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Should we keep Rivera for another Season?


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#76 The Special One

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 10:51 PM

I like big Ron, but I like Bill Cowher better.

#77 Dollar Store Dave

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 10:53 PM

yep. i absolutely LOATHE the idea of a coaching-go-round. i hate what this franchise has become in recent years, but that's where we are and a lot of it is we didn't start with a clean slate when we had a chance to a couple years ago. we should have gone for a new HC and a new GM. i don't think we should make that mistake again.

i'm just glad that we won't be going for the triple whammy in having to start all over with a new franchise QB.

at least i hope we don't.


I doubt a new GM/coaching staff would want a new QB. The league realizes that Cam is a fantastic talent, and any coaching staff would be glad to have Cam at QB.

However, with that being said, if some team (like a Buffalo or Kansas City) came around with some insane, why-the-hell-would-they-offer-that? trade, then I could see there being a situation where a new staff did move on.

#78 Doc Holiday

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 10:59 PM

We have six games left....
Philadelphia
Kansas City
Atlanta
San Diego
Oakland
New Orleans

I'm only confident that we win two of those games against Philly and Kc (I was confident that we would beat Tampa Bay) For sake of good debate lets say we win four out of those last six. Sound familiar? So by being optimistic we are the same team as last year winning games late in the season when all it does is kill draft position.

The reality is that we will go 5-11 or 4-10

That is why you cant bring Mr. Rivera back. He always speaks of a missing piece with this team. He's right there is something missing with this team because its close every week.

Ill tell you what's missing and that's a Head Coach.

I'd say he's right about the missing pieces, because we do have some on this team. the hardest game we have on the remainder of the schedule is Atlanta and they will have a playoff spot secured by the time we play them. New Orleans if eliminated from the playoffs before our game could be another game that becomes easier as it gets closer, all the others are winnable but really don't know how it will shake out, I'd say it's 50% we go 3-3, 30% 4-2 and 15% 5-1 and 5% we go 6-0 to finish out.

Remember this schedule is A lot easier then our first 10 games, and it is not even close.

I think if he can by some miracle pull off a 7-9 finish he would save his Job, there was a lot of people with over the top expectations, that were thinking playoffs, I said in one thread earlier before the season I thought we would go 8-8(though I thought the downfall would be the defense not offense). so really 7-9 isn't bad.

#79 Dollar Store Dave

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 11:00 PM

Whatever happens in the off-season, I'd say Chud has to be the first one fired.

How that man has a job still, I have no fuging idea.

#80 rayzor

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 11:56 PM

I doubt a new GM/coaching staff would want a new QB. The league realizes that Cam is a fantastic talent, and any coaching staff would be glad to have Cam at QB.

However, with that being said, if some team (like a Buffalo or Kansas City) came around with some insane, why-the-hell-would-they-offer-that? trade, then I could see there being a situation where a new staff did move on.

agreed, but it would have to be along the lines of a ricky williams give the whole draft away for the next couple years type insane deal.

unless you are just closed minded about newton and refuse to look any deeper into the situation, you're going to know that his set back is largely there because of the coaching here this year. you're going to know that between this year and last year, this year is the fluke.

most forward thinking progressive coaches in the league would be chomping at the bit to have the prototype for the next generation of QBs as their guy for hopefully the next decade.

#81 PhillyB

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 12:20 AM

could be he'd do ok with a new GM and offensive coordinator.

no chance he's kept around though. jerry can't afford it, and we can do better than mediocre anyway.

#82 Matthias

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 12:55 AM

I'm tired of people using our o-line as an excuse for Rivera and this staff. The Bears have the worst o-line in the league, they still got seven wins. The main reason why we stink, is because Rivera sabotaged the team. Simple and plain. To keep him around for one more year after this season, would be the height of insanity. Plus Cam would never develop under Rivera. Cam develop way more in spending a few weeks with Chris Weinke, than he did with a full off-season of study under Rivera and co. What does that tell ya?

We got talent. We got more talent than most teams in this league. We just don't use them. This offense was design for Cam to run everything. In this offense Cam is the QB, the RB, and if he was fast enough, he would be the WR as well. It is absolutely criminal what Rivera done to this young guy. So long story short, I hope Rivera coaches his last game this up coming monday.

#83 MaineManPanther

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 10:31 AM

Excuse you sir but maybe you didn't notice the additions of Cam,Shockey,and Olsen. For goodness sakes We had like four different quarterbacks in 2010 and they were all terrible. Don't give Rivera credit for that.


Rivera picked a offence that Newton could succed in, picked a OC that could utlize all of them, and taught Newton in a way that allowed him to learn and succeed his rookie year.
And if talent takes credit away from success, why shouldn't it apply to lack of talent? We have a second year Qb, horrible line, and thus a bad run game ,with only two consistently talented Wr's.

#84 rayzor

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 10:44 AM

Rivera picked a offence that Newton could succed in, picked a OC that could utlize all of them, and taught Newton in a way that allowed him to learn and succeed his rookie year.

i think they abandoned that offense in lieu of some hybrid read option/coryell, but when as an OC you have no experience running or working with one of those (the read option in this case) then it's very likely that you don't have a clue how to run it properly.

whtever they did, though, the playcalling is quite a bit different than last year and last year they showed an ability to adapt what they do not only at the beginning of the year to tailor to newton's strengths, but mid way through the year when that first way started puttering out.

this year the offense has done nothing but putter out and they have made no long term adjustments to what they do. you see glimpses and even a game or two of them showing that they can make adjustments, but then they fall right back into the same futile playcalling they have relied on all year. somehow they are able to muster out leads during those games, but then comes crunch time or what should be crunch time, but it inevitably turns into cave time as an offense and defense that had been fighting it out all game all of a sudden turns into jello.

the team, personnel-wise is struggling. everyone has been making boneheaded mistakes and they do it at the worst time. the Oline is horrible because of the injury to kalil and the shifting around they've had to do and starting another rookie (which he will be much better next year), but what a smart OC and coaching staff would have done is tailor what they do to fit the personnel they have. adjust things so that the plays called don't call for the Oline to hold players off for 4 seconds.

players aren't helping matters, but coaching has made it much worse than it should be.

#85 CPF4LIFE

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 11:17 AM

We drafted a run blocking OG in he second round and he has rarely done that all season. Not using players to there strengths has killed us all season above anything else. smh

#86 MaineManPanther

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 11:18 AM

i think they abandoned that offense in lieu of some hybrid read option/coryell, but when as an OC you have no experience running or working with one of those (the read option in this case) then it's very likely that you don't have a clue how to run it properly.

whtever they did, though, the playcalling is quite a bit different than last year and last year they showed an ability to adapt what they do not only at the beginning of the year to tailor to newton's strengths, but mid way through the year when that first way started puttering out.

this year the offense has done nothing but putter out and they have made no long term adjustments to what they do. you see glimpses and even a game or two of them showing that they can make adjustments, but then they fall right back into the same futile playcalling they have relied on all year. somehow they are able to muster out leads during those games, but then comes crunch time or what should be crunch time, but it inevitably turns into cave time as an offense and defense that had been fighting it out all game all of a sudden turns into jello.

the team, personnel-wise is struggling. everyone has been making boneheaded mistakes and they do it at the worst time. the Oline is horrible because of the injury to kalil and the shifting around they've had to do and starting another rookie (which he will be much better next year), but what a smart OC and coaching staff would have done is tailor what they do to fit the personnel they have. adjust things so that the plays called don't call for the Oline to hold players off for 4 seconds.

players aren't helping matters, but coaching has made it much worse than it should be.


There is only so much pressure you can counter when you have a bad run game, only two consistent Wrs and a low acc percentage Qb.

Having said that I agree with most of this post. Which is why I take no issue with Rivera leaving, however he and his staff has shown they are capable of taking this offence to a high level. I think the argument depends on wether we can believe he can do it again. Or if last year was a anomaly.



#87 rayzor

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 11:27 AM

There is only so much pressure you can counter when you have a bad run game, only two consistent Wrs and a low acc percentage Qb.

Having said that I agree with most of this post. Which is why I take no issue with Rivera leaving, however he and his staff has shown they are capable of taking this offence to a high level. I think the argument depends on wether we can believe he can do it again. Or if last year was a anomaly.

i think the consistency will come with time and chemistry, but getting one or two better ones would help overall. and the run game is largely bad because we have a bad oline, but more than that because we have a bad OC calling the shots.

the run game is predictable and it doesn't make the best use of the personnel. earlier in the week it was pointed out that chud wasn't even paying attention to or take into account the RB he had on the field when he was calling running plays. Dwill is better on the edge and less effective up the middle. stewart is kind of the opposite. stewart is the guy you want going between the tackles. dwill is the guy you want going outside. chud was calling running plays going up the middle mainly when williams was on the field. when he was calling plays that had the RB heading off the edge, stewart was on the field. chud just didn't pay attention to what or who is on the field. he just does what he does.

there's just so many problems that, yes, an upgrade in personnel would help but more, a good coaching staff would work around. if something isn't working, then try something else. if something is working, keep doing it until it doesn't work anymore. if the players on the field can't do what you want them to do well enough to be effective, change what you want to do to help them be effective. work within their strengths, but also and esp. their limitations.

#88 Matthias

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 11:30 AM

I looked closely this past thursday to see how the Redskins ran their read options. Interestingly enough, they run the read option out of the pistol formation. This gives their runner the natural running start that he would get if they were running out of an I-formation. It gives the runner room to see the field, and be able to make cuts where he needs to. It's no wonder they have success running the ball with their read option. The way we do it, is have Cam right next to the runner out of the shotgun formation. So essentially while the play is developing, Cam and Stew/D-Will are bumping into each other, making it impossible for the runner to get great vision of how the defense is reacting to the blocking of the O-line. Plus it takes away that momentum they would normally have going towards the line, in a I-formation type set up.

So while I don't care much for the read option, at least Washington run it in a way that benefits the runner. Some keep saying the reason our runners are bad this year, is because of the o-line. Again I point to the Bears who have the worst o-line in the league. Forte is averaging 4.5 yards per carry and has over 600 yards rushing. He will probably have over a thouand yards this season with the benefit of blocking TEs and a fullback. Two keys that help bad o-lines. I said it once, I said it a thousand times over. Rivera has sabotaged this team.

#89 Argus Plexus

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 12:50 PM

No. Die.

#90 Iceberg Slim

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 12:52 PM

No.....


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