Mr. Scot

I think it's very possible you're going to see a good number of this year's draft picks make it, if for no other reason than that you have a new GM who's looking to make the roster fit his vision (along with Rhule's). I wouldn't be terribly surprised to see some of this year's draft picks displacing some prior years' draft picks.

For the record, in a presser given at the time Marty stated that the picks in the first three rounds were "need" picks. Everything from there on out was going to be BPA, but Burns, Little and Grier were taken specifically to fill existing holes on the roster.

Yeah, well... Is it "all time" bad, though? I mean, you've got potential guys like Miller and Daley, but it could be argued that they're zeroed out by the huge misses with Little and Grier.

In his latest Athletic article about a dozen players that are on the roster bubble (link), Joe Person mentions that the Panthers 2019 draft is starting to look like "an all time dud". Obviously, there's Brian Burns. But remember we also know that if Burns had been taken ahead of our pick, our first round choice would have been Greg Little. As it was, we still got Little, and even traded up for him. The rest of that draft though? Oy Here's the full list of players taken after Burns: Round 2 - Pick 37: Greg Little The aforementioned Little has already been discussed at length in this forum. I know there are a few who still think he could be saved by trying him at guard, but the reality is it's highly unlikely he could handle a position switch. Even with the injuries, his body isn't the biggest problem. It's his brain. Round 3 - Pick 100: QB Will Grier Another oft discussed topic, including the mention that Marty had Grier rated above some of the top quarterbacks in the draft. To his credit, Grier has been working on improving, but the outlook still isn't optimistic. Round 4 - Pick 115: LB Christian Miller Miller is in an unfortunate spot partially through no fault of his own. He was picked as part of the team transition to a 3-4 defense that went by the wayside with Ron Rivera's firing. Last year's opt out was a valid choice, but realistically speaking it probably didn't help his cause for this season. Round 5 - Pick 154: RB Jordan Scarlett Didn't make it through his first year in Carolina (injured after appearing in nine games) but Scarlett is still in the league. He spent last year on the Lions practice squad and is currently going to camp with the dolphins. Round 6 - Pick 212: OL Dennis Daley And here's another enigma like Miller. Daley has actually played decently when he's played. But he's had a rough time staying healthy, especially last year. Could wind up sticking as depth this year but it's not guaranteed. Round 7 - Pick 237: WR Terry Godwin Be honest. If I had asked you to name who our 7th round pick was in 2019, would you have remembered him? ... FYI: Grier, Little and Miller are all on Person's roster bubble along with players like Keith Kirkwood, Marquis Haynes, Troy Pride and Kenny Robinson. Person said he was tempted to throw Ian Thomas on there but thinks he'll make it. JJ Jansen is on it for obvious reasons and Joey Slye might be if another kicker is brought in. It's probably fair to characterize this draft as Brian Burns and not much else. Reminds me of the 2011 Draft where we came out of it with nobody but Cam Newton. Yeah, Newton was great, but getting pretty much nothing out of every other pick was a disaster. I'd say Miller and Daley at least still have a chance to show something, but it wouldn't be a terrible surprise if they didn't make it. Little and Grier of course are both huge misses at positions where we really couldn't afford to miss. So is it fair to characterize this draft as an 'all time dud"? Would you consider it better or worse than the 2011 Draft? And how much chance do you give the players that still remain from it to stick with the team?

I don't think he's trolling

Technically, they've got two of 'em. The Lions also brought back Chris Spielman in a consultant sort of capacity. Word was that Spielman is one of the reasons Dan Campbell got the head coaching job.

That's the part that scares me.

His initial press conference made a lot of people cringe, but I think it's very possible Campbell could turn out to be a pretty good coach.

Toomers is a Steelers troll who apparently doesn't have anything better to do with his life than argue dumb sh-t on a Panthers board. He's not worth the effort. Sizzlebuzz? That one's...hard to explain. He's been on here under other IDs before. His current one has a weird obsession with David Tepper.

No. Prior to that they were talking to teams around the league about trading up. They even offered us a deal.

Well, most of us know that Matt Rhule wanted to trade down, but Hurney decided to stick and take Derrick Brown. You don't, but that's not exactly a shot.

Coachspeak generally applies to discussions about players. There's zero reason whatsoever for him to lie about something like this. And given that anyone else who's spoken on the issue says the same thing, there's no reason to doubt it. I'm sorry if your hero worship of David Tepper is taking a hit, but this is reality.

The guy who gave him the contract did get fired. Matt Rhule is not getting fired. It's pretty stupid to even suggest it.

Scot saying it doesn't make it true. Matt Rhule saying it does, though.

Stats are affected by rule changes. Quality of play not so much. I can tell you from watching that the quality of play in the NFL isn't what it used to be. Colleges changing systems would not be the only reason, but it's a reason.

People have been arguing for the NFL to fully embrace a minor league system for years and years. No idea why they don't given how much of a benefit it would be to the game. (outside of the fact that as a whole, they're a bunch of greedy sons of b-tches who don't like to spend any money they don't have to)

I'd have to look it up, but I remember a few years back reading an extensive article about how colleges moving away from pro style systems to super simplified offenses wasn't doing players any favors when it came to their pro transitions, especially quarterbacks and wide receivers. Obviously though, the goal of a college program isn't to prepare players for the pros. It's to win games.

Agree that system is way more important than school. When Jeff Tedford was at Cal, he consistently produced highly drafted busts like Kyle Boller...up till that Rodgers guy, of course. There are always exceptions. You just have to be really careful about picking a guy who you're counting on to be that exception.

Okay, I'm genuinely curious. Are you making a serious effort to post the dumbest sh-t possible or are you genuinely this dim?

I thought that was good news. Person mentioned that some of the things the Players Association recommended were things that the Panthers were already doing.

As to Newton, I think all but the most delusional understand he's not who he used to be. Suggestions that he's going to return to MVP form are just cringeworthy. The only question is whether he can be a better version of what he was last year. Will another year of work lead to improvement, or will another year of wear and tear lead to decline? I'd say both are equally possible.

That's kind of like saying Maxwell Smart solved a case because he's a genius.

Looked up some highlights from his college career just out of pure curiosity... I don't recommend "highlight reel" scouting, and I don't really know how much of that guy is left after his health struggles, but I would at least say that his college tape isn't bad.

A lot of GMs that perform poorly don't get as many seasons as Marty did. Hell, if not for the Richardson scandal, Marty might still be in charge.

Fun clip, dude.