Mr. Scot

While I'm at it, lemme throw out a name for discussion... Yea or nay: Roman Harper

Does Kuechly have to be on the list? Luke may indeed be the best linebacker in the game and arguably the best player on the team, but neither he (nor Newton for that matter) is yet locked up long term and Luke is only coming into his fourth year as a pro. If you were running a billion dollar business, how seriously would you take the ideas of a guy with only three years experience in the most basic level of that profession? Little doubt that Luke will have the ear of Richardson if things continue as they are, but has he really earned it already?

Pretty solid writeup.

We're not talking about cutting a player from a Madden roster here. This is a multi-million dollar decision, and you can bet that all factors will be taken into account when that decision is made. You throw millions of dollars at that guy and he makes another "questionable decision", you just screwed your team, your cap, your coaches, your fans, etc. If you wanna get an idea of how much this means, answer this: Would you be willing to go to a bookie and bet, say five to ten thousand dollars of your own money that Hardy will be a model citizen from here on out? If you're confident enough to suggest the Panthers should bet millions of their cap room on that notion, then you oughtta be confident enough to put your own money on the line too, right?

No owner in the league polls fan opinions when making business decisions, nor should they. Olsen I completely agree with. Johnson is possible, but I'm not as certain.

Thomas Davis is the most obvious choice. Doubt anyone would disagree with that.

It's amazing that technically an innocent man

In his Black and Blue Review article about players lobbying for Greg Hardy, Bill Voth mentioned that among those doing it were players who "have Jerry Richardson's ear". Now to be clear, this thread is not about figuring out who's lobbying for Hardy. Feel free to start that discussion in a new thread or in one of the half-dozen Hardy threads already active if you like, but that's not the point here. Instead, I'm throwing out this general question... What Panther players on offense, defense and special teams have enough standing on this team that owner Jerry Richardson is willing to give real weight to what they have to say? (I'll save my own thoughts for later, except to say my general sense is it would be a relatively small number of players)

Why limit it to your lifetime?

Then why do Jerry Richardson and "others in the building" think he isn't trustworthy?

And yet we still managed to field one of the best defenses in the league by season's end. Believe it or not, our entire fortunes next season aren't going to rise and fall on Greg Hardy.

There's pretty good evidence he was gonna be too expensive to keep anyway. And 'blank check' negotiations put us in the kind of cap hell that we're just now starting to climb out of.

The vast majority of players understand that it's a business. Popular guys get let go on an annual basis from every team in the league. The Panthers aren't unique in that, and any player looking for a team where that doesn't happen is gonna be sorely disappointed. And we don't know that Hardy is 'begging to come back'. The whole 'play for free' thing could easily just be talk. Heck we don't even know how many teammates are actually backing Hardy. Regardless, no front office in the league polls players before making roster decisions, nor should they.

Pretty good chance that if someone else offers Hardy a lot more money than we do, Hardy won't want to be here either.

Players aren't the ones responsible for making roster decisions, and for good reason. Nobody'd ever get let go and everybody'd get paid large salaries (basically what Marty Hurney did). The guys who do make the roster decisions are the ones who don't think they can trust Hardy.

Greg Hardy's likely just going to be allowed to walk via free agency and he'll probably get a pretty good payday wherever he goes. That's something that happens on an annual basis. Ted Ginn, Mike Mitchell, Captain Munnerlyn and others have been allowed to find deals elsewhere in recent years. Others will this year too. Now take Steve Smith, on the other hand, who was proactively cut. If Steve Smith being let go didn't divide the team, what makes you think letting Greg Hardy get paid somewhere else will?

Well yeah, if you excuse anything he does, then there's no pattern. The story about his tweeting the pic while driving was well known and discussed plenty within this forum. Steve Smith was said to have famously ripped him for it at the time. Voth's article about teammates lobbying for him states specifically that "Richardson and others inside the building feel like they can't trust him". No stretch to expect Dave Gettleman is among the "others". Spin it any way you want but no matter what fans think, if Richardson and Gettleman see enough of a pattern that they think Hardy can't be trusted, he's not coming back.

The kind that doesn't trust him to stay out of trouble well enough to earn a big money contract. It's just like how Josh Gordon is a great receiver...when he's not suspended. Guys who are suspended don't help you win a lot of games.

Word from inside the Niners locker room was that his act was wearing thin on a lot of guys. Many people point to the diminishing returns this season as part of that. The whole "constantly yelling and screaming" thing is something that can work pretty well on a group of kids who'll be playing under you for generally four years at most. On a group of paid professional adults with the means to seek out other opportunities, not so much.

Voth gave no names, but he did say it was "team leaders, guys who have (Jerry) Richardson’s ear." He also said this... Not sure how many people read those particular lines in the article. Pretty good odds that "others inside the building" includes Dave Gettleman. Voth is still only giving this a "slim chance". Hardy fans probably shouldn't get their hopes up.

Best wishes from here, sweetie

I actually think Geep (pronounced 'Jeep') Chryst is a good choice for OC. That said, I still think the Niners will suck this year (and probably for a while).

I had a hard time believing he'd survive the Ray Rice fiasco. Granted the league slyly limiting the investigation (i.e. having Mueller refrain from investigating whether there was a cover up) was a clear CYA gesture. Now they can say "see, we had an independent investigation and found nothing", even if they really didn't. But after all that, in a year when the league took more hits than Glass Joe in Mike Tyson's Punch Out, they still paid him 35 million. Something tells me a few fan complaints or boos from the draft audience isn't likely to change their minds.

Wasn't talking about Hardy giving money back. People have suggested that the league should give the Panthers extra cap space as an apology for screwing them over last year. Like I said, delusional. I've been pretty vocal about the league's CYA tactics in the wake of the Ray Rice screwup. To be fair, domestic violence rightly should net a large penalty, but the charge that the league is overcompensating right now could very well have some merit. That ship may right itself down the road, but for now the league has image problems and Hardy is a reminder of them. Beyond that though... Objectively speaking, even without the domestic violence trial, it was going to be highly unlikely that Hardy would stay a Panther this year. He'd already reportedly turned down an 8 million a year offer. Much as I enjoyed having him on the roster, I couldn't have gotten behind a bigger offer than that.

Yeah, you'd have a hard time finding anyone who'd say "oh my gosh, I never suspected".