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Regarding Ron Rivera...why would next year be any different?


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#46 pstall

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 09:53 AM

You have to give him at least one more year out of sheer continuity. In year 3 we have a better sample size of what he is capable or incapable of doing.
If anything, keeping the current staff intact with a new GM can actually buy the new GM time. If they blow up the team and it's the new GM's baby it all falls on that guy right out of the gate.

This may be JR's toughest offseason this upcoming one. Many coaches who have been succesful were on thin ice in year 2 or 3 and the owner/GM's stuck with them and it paid off. Knowing when to cut your losses and when to stay the course in pro sports is super tough.

#47 AceMan

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 10:02 AM

Maybe I'm overstating it, but the team has talent. I don't think Hurney was the issue. Yes, a few bounces go the other way, maybe the team wins a few more games. But maybe they don't.

I look at the Bears game, when Ron Rivera admitted he called the soft zone coverage on the final drive when the Bears walked down the field and scored to win the game at the end. Rivera didn't use the final timeout he had when the Bears kept running the same play up and down the field. Good coaching?


Hurney defender or you just want to spread the blame around?

And we need to pull the plug now while we have the perfect opportunity...I just don't see Rivera improving into a playoff-caliber coach next season. Most people might not like it, but we need complete turnover. New GM, New Head Coach, New attitude. We screwed the pooch with Hurney and Rivera, time to admit those mistakes and move into a new direction.

#48 PhillyB

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 10:22 AM

<------------- ambivalent as long as we get a new GM and he has his way with coach selection

#49 DaveThePanther2008

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 11:36 AM

I like Rivera but he is like so many coordinators that try their hands at HC. He belongs the head of a defense not a team. Last year we gave him the defense in shambles excuse and a rookie QB though we were 5th in total offense. This year even with an injured defense we are playing better. Decision in crunch time and he froze like Matt Ryan in a playoff game.

New GM, New Coach. I see the SSDD same poo different day in our case same poo different year.

Maybe after a couple years he can pull a Bill Billicheat and become an HOF coach.

Not here, not with the Panthers

#50 KJ89

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 11:39 AM

I admit to some mixed feelings on this issue. What Ron and his staff has done with our defense has been exemplary, and I hate the thought of changes on that side of the ball. On the other hand, our offense was so mismanaged for the first half of the year that I don't know if I will ever regain faith in our offensive staff. And yes, Ron, like it or not, you bear responsibility for that side of the ball too.

There are a couple other things that bother me regarding coaching:

1) Watching our special teams on extra point and field goal attempts by the opposing teams, I see players just going through the motions. We never seem to make any extra effort to block or disrupt a kick. Yes, these are low percentage plays, but teams are so close in this league that every single edge counts. If our guys half-ass these plays, maybe they are giving less than 100% in other areas.

2) Ron has a bit too much John Fox in him, in that he tends to stick with certain players too long. I saw this as a problem last year with Naanee and McClain and Fua. This year, it was sticking with an underperforming Beason until there was no choice but to put him on IR. We stick with Nakamura virtually all year, then when he goes out, we see an instant improvement by inserting DJ Campbell and moving Godfrey to FS. We stuck with Norman too long, imo, as well. Seeing what Thomas has done after Gamble went out, it is clear he should have been playing opposite Gamble early while Norman got his reps in practice. Ron seems to only make changes once he's backed into a corner.

I just don't see us ever having a complete team with Ron at the helm.


That about sums up my feelings as well.

#51 MadHatter

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 12:00 PM

My response to that is...the Panthers already have the talent to be a winning football team. A few balls bounce the other way and the Panthers are staring down a wildcard spot. Hurney left the team with plenty of talent...and I don't really think that was the main issue when the team was losing close game after close game the past two seasons.


Some of those close losses i put on coaching...soft coverage on last drives.

But, many of them were the flat fault of players not executing....Cam fumble, Nakamura jumping too early, Cam throwing the ball into the dirt instead of hitting a wide open TE 3 yds in from of him, Smitty slipping resulting in a pick 6.

Not sure if I would be ok with Rivera back or not. But blaming all if the close losses on just the staff is ridiculous.





#52 CarolinaCoolin

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 12:10 PM

All teams that did indeed have pretty good talent, and all of which play in pretty crappy divisions.

You can debate talent vs coaching for the Panthers, but a weak division is something we definitely don't have the good fortune to be in.


The falcons when they brought in mike smith went to the playoffs and they are in the same division as us. New systems aren't the problem. Its the coaches who impliment them. Harbaugh brought out the best in his time. We need to find a coach who can do the same.

#53 Marguide

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 12:10 PM

To me, I lean toward giving him a chance because

a) Last season was the first for everybody, plus I don't thin our personnel was as good last year.
B) 2011: 18 players on IR
c) 2012: see ( B) above
d) Team seems to be gelling well now
e) Coaches have a learning curve too
f) JR has always given his HCs three seasons to get it right. I don't see him doing differently now
g) New GM should be able to help with talent and keeping organization (coaches, players, etc.) on point


As to "c" above, injuries this year are no excuse. We were very healthy compared to many teams early in the year, and that's when we really sucked.

It would be easier to make the case that injuries have helped us this year, as the younger guys (at least on D) seem to be outplaying some of the earlier starters.

#54 jayflip

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 12:31 PM

If we're really only "a few bounced balls" from a wild card spot, isn't that an argument for Rivera?

For the record though, I'm not as sold on our talent level as you are.


Our starters are pretty talented across the board. But our back ups are nothing but practice squad fodder. When the same injury bug hits us next year that hits is every year, it becomes painfully obvious. The Giants this year game showed me what having quality depth does for a team.

#55 hepcat

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 01:18 PM

Hurney defender or you just want to spread the blame around?

And we need to pull the plug now while we have the perfect opportunity...I just don't see Rivera improving into a playoff-caliber coach next season. Most people might not like it, but we need complete turnover. New GM, New Head Coach, New attitude. We screwed the pooch with Hurney and Rivera, time to admit those mistakes and move into a new direction.


Not a Hurney defender because he made many questionable decisions that set the team back. But I think he was a scapegoat for the teams slow start this year. Though I know his firing was meant to send a message to the team saying "get it together or you're next"

That said, the team has talent. Charles Johnson and Greg Hardy both have 10+ sacks, and the defense is ranked in the top 10. And any team with Cam Newton should be at least contending for a playoff spot. The fact that the Panthers aren't, says something about the coaching staff.

#56 beach

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 01:36 PM

Putting my opinion on the matter aside, I think it's probable Rivera retains his job next year.

There's gonna be a lot of names out on the coaching market and like pstall mentioned, this may be Jerry's toughest offseason decision he's had to make in a long time, if ever imo.

Deciding on GM and HC for a team with Cam, Keek, Kraken, and Chuck. You gotta think there's gonna be guys gushing over the possibility of coaching us and there's gonna be a big field of candidates. Meanwhile we've seen what's happened the past 3 weeks and it may look to Jerry like our current staff has finally got their act together. This is a complete toss-up right now.

If we get killed by the Saints, I think Rivera is gone; but I honestly can see a scenario with us losing and Rivera staying put.

#57 thunderraiden

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 01:37 PM

My response to that is...the Panthers already have the talent to be a winning football team. A few balls bounce the other way and the Panthers are staring down a wildcard spot. Hurney left the team with plenty of talent...and I don't really think that was the main issue when the team was losing close game after close game the past two seasons.

Did this asshole really just answer his own question? So you're obviously trolling then?

#58 Marguide

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 01:56 PM

If we get killed by the Saints, I think Rivera is gone; but I honestly can see a scenario with us losing and Rivera staying put.


Me too. I'm not sure this finale against the Saints will be any different than last year, but this year we kind of have a legitimate reason why we may get blown out. Our offensive line is in absolute shambles. If we can't run the ball, NO is going to do what the Raiders did the whole 2nd half and just send the house on damn near every play.

This one could get ugly quick.


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