Bear Hands

Random little sidebar but it's fascinating how people treat fan opinions like bloodsport where one side has to be proven right or something. It's all quite silly. Teams can look like crap, players can look like crap, coaches can coach like crap, and the fans have every right to call it out. They're just fans calling what they're seeing, it's not like it's doing much...just digital shouting from the stands. So the team, coaching, & Bryce has looked like crap from the majority of eyes. We're just random spectators at the end of the day, can't take it too seriously. We're fans of a team not winning much so far in our lifetimes (and for the foreseeable future). What I've never understood are those who take their focus as a fan, just hanging, watching a team get destroyed weekly, getting nerdy about the stats and transactions...and rather spend their energy criticizing how other fans should perceive the team, players, etc. Just stahp. Fan critics are the worst. And re: Bryce specifically -- Trying to find any solid definition around him, right now, is just not happening. It's leaning in the bust direction, but it's all just wasted effort at this stage. It's interesting to break down what's, well, breaking down, to try and gauge the situation, games, plays...but getting into a spat that he's somehow going to breakthrough vs. definitively bust just seems like a waste of energy. I will say--I'd rather be pleasantly proven wrong than continually lower standards, while shouting at other fans that they need to be nicer/more forgiving of poor play.

Tepper just needs to just let it crash. We're crashing in spectacular fashion; don't give up any more future capital or anything. As Kunu would say, "The less you do, the more you do" Start letting things come. Don't do anything until impact and we have time to reassess the damages with a new GM and Coach--or combo...or whoever tf he finds ha.

Tepper hired an old school technician to repair a hybrid car in a plane falling from the sky with no pilots on board.

His wife went a bit far and he's not going to comment much on it. It's really a non-issue. They all know they're all gone anyways, that's pretty much what she was saying. He's got some good coaches who respect him (not necessarily as a playcaller) and imagine he'll end up in Minny or LAR in due time in a similar capacity to what he was. Nothing to really see here.

I just can't say that/really don't think it's the case, and it's not because I'm trying to bash Bryce. I just think Cam elevated the team THAT much as a runner and playmaker. Never forget how bad they took a turn when Kalil got injured in 2012. Byron Bell, Hang'man, Amini as a rookie, and a rotating door at RG. That was baaad. Cam was a QB1.

It's usually dependent if we're getting a guy from a team where he can pull from. No different than bringing a hard drive to work that last week before you give notice-- gotta make sure you're grabbing work you did for your own portfolio and records.

Yes. That's what I just said

If fans of any franchise should understand what a QB1 that truly elevates the team feels like, it should be us. That type of fervent defense made sense with Cam's first 2 years because he was showing such mad potential. People were still bashing him for his character, celebrations, etc. but we were growing as a team and starting to have crazy fire on offense. He was lifting the entire offense so it made sense for a lot of people to tell the detractors to pipe down with their relentless critiques. Bryce isn't giving us even a glimmer of feel in that department. I just don't get it other than true Bama fans or just the types that will refuse to put heavy critique on their QB (which those do exist in a lot of fanbases) Rookie wise, on a Clausen(1)-Cam(100) spectrum, I'd say we are at about a 10-15

That whole debate seems like years ago. This season I tell ya

My only concern is not just Fitterer, but Cole Spencer, Jared Kirksey and their regional crews have been working throughout the season on the upcoming class. These are the guys that have been putting together evals and helping construct our boards for the past 3 years for Rhule, Fitt and Reich. Most team EOS reports for most prospects were due towards the end of November, early December. Lord knows who they're identifying as their next faves. Full cleanout needed.

I’ve been enjoying Troy Franklin but he needs more polished route running for our needs. I’d say the best combo of quick and quality route runner to make it a seamless transition. We have needs all over but an offensive playmaker is the obvious void the size of a black hole. If they want Bryce to do well, they get him one. We need offense in this joint. If they’re not giving up on Bryce, give him the best playmaker possible. WR is preferred but I’m fine with a RB or TE. Just look what the Lions did with Gibbs and LaPorta. And this is a saucy TE class as well.

This— Belicheck’s drafts since 2015 have been terrible

Unless you can objectively qualify what a lockable v unlockable thread is that is merely redundant, then just stop while you’re ahead. Same people that want to dictate who can post or not are the same who tend to send essays to mods via DM complaining about when they experience the slightest inconvenience or warning. Not the OP but just saying. Don’t partake in what you perceive as muddy or else you’re gonna get muddy. It also goes away quicker when you don’t as well.

I'd say Walker, Watson, & Lance have arguments. Depending how this works out, we'll definitely be in discussion for #1. Honestly, every trade we've made under fit has been terrible. All reaches, needy grabs or an unnecessary roster purge for spare parts. Never a true "we wanted this specific guy" trade. Darnold was just awful comp. He should've netted maybe one 3rd and a late rounder. Corral was obviously the last QB left they liked and we didn't have capital to trade higher (desperation & bad scouting..Howell was there). Brandon Smith was this grab based on a RAS score (Fitt's crack) DJJ was the last remaining on their EDGE tier (desperation move and badly scouted EDGE board) CMC was desperation setup for gaining picks back after losing a ton in the above terrible trades Then we immediately use the picks gained from CMC for a bonker #1 overall trade up (which never works) -- I said elsewhere...the ones we didn't take: 2021 Trade Down would've gained an extra future 1st. But we stubbornly took Horn. 2022 Burns Trade for (2) 1sts Just terrible, desperate, needy bologna.

For NYG and TEN, both of their lines have been panned beyond belief this year and are arguably worse than ours. What both rooks did last night was beyond impressive. Had heavy pressure rushing in their face in the closing minutes. And something to not forget, both of those teams have some of the better coaches who teach aggressive, tough, & inspired football. Daboll and Vrabel are great IMO. Down year overall, but they're damn good coaches. Shows how "bad" teams can still win. Which we can't figure out even when the opponents are virtually gifting us the game.

I mean aside of maybe 2 others, arguably league history.

He's 30/32 in the league in that respect, but that's overall EPA. For the more QB centric metric, he's 431 out of 431 qualified QBs in EPA per dropback since it started being measured.

Update: CMC: 1600+ total yards, 17 TDs DJ Moore: 1,070+ yards, 7 TDs 24 TDs The Panthers as a team: 19 touchdowns

Yeah Nix has the arm and just plays bigger. Just has more presence in the pocket. McCarthy has the athleticism and is a bit more disciplined.

Statistically speaking, it's historic in a few ways. He currently has the second lowest YPA in modern history for a starting QB (min 10 games). Only the 3rd player this century to throw 36+ passes in a game and complete 13 or below.

This is optimal advice for most things. It's not that you shouldn't trade up for a guy you really want (I.E. Chiefs-Mahomes), but we traded up for Corral, Smith, Bryce, and DJJ out of pure neediness and also due to the draft capital/positioning we put ourselves in. If we just stopped being the one initiating trades for one season and let things come to us, it would be so much better. The trades we didn't make (and should've) were the ones that came to us (2021 trade down & Burns) and the ones we did (as previously mentioned) dug us into this madness.

I'm 5'9 170 and feel larger than Bryce lol

Fair points. A trade should have already happened. We knew this wasn't working before the deadline this year.

I just want to know if there's more than just the physical limitations and accuracy. That big expose in the Athletic alluded to Bryce not quite being able to take on the full playbook so it just makes you wonder. But I think you're right about Frank. The team was on a short leash so he took it back to fall on the sword if it didn't get better. He knew what was happening.

Step one is what we all want... 1. GM & his scouting dept is relieved of duties along with the remaining coaching staff. The search will be a focus on a pairing -- whether it's GM first or another coach w/personnel control. 2. Burns obviously wants out. You have to tag and trade him. We can still get a decent package so just get it done and don't just let him walk for some comp pick crap. Hopefully he still nets a 1st. May be a 2025 one but possibly 2024 from a team in contention i.e. DET or BAL. 3. Draft a QB in the 3rd-4th to compete. This is a barometer check for the kid. Draft someone like Michael Pratt, Bo Nix, etc. If a mid-round is doing more than Bryce in camp/preseason, a good coach will recognize it. He needs someone young with potential to either push him to be better or get out of the way. He's looked that bad. 4. Rebuild is the remaining focus. Offensive Playmakers and Trench Warfare. 5. FA focus should be impact in leadership. We need tougher dudes with leadership ability. We have dinero for a guy that can be a team captain. I suggest they either do what they can to keep Luvu or look at finding the new D leader at LB. Need some men in this joint.