tukafan21

I think you're only looking at his 4th quarter when the Lions stopped pressuring him and went into a shell defense. He had 146 yards, 1 TD, and 2 INTs through 3 Quarters, that's awful and him having a decent 4th quarter when he game was in hand for the Lions and they went into safe mode doesn't make it a good game for him. Just the fact that you think he's moving well in the pocket is all I need to see to show you have no idea what you're watching. He bounces around out there like a pinball just looking for a way out, keeps turning his back to the LOS to try and escape backwards, which is the worst thing any QB can do, let alone someone of his size who isn't able to break the tackles that he keeps turning into. He's been in so far over his head so far that anyone who sees anything different is just looking at it through Panthers fan glasses and can't objectively evaluate his play so far. What you think he can still be is of course up for debate, but what he's done isn't, the tape is out there and it's just facts, he's been the worst QB in the league so far.

A lot of us wanted NOTHING to do with Bryce during the pre-draft process because we had concerns about his game translating from college to the NFL. So far, he hasn't struggled like a normal rookie QB does, making some bad reads or dumb decisions because they're still a rookie. He's just flat out looked like he doesn't belong on this level, too small, not strong or fast enough to do what he did in college in NFL games. So far all he's done is confirmed our concerns beyond even our own expectations for what he'd be. We gave up the farm to get him We're pissed Sorry, but he's earned it with his play. You don't want to be criticized? Then don't be the #1 pick in the draft and then play like an undrafted rookie.

I'd rather trade Chinn or a 4th rounder than for Jeudy. I'm sooooooooooo against trading for Jeudy with his $13 million guaranteed contract next season. The guy is a minimally above a replacement level player, he's still living off his first round pick status but has never performed as such on the field. Then you add in how much of a hot head he is, and it's just a bad mix for Bryce and helping him develop. This is yet another "madden move" that people want to make in a vacuum without looking at the full picture.

Where do people come up with this stuff?!?! Injury prone? He missed most of his rookie season because of a torn ACL in college, that's a one time freak injury, not being injury prone. And yes, he had I think a pulled hamstring at the end of training camp, but that's pretty standard in the NFL today and I think they even said at that time that if he wasn't suspended, he'd have been able to play through it, but with the upcoming suspension they just shut him down to be safe. And the idiot part... I assume that's over the suspension. Sure, stupid thing to get busted doing, but he wasn't betting on the NFL, he was betting on another sport and just did it from the facility. I wouldn't call that being an idiot, it's called making a dumb mistake based on a dumb rule that clearly wasn't well told to all players given the number of them who got suspended over this stuff. I'm not saying hesitation over what he could be is unwarranted, even my Lions friends (I'm a Detroiter) aren't 100% sold on him just based on him not really being on the field much yet. But to say he's injury prone or an idiot is just ridiculous.

I’ve been calling for us to try this in here for weeks

Sorry, should I have just said the majority of the fan base? Because there is no way Fitterer has above 50% of the fan base wanting him to keep his job right now, I'd venture to guess that it's no more than 25-30% of the fans who still want him around.

LOL In no world is any team giving us 2 firsts for Bryce right now, that would be insane given how he's looked so far and the upcoming QB class. There isn't a QB needy team that would make that move as opposed to just being bad this year and hoping their first can get them one of the QB's. If anyone would make that trade, I'd do it right now and hurt myself from laughing too hard at how dumb they are.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but at the same time, if Tepper did force them to take Young, do you really think that Reich and Fitterer wouldn't have been saying the exact same stuff that they did? They're not going to come out and be like, "well we wanted Stroud but we had to take Young" Whether they wanted him or if Tepper forced it, you were always going to hear the exact same stuff out of them that we did, because they would have had to sell it as their decision in the end anyways.

The entire fan base wants Fitterer gone and many have already given up on Reich. To us fans, it seems obvious that Fitterer is already on borrowed time and it's only a matter of when, not if he'll be fired, with the day after the season ends being the longest he might stick around. But I was just thinking about it, and if the fans are right and Tepper forced them to pick Bryce, particularly if both of them liked Stroud more, could that buy both of them much more leeway than we've been considering? Yes, I know the team has a lot of problems, but when your biggest problem is the QB's play, if the owner forced the pick over what both the HC and GM wanted, it might be hard for him to then fire them all too quickly. Particularly as if say he did fire Fitterer soon, if Tepper forced that pick over what they wanted, there is basically a 100% chance that information gets "leaked" out there, and that would make it quite difficult for Tepper to attract a quality candidate to take the GM role moving forward. If the owner is forcing such an important decision like that over the objections of both the GM and HC, then I can't see any quality GM candidate ever considering the job.

LOL, helllllllllllll no I love Diggs the player, but he'd be an utter disaster here. Look how unhappy he is at times while he has one of the best QB's throwing him the ball and on one of the best teams in the league with legit SB aspirations. Put him on the team with the worst starting QB in the league and who hasn't won a game yet this year, I'm sure that will make him super happy all the time and never cause any problems.

Where did I ever mention Hardman as a deep threat? All we do is run WR screens and 5 yard hitches, if you don't understand how much a quick twitch speed guy like Hardman would help out with those routes as opposed to a straight line speed guy like Chark, then I don't know what to say to you. Having speed at WR is used in far more ways than just go routes, do you not see what the Dolphins keep doing with Tyreek to just get the ball in his hands? Sure, he does have some go routes where he just beats the defense, but they love to just get the ball in his hands quickly and let him run.

This is why the second we made the trade, Thielen was my #1 FA target, his route running and overall professionalism that he brings to a team is exactly what you need for a rookie QB. He's also why I drafted him in my fantasy league and everyone else laughed at me, especially after I had to spend $6 in our auction to get him. But I knew he'd be that safety valve and catch a ton of passes, he's 10th in PPR scoring so far, and that's with a terrible first week.

So, you don't want to trade for a known speedster (something we currently don't have) on a low contract because you want to wait for a player who odds are won't be made available in a trade until the offseason, and instead want to give up a 3rd for someone with a large contract next year and has never lived up to expectations? Like I said in my thread the other day, Jeudy has been the #1 there since he stepped foot in the NFL and he has SEVEN total games in his career of over 77 yards receiving. The ONLY way I'd ever accpet a trade for Jeudy is if the Broncos are paying 75% of his contract next year and we give up no more than a 5th. He's marginally better than Chark this year and would cost us $13 million next year, in no world is he worth that to us, particularly when you then factor in giving up a 3rd to get him.

To be clear, I'm not saying they definitely can't, but just that I don't ever remember seeing it done, which makes me think you can't do it or we'd have seen it before.

Doubt the Bears would have agreed to that and I'm not even sure you can do those trades in the NFL like you can in the NBA. I think if you could, we'd see them happen more often, and I don't think I've ever seen it done. They can do it based on a player being traded and then how many snaps they play or how far your team makes it in the playoffs, but I've never seen an NFL pick traded with Top X protections like the NBA does.

I mean, no we don't know what he's making, but I know it's not even remotely close to the $36 million contract that Stroud got as the #2 pick this past year. Sure, he could take out some insurance against injury if he returns, but it's still a massive gamble when you're supposed to be such a high draft pick as a QB. Hell, even if he just has a shaky season, maybe gets injured and misses most of the year but isn't career ending and he then falls into the middle/late first round, that would cost him $25 million on his rookie deal. And all of that is still ignoring that waiting an extra year is one more year before he can sign one of those monster $200+ million contracts assuming he isn't a bust. There is a reason nobody else has pulled a Luck before and gone back to school instead of being a QB as a Top 3 pick in the draft, it really makes no sense. You're just better off refusing to sign with a team and forcing a trade like Eli, it might not be a great PR look, but it's the better financial move.

There aren’t any #1’s out there available outside of Higgins, who might not even be available until the offseason I brought this up in a thread a week or two ago since they weren’t using him at all, his speed along would be valuable as we don’t have anyone like that right now. I’d trade TMJ for him straight up

Even with the NIL situation now, I don’t see any QB turning down the NFL if they’re projected a Top 2 pick. They may try and pull an Eli and force a trade, but I can’t see anyone else doing a Luck and going back to school. At least not counting Shedeur, different situation with him playing for his dad and having just got to Colorado this year. Plus I believe Deion when he says his son isn’t going to the draft to be the 2nd pick, I think they’d rather risk waiting a year so he has a shot at being the #1 overall pick. Sure the NIL money is nice, but it’s still much less money than they’d make on their signing bonus and one more year until they’re able to sign a mega 2nd contract if they pan out.

Caleb Williams is about as sure a thing as you get for QB prospects these days. He’s right there with Luck and Lawrence in terms of best prospects in the last 20 years, his bare minimum floor is an above average NFL QB. Bryce’s floor even pre-draft was out of the league before his second contract with his size concerns.

Depends exactly what you mean by benefit of the doubt. In terms of how I personally feel about him as an NFL QB, well that ship has already sailed. Never liked him pre-draft due to physical limitations and injury concern, but accepted him as our pick and got on board with the "super brain" and was hopeful. But these first 4 games of his have shown my pre-draft concerns to be real life issues, and maybe even worse than I even was expecting, he really does look like a little kid out there. Don't get me wrong, I'm desperately hoping he proves me wrong and we don't need to replace him anytime soon and we can work to build a winning team around him. I just have no optimism left in that, I think he's a total bust, just as I expected during the pre-draft process. In terms of how long do we as a team give him? If we have a Top 5 pick in 2025 after 2 years, he hasn't shown drastically higher upside, and there is a QB prospect there worth taking, then I'm doing it. If there isn't a QB worth taking and he's still bad, then it really depends on the coaching situation. If Reich is still here, I give him that 3rd year as well and hope he either finally shows up or is bad enough to put us in position to draft someone new. If Reich is gone, it comes down to how the rest of the squad looks, if they're a solid group that can push for the division, I'm looking for someone new in FA for 2025, if not, I'm just letting the 3rd year play out, then cut him after the season and find someone in the draft or FA for 2026. Having all our picks again in 2026, I'm not against just completely sucking until then and doing a hard re-set on things. It's not what I want, but it just might be the best path forward for long term sustained success. Most rookies who struggle, it's because of mental mistakes because they're still not there yet, but he just physically doesn't look like he belongs out there, and I mean in way more ways than his stature, and that's quite concerning as there isn't much that can be done for that.

Also, to the point of the OP, I feel like their lack of playing time would actually signal the opposite. If we were trying to trade them, I'd think that we'd purposefully feature them in the hopes that they flash and helps draw more interest. At this point, it's not like a dud game from either is going to hurt their trade value with how we've been not using Chinn and how TMJ has looked most of his career. This just screams poor coaching decisions to me.

If we're not going to use Chinn, we HAVE to trade him, even more so than Burns. At least with Burns, if we don't trade him before the deadline, we can tag him and trade him in the offseason. But if we don't play Chinn, he's gone, 100%, he'd have no reason to want to come back here after they refused to use him this year and how bad we are. Lots of teams out there will know what he can do if used properly and he'll have suitors lined up around the block to sign him. I'd hate it as I love him, I think he's one of our better players and should be on the field for all snaps, but they don't seem to have any plan for him, which is baffling to me.

I don't think it's fair to knock the defense for points given up when they keep having to deal with short fields because of turnovers that Bryce caused. Not saying the defense is great, but the offense keeps putting them in terrible positions. The Lions had 3 TD drives yesterday that were 20, 38, and 31 yard drives. That's not on them, that's on the offense.

Yes, feel better about the team, as in our future, but I wouldn't feel any better about Bryce the player. He's just a classic example of someone who's skills were good enough to work in college and his "super brain" then took him to a different level. But since he doesn't have NFL level abilities, his "super brain" isn't able to make up for the lack of them, no matter how smart he might be. I think Bryce is going to be the next Dan Orlovsky or Kellen Moore. Someone who didn't have the physical abilities to make it in the league, but will excel in either the media or as an OC because of how he's able to see the game on a different level than others.