OnlyPantherFaninMaine

My man, where the heck did I bring up passing at all? I was making the case for Dalton's running game being superior to Cam's since they both entered the league. If we eliminate 2014 (which I find silly in the first place) Dalton's backs out-rushed Cam's 4,823 to 4,490. Cam's backs scored three more times in that three year span. So there was a difference, although not by a whole lot. But to ignore 2014 because of injuries just doesn't make a whole lot of sense. I'm sure the Bengals took some hits to their RB corps from 2011-2014 that I don't care to look up. As I said, part of the game.

WOW!! was advising we actually build around our franchise QB. When the Bengals have built around Dalton, they have the production (in both TDs and yards on the ground) to show for it. Dalton has some elite pieces around him and he's still pretty average. Cam has been a bit better than average with sub-par pieces around him. It's time we build around him and help him to elevate his game. /I am done.

And yet, this whole debate was started over who had/has had the better supporting cast since entering the league. Why are we ignoring 2014, because it fits your argument? We can't just pretend 2014 never happened. Heck, Gio Bernard was injured last year too. I've shown you with "stats", that you brought up in the first place, that Dalton's running game has been superior in both yards and in touchdowns since 2011. Where are your stats?

Cam's backs touchdown production steadily declining with age: 2011 - 12 Total 2012 - 13 Total 2013 - 8 Total 2014 - 4 Total Dalton's backs touchdown production increasing by drafting talent at the RB position around him: 2011 - 9 Total 2012 - 7 Total 2013 - 14 Total 2014 - 15 Total Obviously quite a bit of that has to do with the superior offensive line in Cincinnati and some differences in play calling in the red zone...but damn I'd say Dalton has a better supporting cast at the RB position. Would have been foolish to draft younger backs prior to this year due to the stable we already had and their cost, but it's pretty telling the impact a couple young second-round workhorses can have on an offense.

Almost forgot.. outside of out-gaining Panther RBs by nearly 1,000 yards on the ground since 2011, Dalton's backs have also accounted for 45 total touchdowns while Cam's have accounted for 37 on the ground. Not a massive difference, but more production nonetheless. If you going to bang the stats drum to support your claims at least make sure they actually back up what you're attempting to argue rather than work against you. It's also worth noting that Cam's RB production in terms of touchdowns has been steadily declining since 2011 while Dalton's have steadily improved since 2011. Probably a direct correlation between drafting good young backs and riding old expensive backs into the ground.

Why does it matter who is running the ball be it receivers or backs? We are talking about the rushing game here. I'm willing to bet receiver designed runs are pretty minimal for both teams. I don't have all day to go look at every run and throw out runs by receivers over four season of football. I added up rushing totals from 2011, 2012, 2013, and 2014 and subtracted the career rushing totals for both Dalton and Cam and the Bengals out-rushed Carolina by nearly 1,000 yards in that time. I don't have the time to pick through those stats and determine the differences in YPC and attempts without Dalton and Cam's averages included and their numbers skewing the results.

Injuries are apart of the game. Every team deals with them. The Bengals have a better rushing attack and a superior offensive line. The stats, since you are so fond of them, back that claim up as well.

Actually, I did take the time to look up the rushing stats for each team from 2011 onwards. Subtracting Cam's rushing totals, the Panthers have amassed 5,987 yards on the ground. Subtracting Dalton's rushing totals, the Bengals have amassed 6,801 yards on the ground. So yeah, Dalton's running game has been superior in yards and in touchdowns. Better backs behind a better offensive line, and that's what you get. Next.

I have no problem looking with my own two eyes and seeing that the Bengals have a superior running game. I'm not about to take the time to subtract Cam and Dalton's rushing stats from the team totals since 2011 and see who had a better running game. As for last year...the Bengals had 15 rushing touchdowns from their backs outside of Dalton on the ground. Subtract Cam's rushing TDs...Carolina backs accounted for 4. Four touchdowns for all running backs in an entire season. That is a problem.

All I want is for this team to legitimately make a real effort to build around our franchise QB. Can you think of a team that has put less around their young QB lately? This defense as is can be amongst the leagues best. We are severely lacking talent on the offensive side of the ball outside of KB, Olsen, and Cam. Stew is great when he is healthy and that hasn't been the norm. Sign Jennings, draft a big time talent at WR in the first and a couple tackles to develop and I'm one happy camper. If we come out loading up on the defensive side of the ball in the draft don't be surprised when our offense is poor and Cam takes a beating once again. There's no excuse for that. This entire off-season should be dedicated to putting our young franchise QB in a position to succeed.

Can't overlook that Dalton has one of the best offensive lines in the league and two great young backs. He doesn't have to shoulder the running and passing game like Cam does. He's got two bookend tackles, an elite WR, two dominant young backs, one of the leagues best OCs, and good guards to boot. The only position we are better at on offense than the Bengals is QB and TE. Kalil is damn good but their line is pretty stacked across the board. They've drafted and made an effort to put real talent around Dalton at all levels. Green, Sanu, Eifert (high 1st round pick) and two second round backs that will make up the best 1/2 punch in the game next season. Jeremy Hill may already be better than Gio Bernard. Put Cam in that offense and he has lead that team to numerous playoff wins and probably an AFC Championship game as well.

Where are you getting your info that Perriman possesses "very little football smarts"?

People knocking Perriman and exclaiming we won't draft him probably said the same thing about Kelvin last year. Similar knocks on their game and rawness at the position, but Breshad is the better athlete. Improved his play every season even after losing Bortles to the draft a season prior to his final year in college. Him being a hands-catcher leads me to believe he can improve there and he is fluid in his movements. Tidy up that route running and he's got about as much upside as any guy in the draft.

Interesting is a good word for that duo. Frustrating as hell with the drops but limitless potential. Two big bodies and a mismatch for any defense. Throw in Olsen and Cam would finally have a formidable cast of pass-catchers.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000451775/article/panthers-not-fretting-kelvin-benjamins-drops According to this article Benjamin actually dropped a higher % of balls this past season as a pro. Pro vs. College obviously different but it warrants being said. Carolina showed they won't shy away from drafting boom/bust guys; especially at the WR position.

He was a fringe first round guy prior to running a sub 4.3 at 6'2 215lbs. Doubtful he slips to second after running one of he fastest 40 times ever. He backed up the explosion demonstrated on tape and then some today. Made himself money without a doubt.

That's what I've been trying to find out. I've seen some videos of his vertical and broad jump but no official numbers. I want to know how he did in receiving drills.

Similar to Kelvin. Made many of the tough catches but dropped some easy ones. Can't teach his athletic ability and he's got the size and speed to take the top off a defense. Gettleman fell in love with Kelvin's physical traits.

Hands and route running his biggest knock... but that didn't stop us from drafting Kelvin at 28. Perriman even before blowing up his pro day was on my short list of guys I like at 25. Dave Gettleman "You just can't teach sub 4.3 speed on a guy that large, he's a blue goose guys. Bup bup bup bup."

I see six first round receivers: White Cooper Parker Perriman Strong DGB

Definitely in contention at 25. Sloppy routes and questionable hands didn't stop us from drafting Kelvin.

@Eric_Edholm: One scout had Breshard Perriman at a 4.15 ... WOW. @Eric_Edholm: Admittedly, that would be a hand -timed 40. Margin of error there, as many of you are pointing out. But these guys do it every day. From yahoo and NFL writer^

His route running and hands are his biggest concerns but neither of those stopped us from drafting Kelvin at 28 last draft. I can hear Dave now: "You can't teach a 6'2 215lb man to run a sub 4.3. Blue goose."

@RosenhausSports: Breshad Perriman just ran a 4.26 forty at the UCF Pro Day. Incredible And his ascent into the first round continues.

This WR prospect wasn't able to compete at the combine because of an injury. Very explosive on film. I suspect we are in attendance to see if his timed speed matches what they see on tape. He's a fringe first round player. 28 teams are in attendance for a reason.