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2nd child of Pa. couple dies after only praying


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#46 Bronn

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 03:14 PM

Personally, I think the purpose of faith and believing in a creator is basically just intellectual laziness paired with an unwillingness to admit you don't have an answer for everything.

#47 pstall

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 03:27 PM

Personally, I think the purpose of faith and believing in a creator is basically just intellectual laziness paired with an unwillingness to admit you don't have an answer for everything.


i pray. believe in God and freely and easily admit I don't have the answer for everything. hence the first two things I said.

#48 PhillyB

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 03:31 PM

the agency of prayer indicates either that god is capricious and selective, or that prayer is an acquired skill set necessary to invoke intervention. both have pretty big implications

#49 Bronn

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 03:32 PM

My point, though, is that, for a lot of people, God is an all encompassing catch-all for questions or situations they don't want to seek tangible answers for...

I don't know anything... But I don't really see the point in giving up looking for answers because of texts and ideas that aren't even the oldest example of spiritual canon...

#50 PhillyB

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 03:36 PM

It seems this couple had a lot of doubt.


so wait, if they had less doubt that not seeing a doctor would enable god to save their kid, god would've rewarded that lack of doubt? are you saying their problem wasn't in not seeing a doctor, but not trusting god enough?

THANKS A LOT GOD

#51 pstall

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 03:42 PM

this couple had an insincere faith. its very similar to people giving every penny to their church only to be broke. you have to have some common sense as well.

i will also say. saying that seeing a doctor is NOT trusting god is legalistic. thats exactly the same mindset as the pharisees. they wanted to punish people for getting an oxen stuck out in the field on a Sunday.
Of course Jesus comes along and blows that concept up.

#52 pstall

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 03:44 PM

My point, though, is that, for a lot of people, God is an all encompassing catch-all for questions or situations they don't want to seek tangible answers for...

I don't know anything... But I don't really see the point in giving up looking for answers because of texts and ideas that aren't even the oldest example of spiritual canon...


for some sure, they do just toss out a blanket religious jargon and their faith is more in their jargon or the church they go to as opposed to their faith in God directly.

there are numerous people that go to the same church as their relatives or believe what grandma did and have not once opened a bible or any other book and did their own homework.

its like..its like they have voted straight ticket for thinking/beliefs. hmmm

:lol:

#53 PhillyB

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 03:54 PM

this couple had an insincere faith. its very similar to people giving every penny to their church only to be broke. you have to have some common sense as well.


if they had done the exact same thing and the child was healed, this would be hailed as the most incredible act of faith ever and told in churches across america and the world as another act of god rewarding the faithful.

#54 pstall

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 04:09 PM

totally correct with a caveat. even the most faithful of christian would still go and make sure they do both what the doctor says so long as its not detrimental or unwise and pray.

there has been stories after stories where a doc may say there is nothing else that can be done and people pray and basiclly a miracle happens.
there has been times people have prayed and nothing, at least to what they can see, changed.

like i mentioned earlier. my kids will ask for something and i say no and they go but dad i said please. i think many of us as christians do this with God. or we pray for a day and nothing happens the way we want and we give up.

there is a reason we don't always get what we ask for in prayer. many lessons we don't learn until years and years later.

#55 GOOGLE RON PAUL

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 04:18 PM

no true christian would have done such a thing

#56 pstall

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 04:43 PM

i doubt it

#57 stirs

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 05:31 PM

Recognition of who God is, faith in God, or whatever you call it, is not a prerequisite for healing. Many instances of God healing people, raising from the dead, etc. for people who had never met God, much less expressed faith in him.

God is way more than, you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours

#58 SZ James

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 05:48 PM

no true christian would have done such a thing

.

every time

#59 pstall

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 05:57 PM

yesterday i was in wilmington for my father in laws funeral. after several months of fighting prostate cancer he moved on. for the last several months my wife has gone to see him every other weekend. drained, she comes home to me and my girls and tries to get back in the frame of mind to teach and do her job. so the rest of the week im trying to console and comfort her and the girls.

my wife who is pure gold as far as im concerned prayed and cried and wrestled with every moment. sure she prayed for a miracle but she also prayed he leaves peacefully. which in his sleep he did.

at no point did we go oh no meds or chemo for her dad. but the doc finally left it up to her dad and at 84 he said thats it.

my girls got lots of hang time with him the last couple of months and he gave me the charge to make sure i keep taking care of them.

i came from the other side of the tracks while my wife is a blue blood. i would joke it was like Vanilla Ice moving to Martha's Vineyard. at no point did he make me feel like he wish she had married Blake or Carter up the street. lol


its a tragic thing that happened to these kids and its tragic when any parent is reckless and unloving towards their child. no matter their belief system, or lack there of.


i just hope those on the huddle are reconciled to those that are close to them and you get the time to be with them and tell them things that are most important. because in the end. thats all that will matter.

#60 NanuqoftheNorth

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 06:40 PM

First Century Gospel Church: Statement of Beliefs (Excerpt)

http://www.fcgchurch...of Beliefs.html

Our commitment to God means that we trust God alone for physical healing without the use of medicine, drugs, prescriptions, pills, or human remedies. Jesus said to the woman Matthew 9:22 "your faith has healed you;" and the apostle reminded those listening Acts 3:16 “It is Jesus’ name and the faith that comes through him [faith being the condition] that has given this complete healing.”

FCG Church teaching emphasizes the importance of trusting God for financial support, both in our personal lives and the ministry. The church and its members do not ask for donations, nor do they make their financial needs known to anyone or any agency—not making the slightest hint that they are in need of funds. Philippians 4:6 ”Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God. 19 And my God will meet all your needs according to his [riches in glory by] Christ Jesus.”

The FCG Church believes and teaches that we are to trust God alone for protection from accidents, injury, theft, or loss and to not use safety seat-belts, hand guns, or any other device that is designed to protect a person from accidents or loss, as such devices are false places of trust that substitute for real faith in the living God. Our trust is to be totally on God to be protected from such incidents in the first place. Psalm 41:2 ”The LORD will protect him and preserve his life.”


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