Bear Hands

It takes 2 seconds to read my OP

I don't think it's a given we take a WR at 33. EDGE, DB, DL, or OL could be in the cards depending on who is there. But, the WR talk is expectedly lively. People have their different flavors. I'm excluding the top-5 as I think Thomas and AD Mitchell, even in the outside chance of falling, would run away with this poll. Who do you got?

As a Tank Dell dynasty holder, noooo

Yeah motions and misdirects that have him gaining speed before the snap definitely help and you can use him a bit in the sweeps where he gets the ball quickly. Totally get that, I probably went to hard into the critique in that slot role. But beating zone on the outside - it’s not in his arsenal yet.

I was gonna make this disclaimer too. Many of the guys teams meet with are for a reason. Not always the case teams are sold-these are job interviews at the end of the day. Could mean they saw promise on tape but heard weird things about the guy. So many possibilities and sometimes a guy that is on these lists could have quietly been scratched off our board entirely due to, well a bad interview or visit.

Ben Sinnott is a really intriguing TE prospect. Like the dude a lot for us

His career YPRR is 1.55. His PFF grade against zone is 61.10. Dead last in the class (and) I find it apparent in watching him on many intermediate and shorter routes. It's all on PFF Premium stats and fairly clear when you watch him from my view, but I only know what I know. https://premium.pff.com/ncaa/players/2023/REGPO/xavier-legette/99197/receiving He's a particular type of receiver right now that I don't find to be a fit. He's an X-Prototype, with some meh/okay slot capabilities but he's at his best outside. To the "meh" point - He doesn't have the upper body nuances and route running refinement you like to see against zone. What that is in particular: He doesn't yet attack the blind spot, doesn't have a quick juke with proper hand movement on his outs, poor hip drop (he telegraphs), eye movement doesn't fake anyone, there's no subtle speed changes. He relies on out muscling and out running. What he does will become infinitely harder trying to shake much stickier DBs with pro-level discipline. This is also not a guy we can bring right in and run motions, shallow crosses, the quick underneath stuff with. Just look how Godwin & Evans were used last year by Canales. He likes them versatile. Legette (right now) is primed for posts, corners, deep crosses in isolation against man. Nothing against what I think he COULD do in the league, but having an X-prototype with limited short field capacity is not going to help us right NOW. Now, you get him on the outside in man, sure, he squares off great, that's where he's better than those two other young guys we have. And in addition, he's much more of a hands catcher which I love. Near the top of the class in that regard. And it makes sense, he's got some good abilities in this regard. Isolate, let him beat the guy. So, overall, he burns and bullies DBs, but that become less effective with the comp at the pro-level. And when you don't yet have certain technicalities down yet, there will be a whole new book for him to read up on. He can't just live off of contested catches and beating guys at the second level. Who knows, maybe he CAN acclimate quickly and I look foolish. Power to you if you're in the camp thinking he does and we can use him all over. I'm just not there from what I'm seeing and reading. I'm no pro at this but he gives me significant pause if he's the only WR we take and I'm not really being sold by much other than his speed+highlight reels. I'd be 100% for him late 2nd-early 3rd but the value we're missing out on in who will be available at 33 and 39 is well ahead of what he brings and it becomes another forced draft error if we take him that early. My 2 cents. Agree to disagree if you're fully on camp Legette.

It's not just about getting separation against man coverage, but it's having the quickness from the jump to beat zone these days. You need guys that square up against modern NFL defenses. Legette has great, and I mean great, top-speed for his size and is a fun as hell watch. You throw on a highlight reel and it makes sense why people like the guy. His story is also super emotional and am super happy that he was able to break out in his 5th year after nothing his first 4 (even with a sh*t offense) However, Legette ranks dead last in his grading vs. zone in the entire draft class. That and the scary low YPRR are things that advanced metric junkies are for good reason are quite nervous. And you can see the stiffness in his hips when watching him work quicker out routes. Those mid to short patterns where you need to break away quickly, he just isn't there/it's not refined yet with his skills. Sure, we got Dionte, but it would be foolish to treat this as a checklist type situation. We need ready talent with upside that can immediately help Bryce. When it comes to getting NFL open under a diverse route tree, I just have a hard time seeing it with Legette and he will need time to develop. Doesn't mean he can't acclimate, but there's some clear development needed. He's got the aggressive get-the-ball mentality and hand-catching down for his posts/corners, but right now, you may need to slow drip anything other than posts, corner, and deep crossing routes. Thing is, those get open far less of the time in the big leagues. It's something easier said than done and what guys can bully college DBs with. You're just not using him to beat zone defenses and slowly beat a team into submission. Something we need to do with Bryce. We're not some big play offense with a superstar QB chucking balls downfield. We need guys who can operate quick slants, shallow crosses, be part of this balanced-Carroll type offense. So--I don't see him making sense for us. Too many question marks, first real year of any sort of production. Shows some great promise as an X in the mold of an AJ Brown with a lot more development needed. I'll eat it if he turns up great, but I'm nervous as heck with him for THIS team. Like him as prospect, not for our situation.

I don't buy the idea we do it but need to wait until rd5-7. Just land the back you want. Target the players you want, stop overthinking the positional value relative to the trends. Find the players that fit the team you want to build. Just like Detroit's been doing it. Know your type, get your guys. I think it would be an excellent move to find a guy who could just take over a huge snap count and become a hit for us. White was the #3 overall RB receiving wise last year for Canales - we are not resting with Hubbard/Sanders for his offense. I just don't see it. Outside of the outlier in CMC, seeing how guys like Gibbs (1st), Walker (2nd), J Cook (2nd), Achane (3rd), Kyren (5th), have become the new upper echelon backs in the league leads me to think we should absolutely value a RB that fits us. I wouldn't have an issue at the top of R3, possibly even higher. And funny enough, those guys all happen to be on contenders. Regardless of value, you still need to have an effective running game with home run potential. What I think is promising is that our run blocking with our OL should be strong so if we found a true threat at RB, it could be huge for producing real offense for the first time since 2017. Chuba is serviceable, Miles is a question mark. I say, if Benson, Wright, Corum, etc. is our guy, go freaking get him and let's produce a competent offense for once.

But if you think there’s a run on WR, then we could very well have Darius Robinson, Chop Robinson or Kool-Aid there for us at 33. That changes things for me.

I’m kind of on the other end of it— Running through mock scenarios and in trying to place myself in these teams shoes, I think Thomas could last until the 20s. And once in the mid-20s, I’m still unsure if the value of the specific WRs available matches the rest of the lot at IOL (Sua, Barton, Morgan, etc), the DB class becomes more in front with Kool-Aid, Arnold, Wiggins, DeJean, etc. and there’s more front-7 prospects like the Robinsons and maybe Sweat. Depends on how teams value these kids and have their boards sorted, but they tend to lean more heavy on the lines early.

I get Chris Godwin vibes with the kid. He's one of "my guys" in the draft so that was my table pound/elevator pitch. Flanker/Slot combo type who will infuriate defenses. Played 194 snaps outside compared to 260 in the slot with good downfield looks in school. His toughness is definitely a big selling point, he takes hits, has made many tough catches contested through contact. If you take us out of the equation, I don't see him going much further than the mid-40s. If you just lay out the traits: Measurables: Size - 6'1 192, 4.41, he's not some undersized slot-only type Route running - huge check Hands - check Positional Flexibility - check Quickness - check - the guy just gets open Only true negative I see is that he's a bit less fluid/loose type than some others, but he's got the technical wherewithal, snap quickness, combined with positional flexibility that sets him ahead. He gets open, doesn't drop, and is instantly a top-20 route runner in the league once drafted. Brugler reported a few teams were very high on him, one team's scouting room had him graded the same as BT Jr. Pretty interesting.

From what I gather, they could be targeting an IDL like Byron Murphy or Newton, otherwise, Quinyon Mitchell would be a good fit at CB. I also imagine Brian Thomas could be available around their pick. Lots of possibilities for them. Overall, the OL and DL in this draft will be more coveted than let on and I think there may only be 5 WRs gone by 33. I think we're looking at some sort of combo from this crop below at 33 and 39: WR: AD Mitchell, Pearsall, Franklin, McConkey TE: Sanders EDGE: Chop, Kneeland, Ellis CB: McKinstry, DeJean, Tampa, Wiggins IDL: JP-J, Suamataia The top-3 LBs and maybe Trey Benson long shots at 39.

Sticky hands, slot machine, can play outside as a flanker, has real on-field quickness, is an excellent route runner, and doesn’t shy from contact. I don’t see how that type doesn’t succeed at an NFL level. He’s good for all types of sets–screens, motion, is a seam-stretcher, zone beater. The immediate combo Z/slot ability puts him well over guys that are only one receiver type. And his technical advancement puts him well ahead of the questionable X-prototypes. He also takes on blocks (willingly) and is a physical guy with natural hand talent and speed. So speed, quickness, gets separation, sticky hands, plays multiple spots, and plays with such tenacity…that's who I want. That dude is Ricky Pearsall.

It's tough. Yet again, such a huge roster flip. 10 starters added via FA/Trade - LG, RG, WR, TE, CB, S, ILB, (2) OLB, & (1) DL And then, whether internal moves/promotion/coming off injury, our starting C, TE, and other ILB (Shaq) will be different from last season. So we're looking at 13 new starters for a 2-15 team. Losing Luvu stung a bit, but the rest were all understandable moves. I am whelmed. Without knowing results, it's a B for this team mid-reconstruction. Problem I still see--I don't know how we're going to generate offense with our current RB & Receiving rooms. Dionte is a good addition but we still have no one to really become the "dude" on offense. We're still pretty sparse and needing the Kyren, Achane, St. Brown, Collins, DeVonta type addition that could help this team do something, anything on offense. The player that can help truly define an offense if you don't have a QB that's a top-level playmaker. The good news is that I think we have a OL that will be able to pave lanes for that type of threat, we just need to land one now.

Benson is the one that stands above the rest pretty noticeably. He’s the 4th best in over 5 years only behind Bijan, Gibbs and Hall. I wouldn’t be surprised at 39…just saying.

He’s not one I would have a problem passing on ha - imagine we could slip to the mid second - we met with him so could be a top of third consideration. CB rankings are all over the place this season - Quinton and Arnold may be the only 1sts. Possibly McKinstry, doubt the Iowa kid does.

I have 15 solid 1st rounders, then there's a big drop, but it's a late first type talent. I don't find a major difference in the guys in the late teens vs. whose available R2 until you're around pick 40-45 this year. So I wouldn't qualify them all a sure fire first round talent, I probably said that a bit strangley--it's more that 16-33 are at a much more even playing field with 34-45 than 1-15.

Trotter will be lucky to be a 3rd rounder with his man coverage issues and inconsistencies as a tackler in a MIKE role. I see Colson as the best true ILB in this draft. Wilson and Cooper are exciting but not as sure things. Then there’s quite a dip in a rather shallow group. It’s a need as Jewell+Shaq may not last more than a season, so we’ll see. Personally, I’m preferential to Junior— who knows.

RP. He fits our needs to a tee and I have a hard time seeing how he doesn’t immediately have an impact in this league. I’m just a huge fan. Would hate to force a WR but Pearsall is my WR7 and has floated 35-40 on my big board. Franklin and McConkey are close, but I have question marks on Ladd and don’t think Troy is a fit (big fan of his though). Worthy and Legette are further down. It’s tough this year—my 2 cents is if Mitchell is gone as WR5 (and WR6 Coleman too who I don’t deem a fit), we need to consider BPA. There will be 1st round value at DL, IOL, and DB at 33 (along with WR). There’s just too many first round grades for round 1. I have about 42ish… There’s a lot of scenarios where someone like Newton, Darius Rob, Chop, Kool-Aid, Suamatia, Guyton, Morgan, Barton, or Wiggins is there for us. A few of those are hard to pass on just to take WR because we need one.

There's a guy who is both the quickest zone beater and arguably the best route runner that should be available at 33, maybe 39. I really hope we take him. There's almost too much noise around Legette.

It looks like we may exercise, what is it called? Oh yeah, patience. From how I'm seeing/grading this draft, there's going to be a round 1 graded guy at 33 and 39. Just stand pat, see what presents itself. You never know. Could end up being Chop Robinson, Brian Thomas, AD Mitchell, JPJ/Barton at C, etc.

Love the unscripted camera flip. Just hanging out with Schefter. Helps make sense the frequency of leaks from the FO haha

Yeah not the best edge draft. Only a few edge setters. Some high upside rushers like Chop and Elliss but then it starts to get a bit bleak. Not bought in to the 2nd-3rd round graded guys.

Yeah not the best edge class but there’s a few (him included) that could be great. Elliss would slide right into a Jack role for us. His spin move is Freeney-esque Then there’s Kneeland who is a straight up bully. Can set the edge, bull rush, throw OTs backwards. He also surprised with the best 3-cone and short shuttle. So he’s sneaky quick. I believe both of those guys are way high on team boards over certain website rankings.