MHS831

Gonna get a shot. Was a RT early and G ever since.

So you think Marc Ross, former GM of the NY Giants, is just guessing like the rest of us? He was not predicting, he was evaluating talent from his perspective. When asked, "What would you say if the Panthers draft CJ Stroud?" His response: "I would say the Texans got the best QB in the draft."

There is good reason to think Young will be the pick--most of the NFL experts I have heard that have shared an opinion say he is the best QB in the draft and should be the #1 pick. They are aware of his size when they said so. Kyler Murray was 5'10" and a #1 overall pick, so the precedent has been set. He weighs 205 lbs. He has gone to 2 pro bowls. He runs more than Young will run, but he does not process the field as quickly and he is not as accurate. He was just paid a $46m per year salary and was considered to be an elite qb until 2022 when he was injured, overpaid, and not effective. An ex-teammate (Kelvin Beachum) recently said that Murray needs to "grow up a little bit" if he wants to lead the franchise. Based on my perception, Murray is childish, a front runner, and a whiner. Bryce Young, on the other hand, is respected and admired by teammates and opponents (see what Georgia players said about him). Young is a student of the game, a selfless contributor to the overall objectives, etc. Mentally, he is a man. I would say that he is more advanced mentally than Kyler Murray and he processes more quickly. So why is his size such an important issue to fans but it doesn't seem to be enough of a factor with the NFL experts (Marc Ross, for example, former Giants GM) to drop him behind Stroud. So what does Stroud have that Young does not? Size. He throws a pretty ball and it is on point and on time. He is my preference between the two, but the "experts" I have heard from on NFL Network like Young over Stroud. If the same size, would Young be better? I think so. So then the issue comes down to how much weight you give to weight and height. I think Young (mentally) is far above the other QBs in the draft. He ran a more complex offense and he was able to process at the level of an NFL elite QB. Stroud's offense was not as challenging, but he did go through progressions. He successfully performed what he was asked to do. So over the next 40 days, I think that is the area of these QBs that will be measured--processing. If they are equal, Stroud is the pick. If Young dominates in this area, and he could likely do that, I could see the Panthers going with Young and I could see that being the best decision. I know that it is fun to discuss and will dominate the discussions over the next few days, but we should all state our perspectives based on the understanding that we simply do not know. We do not know that Young will be injured more than Stroud. We do not know which will have a great career and which will not--if the case. We are all speculating. This post was created with an open mind--I prefer Stroud right now, but I could be wrong.

I think this confirms that we are switching to the Notre Dame Box. Who needs Wide Receivers? Just draft AR-15 and run the box.

Here is something I have noticed--the "experts" on NFL network (Marc Ross, David Carr, and a few others) seem to think Young is the best QB and it is not that close. The fans seem to think Stroud is the pick, which is what drives the betting lines. The Georgia football players at the combine stated that they loved Stroud--how calm, accurate, and unflappable he is--but they saw firsthand Stroud's best game ever. They got to know Young at the combine, and they commented how much they liked the person. The fans saw the combine, and Stroud was impressive, while Young watched wearing sweats. 1. How can we be disappointed with either? 2. Stroud was in the playoffs and played a great game-Young was not showcased. Are fans simply riding a wave of momentum over Stroud and have normalized and maybe trivialized all Young has to offer? 3. If you believe processing speed is the most important QB characteristic, you have to like Young. If Young's size bothers you, you have to go with Stroud. Otherwise, aren't they both pretty accurate? Pretty smart? Calm under pressure?

He should be used to being taunted by now. That's mental toughness you can't teach or buy. http://www.espn.com/photo/2015/1130/005_AdamReed007x.JPG

2 things--he said "He checks a lot of boxes", and admitted size is an issue. Furthermore, he uses Brees and Russell Wilson as his examples of high performing QBs--- second and a third round picks He did NOT reference the only 5'10" QB ever taken first overall--K. Murray. Why not, I wonder? I think he was not going to make a statement that suggested that he was thinking of Young from the perspective of the first overall pick, he was comparing him to QBs who defied the odds.

This Just in: Aaron Rodgers cheated. Hippies found this in his Grateful Dead duffel bag following his 4 nights in the cave of pitch blackness: A throwback Jets night light. I knew it.

Unless you are part of the smokescreen. Mind blown. (Sorry, this GIF is a bit graphic, but it is applicable, dammit!)

Exactly. Stroud has been compared to Prescott and Goff. I think he is the best of each. That aligns with the coaching styles of several Panther coaches. Young has been compared to Mahomes and Murray. I think he is the worst of each. While Murray has the same height, he is a better runner. Mahomes has the elusive abilities and accuracy, but he is the best at what he does and Young has not shown to be his equal. Richardson is the pick for all the Cam Newton fans hoping to clone their favorite son, but if the Panthers were interested in that kind of play, would they not have at least made a play for L. Jackson before trading more assets to Chicago? I think Jackson is Richardson's ceiling, and that is fine. I think Vince Young is his floor--yikes. Levis? He has the tools, but has not performed as well. Secondly, he has been compared to Josh Allen. Coming out of college, Josh Allen was not compared to players of his caliber, so to expect Levis to defy the odds and reach his ceiling (Josh Allen) is such a reach. According to one source (and I like the comparision) think Jay Cutler instead. When compared to CJ, there is no comparison.

If you really like CJ you do not trade the pick for any reason. Even if you have pretty much decided on CJ, you still want to do your homework. If you announce that CJ is the guy, why would Richardson, Levis, or Young waste their time visiting Charlotte? Why workout if the purpose of the workout is to confirm a decision to select another player?

I changed that on my master---I think I was not sure if Luvu was playing an Edge / OLB or taking one of the Inside LB spots

I would say that by the end of the weekend we could have both Hardman and Chark

I doubt he leaves Charlotte without an offer

I also think CB is a bigger need than we all seem to realize (because we are not talking about it).

Great points. Sold me on taking Downs at 39.

On Spotrac, Chark has a value estimated at $9.5m. That is a bit high, considering where the others have fallen. I think we will offer him a deal, in the 3-year, $22m range. Don't forget, Hardman is still out there. And I know everyone has already stamped a star on the side of his head, but Odell is out there too. That should make some excited, others nervous.

As disillusioned as I am with the WRs in this draft as early as early round 2, I might agree with this, then in the third round, trade up for WR Charlie Jones--I am high on him, and he seems to be ready to play day 1. I think he is a sleeper.

I want CJ, but I did read (take this fwiw) that he had remarkably few batted balls in college compared to other qbs.

My thoughts: WR is about as weak as I have ever seen it. My favorite, Jaxon Smith-Njigba will be long gone. Jordan Addison will also be gone. Zay Flowers could be there--I do not see a team taking him with a first round pick--it would be a reach, imo. Jalen Hyatt--I am not so interested because I read that he is a "one trick pony" and benefited from Tennessee's scheme--He was not very productive before that. Downs is small but he is a competitor--a slot WR who would sit Shi Smith down. Very small. I am not interested in Boutte--he is a bust waiting to happen--lazy route runner, drops. I have curious interested in Mingo from Ole Miss. Not overly productive, but bigger and with good speed. Rashee Rice (SMU) is a potential day 2 pick for the Panthers, but the Panthers could probably trade back a bit and still get him. He had solid improvement in college. When I consider the immediate needs of the Panthers, I think it could be possible to wait until the third round before drafting a WR, assuming the chips don't fall as planned in round 2. Charlie Jones had over 1100 yards on 110 catches in the big 10. He is a great route runner and has excellent hands. He was in college for 6 years, so he is 24, but that maturity might be what is needed right now. The more I read about him, the more I see him as a sleeper, even though he was All-American. If Dalton Kincaid were to fall to us in round 2, you have to take him. He would be as much of a receiving threat as any of the WRs left on the board, and he would play in the slot or even out wide at times. If I took Kincaid in the second, I would go after Jones in the third. So my "realistic" Day 2 Big board 1. Pick 39-Dalton Kincaid (TE, sorta) If he somehow drops to 39, you take him. 2. Pick 39-Zay Flowers WR. I would say that there is a legitimate reason to suspect that he will be there, but his value has been rising. 3. Pick 39- Josh Downs WR. He is a gamer, undersized etc. but he brings it every play. Depending on if the Panthers feel they need a slot at the time. 4. Pick 39-Jalen Hyatt WR. Ate Bama alive, but some say that he (like his QB) are "products of the system" so you can't use his stats to rate him. I am not that high on him at this time. 5. Trade back in round 2--Rashee Rice. I think he will become an excellent pro. If we took him at 39, I would get it. 6. Trade back in round 2--Jonathan Mingo. 6'2", 220. Reminds me of Moose. 7. Round 3--Charlie Jones. He has good speed, a polished route runner, good hands, and was very productive in his sixth year of college football. He is 24+, and could be ready to play right now.

that's me.

He's not leaving Charlotte without a contract.

We can help. I will start a thread titled, "Talking Proudiddy off the ledge" because I am that kind of guy. There will be a poll (nothing complex, just "jump!" or "don't jump"). Here for you.