CRA

If Anthony Richardson didn’t exist, Bryce Young would have lead the NFL in bad throw % in both 2023 AND in 2024. bad OL and highest paid OL. Bryce the constant.

I mean, Carolina in their negotiations should have had the Vikings put Howell in their deal. Give AT, get the 4th and Howell…..then negotiate eating cap or a pick swap if needed.

Well, you just look to the next season where Carolina had the most expensive OL in all the NFL…..and I shared with the analytics where the exact same open and yac issues exist there. And he didn’t have 19th string OGs, he had great OGs that suited up all year. I just don’t get why people are dug into over defense of BY. We know he doesn’t have great physical tools. We know he can’t make all the throws. And that is going to lower the ceiling/potential and we know defenses adjust when a QB can’t hit all the throws on the field. He isn’t going to grow a new body/arm. So for me, he is just our QB for now at this point. I’ll pull for him. But I’ll view him like every other player in the big picture people (Bryce defenders) are cool with replacing and upgrading. And then I favor the growth of bigger picture players (which is why I am done with AT). Biggest issue probably is some think this is a team that is about to compete and I view it as a development team

I didn’t intentionally leave them out (frankly, I forgot about them). Mingo was a bad WR that was traded in season to be depth on a team (without Dak). Not sure that makes any point. I’ll give you Dionte Johnson as the actual outlier to my point. But that’s what he is. But what’s the more reasonable argument? That it’s all the WRs. Essentially every single one of vastly different skill sets? Or it’s more the QB and the O scheme? And how Ds play Bryce in it.

every route run https://espnanalytics.com/receivers you can sort by open, YAC and catch ratings by next gen. WRs don’t get open and there is no YAC on this team. Some of its players. Some is scheme. Some is Bryce. *YAC sorts pretty similar to OPEN with Coker being the anomaly. Gotta think that one might be skewed with that huge busted coverage play he had which is a massive % of his YAC on the year

They weren’t getting open. ESPN analytics grades 159 receiving options getting open in 2024 159 - Tremble 148 - Saunders 148 - Moore 126 - Coker 108 - Leggette 92 - Theilen our shining star getting open was AT ranked at number #92 in the NFL

Correct. It’s really hard to get open in the NFL when opposing defenses gameplan and cheat coverage/routes on all your players because they know your QB can’t make certain throws/plays. magically no one that comes to Carolina can get open or make plays with the ball in their hands…..it’s like there is one singular common dominator to it all. BY makes playing defense way too easy. NFL players are too good to allow one side to cheat coverage and not respect all the potential threats of a route so you can dial up a great play. But if corners and safeties just cheat coverage and know X and Y happening on route/threats….getting open gets hard when they just play it one way. Getting open has a lot to do with the different threats a WR can pose on a given play.

They are just JAG role players. Chark was brought in to do a specific role and BY doesn’t even do that. Hurst is Hurst. BY just opted for his favorite TE which is AT. Frank Reich is NFL a boring middle of the pack NFL coach. He isn’t a bad coach. He just isn’t a good coach. Frank had a horrible year in Carolina because we are a poorly run pooshow at ownership/GM. Square pegs and round holes. Random parts. And he didn’t want a unicorn in BY that can’t make the throws a boring Frank O needs.

Yeah, Dalton is a washed and aging QB collecting checks. He gets worse. Bryce on the year, wasn’t really that much better. we saw the base line for Dalton. We saw the bad Skins game. If he played more we would saw the law of averages good game or so added in for Dalton too. End of the day, BY doesn’t have the tools you want for a NFL QB. Simple as that. Everyone largely knows it. We all know the most likely ending because of it at this point IMO. I have or had way more patience for college kids. I don’t care to try to wish a nice kid into something good at the NFL level.

Part of the reason no one wasn’t getting open is because of BY. That’s generally gets omitted. His part in the why. if you don’t have to respect different areas of the field and throws….you get to cheat coverage on plays and routes as a defense/defender. Getting open gets much harder. and I referenced it earlier, best offensive day of that season was the one game Young didn’t play and washed up Dalton took the field it’s always everyone else. Frank Reich tried all he could. But Frank is a generic NFL HC. And he is not a bad HC. BY doesn’t do the basics at a high enough level because of his tools….not just lack of experience. So if things aren’t great, it will go bad with BY. And if the table ever gets set for REALLY good….you likely won’t see that either with BY. only Bryce is going to change my opinion at this stage. Not his believers

Well, that is the repeated narrative. We did have a tiny glimpse into if that was true or not though that year. the one game Bryce sat…resulted in the best offensive production on the season. I don’t think anyone was “succeeding”….but I do think given Young’s tools whatever potential exists, Bryce Young’s tools can’t max whatever potential does exist in any sort of traditional scheme. You could throw Bryce Young into the Greatest Show on Turf. I would guess, it would just be a pretty good O. I just don’t see how you get to a high powered O with Bryce Young without it being some super creative O with top tier playmakers. That’s not me saying he can’t play. I think he caps potential

Well, the whole rationale used for the high IQ point guard is it would allow us to spend our resources elsewhere….instead it’s all our first rounders ever since to support the bad pick. Reality is our front office is just bad. If you wanted Bryce Young you were going to need to do something unique and special for him. Instead we just insert a QB with traditional tools into old NFL concepts that pair with traditional talent and our pass game is whack

Maybe it doesn’t matter how it is billed. But I know there are about a billion reasons named for why Bryce Young has stunk. The simplistic answer is probably the right one. It’s Bryce. A unicorn NFL QB in terms of the tools he works with. Frank Reich wasn’t Rhule. It was that bad because of Bryce. whatever scenario Bryce is in, I just think his tools aren’t strong enough and brings things down. Where you want the opposite effect to occur. Was last year a little better than the first year? Most expensive OL in the NFL. the cute random scrambles don’t make up for the lack of arm at this level. He can’t scare a D if he isn’t set…arm can’t make those throws. Even when set it’s iffy if he can actually make teams pay with certain throws. Just a very low ceiling QB in terms of his arm. I think there is enough play where that’s not a hot take.

That roster was billed as a super smart and strong unit for a young QB….until he sucked though. it didn’t have superstars but it had proven vets that checked well all the safe boxes and it was universally agreed the Panthers were putting him into position to succeed. BY just doesn’t fit a traditional O because he isn’t built like a traditional QB. And he still doesn’t. CJ Stroud would have had more success here than Bryce with that cast. CJ just has the tools that fit the NFL more easily. Young can find success but I have always argued it would take a Bryce centric plan (which we have never attempted IMO)

Past 5 seasons, IMO CJ Stroud and Joe Burrow are the 2 best young QBs that have emerged in the league in that window. They also didn’t need vets to be their primary pass catchers. They helped fellow youngsters be great at WR. almost all the other young QBs have been paired up with vets in their top options….and haven’t been as promising. so it isn’t Madden. But the league hasn’t played out as you suggest it does. Good QBs make others around them better.

Moore had one of the higher drop % in the NFL last year paired with the worst YAC per reception in the NFL we got to get these painfully low ceiling dudes off the roster IMO

Should have taken that 4th. Big picture though, the entire thing from paying him out of retirement, to almost dealing him, etc. just sort of highlights how this org front office really lacks a plan or vision. we live in 3 WR sets. I’d take a 4th and getting Coker reps as a win for a team that needs to be all in on developing and building. I get the security aspect for BY…but developing other players outweighs the BY emphasis at this stage for me. AT is meaningless going forward and BY carries decent odds of being meaningless too. AT also isn’t diverse enough to play wide. Running the young big 3 also lets you rotate all of the big 3 into the slot while always keep 2 of them wide

Cam was also a drafted to be a one man wrecking crew….and was that starting week 1 his rookie year. BY was drafted to be high functioning mentalist where we could get by with less on offense because he could function at such a high level. Yet we have had to spend back to back first round picks on WRs and needs his vet WR to manage things at the snap….and he is the owner of the worst pass O in the NFL since arriving into the league

Well, I’m no BY defender… but Cam Newton had a lot of help from vets too. Kalil I think called his protections. I think it’s also out there Olsen was pretty vocal in the huddle as well if Cam wasn’t on top of things

Someone was reporting some cap stuff too. Vikings need to either create some or wanted us eat more (which in theory would better the pick)

feels like just yesterday I was being lectured as a delusional non-objective hater for discussing an AT to Minny deal and why it could make sense for both parties.

Well, Bryce was literally dead and buried. We ended the BY experiment 2 games into the season. He was done in Carolina The miracle is basically just being brought back to life and a pulse

Well, that’s what happened last year. The Carolina Panthers moved on from Bryce Young. And they did it quick. Think was sort of the deal when they hired Canales. then in standard Panther fashion, there plan blew up in their face. Canales sort of allowed the miracle to happen. So now he is fugged IMO big picture.

It’s like everyone forgets, Canales got Tepper to green light ending the Bryce Young experiment just 2 games into the season. THAT happened. And I still say all the investments on O have been one that doesn’t factor in Young. Bryce’s rise from the literal grave….wasn’t planned or the vision IMO. Bryce IMO fugged up the plan. Now we are in no man’s land

Strong disagree on this take. They both serve the same role. But how they run their routes and go about getting there ain’t the same. Renfrow runs some of the most distinct routes in all the NFL….its necessary for him because of his size issues. Renfrow couldn’t make a rec league if did everything like AT out there with worse hands. They arent similar route runners. They do try to achieve the same outcome for their teams though