempts under 29 or other purely number stats without context makes little sense. For example running all day against a team that is scheming to take away the run makes little sense and won't end with a victory. Likewise passing on third and long rarely ends up being a good thing. Football is about one on one matchups, putting players in favorable matchups and players making big plays in key situations. If you look at our losses, the biggest factor has been players not making plays and failing to step up at critical times.
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