CRA

Difference between you and I here on this convo….is you only acknowledge PFF. It’s hyper fixation from folks that get creative and blinders to the rest. Put that one website to the side, and all the other aspects we use to declare what top 10 looks like wouldn’t put Bryce in that type talk.

I’m getting 2 of 7 off his passing chart that day for balls that traveled at least 20 yards in the air. And 20 yards in the air is largely the consensus of a deep ball. that’s why I keep saying people are just running with a headline. Because his best in the week deep declaration is based off a 2 of 7 day. PFF is declaring him best off the day and using plays like a 50/50 jump ball to AT that went incomplete to build it. That week was full of guys that factually were better deep…..everywhere but PFFs website. Lamar, Stafford, Nix and on and on were all better in reality that week. Hell, Mahomes in that same game. PFF basically does a what if alternate reality on those deep throws. So the volume of just throwing up a jump ball aids the PFF stat pending it’s a good 50/50 ball.

yeah, but gets into what I have been saying. The argument doesn’t exist without PFF in a world where 2 of 7 and 0 TDs is better than 3 of 4 with a TD. That’s the PFF world. and if you put PFF to the side and use everything else….there is virtually no argument.

The framing continues to be if you disagree with this top 10 play making….its then somehow spun as denying his improvement or hating. if you take Bryce’s career and exclude his last 2 starts……there really is no objective argument that isn’t a bottom tier starter to date. Is yeah, it’s cherry picking, recency bias and his surprising inability improvement driving it into a bit of silliness. Literally nothing argued here except the top 10 stuff is overkill. But it’s also the same time of year when folks can get bashed for saying Frank is a bad hire, Fitterer sucks and should be fired with Rhule, Ben McAdoo was a joke hire for a staff that forced into rejects, Rhule doesn’t know what he is doing and clearly exposed when reporters got into camp, the Sam/Baker comp and not picking one is dumb, and on and on. Lot of frankly conservative takes are spun as wild hate this time of year.

I don’t think there is a single poster arguing against his clear progress last year. That’s not what is being argued when people dismiss this top 10 play narrative. And you have to cherry pick hard to get there and largely exclusively use PFF most subjective deep dives to get there. And the best example of that is their week 12 best deep passer stat line…..when in reality went 2 for 7 no TDs in a week where folks were factually much better

Sure, but even that is vague and subjective. Because there definition is vague and subjective. So I assume they are counting games where a 50/50 jump ball that falls complete is a big time throw. because that best deep passer week 12 is just sort silly in the grand scheme. He went 2 of 7. So they have to count those passer which create sort of a bull argument

What's the cherry pick you are using though? Because it's not just post benching. and that's where my issue is, if you are using a tiny cherry pick of post benching vs his peers afforded no cherry picking at all on the year......well, then it just a bunch of fun to be had. I mean, I'm not really looking to keep this one going. My point isn't to bash Bryce. But he was just about as average as it gets the overwhelming majority of his post benching play in reality. Which was a HUGE leap for him and worthy for us to be excited about. The final 2 games of the season where a great ending that he hopefully care momentum forward in. But that's not a big enough resume where anyone outside a segment of the Panther fanbase would by top 10 play of.

first rule they would teach any proper GM in GM School is if the Steelers are trying to trade you a WR.....you tell them no thank you and block the number.

Screen starts black. Fades to David Tepper sitting in a chair in an empty room. He reads the 17 opponents in order in 30 seconds. Fades to black. And that will be the best thing David Tepper has ever done here.

I think you need a big arm to make certain throws to the perimeter. Deep is DNA, timing and placement.

The entertainment of disagreeing over nonsense we barely know about has been basically the only perk of being a Panthers fan the last decade

My prediction is at some point this season the masses go from calling me a BY hater to a BY defender…..when the over the top crowd swings to hard the other way when he isn’t what they are selling. I think expecting top 10 numbers from Bryce in what is really a sophomore season in my eyes….is setting up for disappointment.

Teddy Bridgewater was a check down QB….saying that doesn’t mean that he literally can’t and won’t throw downfield in a season. Bryce Young was never drafted to be big armed downfield passer. I don’t get those out defending him when it’s pointed out that he just isn’t that. And finding a game or two where he goes downfield doesn’t change much. Because all QBs eventually go downfield. Just like a Delhomme or Favre will play it safe in some random games. Doesn’t mean they aren’t gunslingers that got gambling in their DNA.

I don’t think being anti-Bryce was really a top 10 QB and great deep passer by years end …..is giving the rest of the league too much credit. People just running way too far with his improvement. Which was massive by year end. But that’s because of how bad he was…not because he was playing like a top tier QB

Sure, but I have long acknowledged he got better. He went from horrific to mid-lower end starter. But now you can’t say that…..you got people wanting to spin top 10 play if you look at it this way, great deep ball passer if you only acknowledge x. I mean the headline in that article is nice for fans to run with. But in reality Bryce Young was not the best deep passer in week 12. Far from it. He went 2 of 7 with no TDs deep. The week was full of guy who went something along the lines of 3 of 4 with a bomb TD. So Bryce then gets appointed best deep passer for say….plays like a 50/50 jump ball while trailing late to a fully covered AT that goes incomplete but could have been something given how the defender played it….not an actual good play. But that could have been a good play. I mean, same play could have been a pick if everything else was the same and the defender who had AT blanketed played the ball better (nothing changes for Bryce in terms of what he did. It’s just a 50/50ish ball to someone covered)….and his entire best deep passer week 12 is built off plays that never happened over guys that actually got it done. we should be happy Bryce went from shouldn’t of been drafted play to serviceable starter last year. But all this spin that he is somehow actually sneaky great just ain’t something I’m doing yet

Clearly, I was referencing the “or into tight windows” aspect of their stat and why it’s muddy what they are even including. Because again, that’s our pass attack at large. WRs that ain’t open much. I think people have drastically oversold the deep ball last year. They were rare. Did he hit some? Absolutely. The fact teams showed it no respect helped. The Panthers overall were factually one of the least threatening teams downfield under Bryce.

Based on their definition, basically 90% of well placed balls to Adam Theilen would count as a big time throws. Because all those are tight windows. That’s where I think the definition is muddy in terms of what they do and don’t count. Probably would help figure it out if we had a game and the number of throws they award him to get an idea of what does and doesn’t count a pass with high difficulty and value, often characterized by excellent ball location and timing, typically thrown further downfield or into a tighter window

So you can explain how he was top 10....but won't. We need to look it up ourselves? I googled it. Can't find the argument based on stats and facts.

Well, I think Nike has it all down to a sweet mathematical science to max revenue of what they average person will buy in terms of price....and what the average person will do with a dirty jersey. Then they construct them accordingly. and yeah, it's not about being tackled in them but I'm sure Nike knows exactly how each tier will react to washings...and then sunlight, heat, fading and on and on. Just asking google about it there are tons of tiktoks, you tubes, reddit posts, etc with folks complaining about what a simple wash can do to a new one. Your washing machine gets cooler tech....so you pay more now and it doesn't last as long . My son's football cleats that help max speed got a hole in them before they even made it into the season this past year. Now our football jersey's are lightweight with new mesh because it's totally better.....the end game is always because the big corporations have found the synergy between new and improved and not lasting as long. That's my take. I think everything is made to wear out sooner under the guise of but it's better today.

yeah, but the actual jersey Bryce Young is wearing is not the same jersey you are buying from Fanatics. it's why the fine print on even the highest tier jersey you can buy.....is very specific. And they use words like inspired, closest to, better than lower variants.

my understanding is a big time throw, could be a 5-10 yard slant to Adam Thielen given AT isn't going to separate.

93% of his pass attempts last year are post benching to final game (starting with Denver).

or....their job is to sell as many jersey's as humanly possible. Which mean like products all over the map.....they are designed to intentionally have a shorten shelf life....so that you have to buy more. They don't want you to buy a jersey someone's rookie season and it last for their career. They need you to comeback and buy it again.

It's a really just a weird anomaly of a stat IMO For example, Bryce essentially had the worst on target % in the NFL last year. That stat wouldn't lead you to believe that was also true. He throws shorter than almost the entire league on average. He naturally plays a more risk adverse brand of football. So despite bringing heaviest % of off target throws to anyone on that graph.....they aren't all that aggressive and he is missing into the sideline for example often, thus....aren't deemed "turnover worthy". Which is fine. It's smart football for us. But it's also why the ceiling of everything is just so low.

that's the element of surprise for you. A good playcall. GB clearly not playing such a call in any fashion.