panthers55

I dont think many folks loved Cotchery so much as they hoped he would be able to help. I think those that thought he was going to replace Smith were hoping he would but I doubt they would have bet much money on it happening. He was a cheap option little else. Just about every expert in the summer was saying we had the worse wide receiver group in the league.

I heard him say that he actually doesnt like stop gap vets because it hurt consistency and chemistry when you have to turn over your roster every year. He has had to resort to that given the cap hell we have been in, but I dont think it is the plan. He wants a core of young players and to build through the draft. Vets are important but I dont think they are seen as stop gap so much as part of the long term plan. In 2013 we gave out a bunch of 1 year contracts. In 2014 we gave out more 2 year deals. I expect that trend to continue. Even guys like Remmers last year were given a 2 year deal which now appears to be a fantastic move.

The question is not whether you want Cobb because everyone knows he would be very productive but do you want him at 12 million a year and who else could you get for that kind of money. There are other guys who are cheaper and still will be productive. It isnt that we arent competing for a Super bowl simply that we arent one player away or that Cobb will be the missing piece to winning s Super bowl. As for Johnson, he may still be productive but at 34, he is a stop gap not a solution. We need a guy who is productive and in his mid twenties, not one or 2 years away from retirement. DG is building for the future and looking at being a winning franchise consistently. That requires building around a young core not patching things together with expensive free agents. We did that in the late 90s with poor results. I dont want to go back to that failed strategy. We are on the right path and honestly AJ is not part of the plan IMO.

He would be our third best option assuming we dont upgrade elsewhere or pick up another stud in the draft. Secondly, the comparison with Cotchery was an age one not a skill one. And lastly who says he would be great with the young receivers He might have been a great option a few years ago, now he is just over the hill.

We are not going to be interested in him at any price. He is 34 years old and not part of any teams long term future. That may work for a team that is a wide receiver away from a Super Bowl but honestly we are looking for younger guys to build the future with not over the hill like Johnson. If we got rid of a 34 year in Smith we won't be adding another guy just as old. Cotchery was 31 when we picked him up I doubt we want to go even older at the position.

Way too early to know who we are going to even need until free agency plays out somewhat. Unless we pickup a WR or 2 in free agency you can count on us drafting one in the first 3 rounds. Drafting an OT is very likely also. Don't see us picking a safety in the first. I think that building around Cam is the big priority this year.

I have seen this kind of analysis over and over. This is what you get when you have a bean counter in charge of a company. They have all the numbers and can tell you trends and money but no idea what they are doing in running the company. I know exactly what the article is advocating. it is saving money and dumping contracts and not restructuring or extending folks so we have plenty of money in 2016. And I think the idea appears fine on the surface but it is too simplistic and doesn't account t for the realities of the present NFL. You need veterans like Johnson and Kalil as well as a mix of young players it isn't just about the money but inward to you get for the money Without veteran leadership which you have to pay for, you end up like we did in 2010. Since you have to spend 90% of the cap every year that 60 million will get spent just like it does every year. Only we will be rebuilding after a poor 2015 instead of retooling. If there are the right guys in free agency this year you spend instead of saving for 2016 hoping the right guys are there then. If you have lurked as long as you say then you know I am not one for histrionics, I rely on facts and logic and the expert opinions of those who know more than I do. This guy isn't one of those guys. He knows numbers but he wasn't a GM and doesn't know the relative value of guys like Kalil to our team.

But the problem with this article is that it is only looking at contracts and not building a team for 2015 as well as 2016. It is just looking at who we can release and keep without acknowledging that if we don't spend in 2015 and do what we need to in order to remain competitive we will take an ever bigger plunge in 2015 than we did between 2013 and 2014. If it weren't for our easier schedule and poor division in 2014 we could have finished with 4 or 5 wins. If we do what this article recommends we will be back to 2 or 3 wins. The whole we can't spend or restructure anyone in 2015 without costing us in the future ignores that Gettleman was able to go from 20 million over the cap in 2013 to 8 million under while building a team that went 12-4. We took a step back in 2014 due to a poor free agency strategy and overconfidence by Gettleman that he could pull off another 2013 which didn't happen. He will be smarter and spend more this free agency just like he should. There will still be plenty money for 2016 as well without tanking this season in the process.

It said Johnson would be kept for 2015 and could released in 2016 when his dead cap number would fall to 4 million. I saw nothing suggesting an extension. And the 60 million dollar number was put forth as a goal instead of a real bad idea given that with only 25 guys under contract assuming our rookies this year and picking up some free agents in 2015 we are forced to bring in a bunch of free agents in 2016 whether the market is favorable to do so or not or rely on a bunch of rookies and UDFAs. That philosophy not only has us sucking in 2015 but likely off to another slow start in 2016 as we try and build chemistry. Flexibility is one think but having less than half of your roster under contract rarely leads to big progress, or consistency which is what we are shooting for.

And how long did it take Davis to work into a starting role even given the failed experiment at safety. With so many other needs for an immediate starter with our first rounder, picking him to groom as a starter down the road would be a colossal mistake. I am sure Gettleman is a lot smarter than that.

That article was a joke when it came to free agency and the draft. While I agree that there aren't many free agents worth keeping, the idea that we should let Johnson play out his contract and not sign Hardy may make money sense if you want to stockpile money so we end up like Tampa or another team with plenty of money and no talent. First of all Johnson is only 28 and can play for 4 or 5 years minimally. He won't get another contract like he signed earlier and shouldn't but the only way he should walk is if he won't extend at a reasonable amount. But I surely would attempt to do so. I know we will likely move on from Hardy but I think that is a mistake as well. With a suspension very possible he would be cheap on a 1 or 2 year contract. Secondly That 60 million cap figure is all pie in the sky. Who really wants us to not bring in a free agent wide receiver this year or at least attempt to find a left tackle if we can find one before putting everything on drafting someone who may need a year or two in order to be ready to play in the NFL. And we shouldn't try and bring in at least one or two defensive backfield vets to shore up the secondary? I am all for drafting guys to fill spots but we have been lucky finding starters who are rookies and can't always count on that. Plus the big reason we start off so slow each year is that many of our projected starters are not ready to start given they have little or no experience at the pro level. If we take this sites advice we have a ton of money in 2016 and have just come off a 4 win season even in the NFCS. Newton needs weapons and we need to spend money now to do that. We can sign some guys, retain, extend and restructure others and have a solid year in 2015 and still have 30 million in 2016 just considering the dead cap space we lose, the increase in the cap and signing guys to cap friendly contracts. This article was written by a guy who is looking at the money and contracts but knows little about football and building a team.

Few players leave without some hard feelings. With the social media as it is, these kind of things are inevitable. Whether your opinion of him went up or down depends on where you had him to begin with. Since I think most players are egotistical spoiled and entitled multi millionaires with little understanding of how to carry themselves in a mature fashion, then my opinion of him or most players hasn't changed. There are exceptions such as Luke but let's be real here, how many folks in their 20s or early thirties making that kind of money and having that much influence don't have entitlement issues. Particularly when they have been handed so much and been treated so differently than regular folks. Yeah I know that most here are under 30 but it wasn't a put down since most here also haven't been as privledged or entitled as most athletes.

I am waiting to make sure we have someone much better before I get too excited. We went into 2014 with Bell being the best option. Let's hope we have some great starters this season. Not much to choose from in free agency so far.

Would be nice to have a bonafide returner who can also stretch the field. If he can only use more stick um on his hands he might be great.........

Lets be real here. Everyone knew that this day would come including DeAngelo. I will surely miss seeing his big runs and his smile as well as the Matrix thing he had going with Stewart. And for those who posted nonstop they hated him and wanted him gone for years, stop with I am going to miss him crap posts. Man up and admit you are happy he is gone. Nothing worse than two faced BS. Me, I am a Panther before him and will be a Panther fan after him. I have fond memories of his time here and will cherish those. I hope that Stewart is the man and has shown he can handle the workload he is going to be given. It is his time now. I hope he lives up to the challenge.

Worse case scenario is that Newton plays under the 5th year option which is 14 million in 2015 and then is tagged in 2016 if we can't reach agreement. With the quarterback franchise tag expected to be over 18 million in 2015 and likely to rise to 20 million in 2016 the estimates that suggest Cam will make between 20-25 million per year are very likely. He isn't going to make less than 20 a year. Secondly that 20 million isn't going to kill us long term as long as we don't have 4 or 5 players at that level. With so many ways to manipulate the cap we can easily fit him under the cap and pay Luke as well. The biggest issue will be the guaranteed money and with most teams guaranteeing their first couple of years salaries and the signing bonus we likely wouldn't have much dead cap,money beyond 3 or 4 years. He just has to stay productive and healthy and we will be fine.

I didn't miss the point at all. Wilson threw 5 picks all season versus 20 TDs. Cam threw 18 TDs and 12 picks so clearly Wilsons stats with arguably not that many weapons other than Lynch was much better than Cam. Of the 8 games we won last year of which 6 he played, he had interceptions In 3 of them. So the old if he throws one interception we lose is hype not reality. The bigger question that does explain things is how many games do we lose when he throws more touchdowns than he throws picks? Or when he throws multiple touchdowns and 1 or less Interceptions. Truth is that he had 1 three touchdown game all year and 9 games where he threw 1 or none. Hard to win when you don't put up many points and your running game is hurting.

What game where you watching Wilson had 3 touchdowns and 0 picks while Newton threw 2 touchdowns and had 2 picks including a pick 6. Newtons passer rating was 79 and Wilsons was double that at 149. These kind of apologist comments are part of the reason Cam gets some of the criticism on this board.

Most teams pay based on a players accomplishments and to that end Wilson and the Hawks have had much more success than Newton. Sure you can make the arguments that he has a better cast than Cam but if you look at our playoff loss to them this year it was Offensive turnovers which lost us the game. Gaffs they continue to make despite this being the end of his 4 th year. He won't make more than Wilson based on results. As for Luck, he has been anointed the second coming of Manning so he will get a ton based on potential and the fact he has a lot more comebacks than Cam despite the fact that he often causes the problem in the first place with picks. Cam will get a ton but he won't get more than the other two and doesn't deserve it based on the results. The argument that he is a bigger part of the offense is an indictment of our ability to give him enough weapons not a reason to pay him more money.

One of the things I like about Gettleman is that he looks down the road and is building for the long term. that is the complete opposite of Hurney who always gambled tomorrow away for rewards immediately. I think everyone would agree that Gettleman has a much better approach so that means that we have to take the immediate shortcomings like no left tackle in stride while we build for long term success.

Your reference to those studies are apples to oranges comparisons.. I am talking about whether people actually practice what they preach which in a vast majority of cases is not the case. You are talking about people being stubborn and unwilling to change despite reasons to do so. The only way thy could be related is if you think that once Gettleman says he is going to draft BPA he feels a need to do it regardless of the circumstances in order to save face. But that negates the whole concept that he can always say whoever he picks was BPA at that position so there is never a situation where someone would call him on it or he would feel a need to defend his position since most folks factor need into any decision the team makes. When he picks someone who is not at a perceived need of position he just reinforces what he says. Otherwise he can always say he did exactly what he said and who would argue. Secondly you confuse immediate need with eventual need. Gettleman does have a long term perspective so he looks at now and in the future since he is looking down the road. He has never planned to keep Hardy so for him there is a need for Ealy. He knew that he won't have both Stewart and Williams on the team down the road so Gaffney was a need.

Exactly. So why all the debate about BPA versus need when most teams have significant needs at many positions. The issue comes up when we don't draft at a position at what everyone thinks is our biggest need this year like an offensive tackle. If we draft a quarterback in the first 3 rounds then I will think Gettleman is BPA no matter what..

Exactly what position has Gettleman drafted at a position of no need last year? Benjamin? Big need. Ealy? Given he wouldn't pay Hardy big money and didn't trust him and Johnson is costing almost 20 million a year it was a position of need in a year or two. Turner? With Wharton on the fence and Silatolu so up and down it was an immediate need. Boston? Of course we needed a safety. Benwikere? No question it was a need? . Gaffney? You could argue no need but with Williams and Stewart costing so much having a lower priced option would be necessarily down the road. So if we are looking long term instead of short term where are all these players who are at positions of no or little need. Gettleman may not be selecting at positions of what people think are our biggest needs but it is hard to say they are at positions of little need.

So let's start by saying that there is a whole field of research that looks at what a person says they do or will do compared to what they actually do and the results suggest they are often not the same or certainly not as delineated as they said. Secondly if you look at what he does and not what he says which is a much better predictor or what he will do in the future he surely drafts at positions of need as often as he drafts a player at an area of low need. He simply says that he was BPA regardless of need. But most times it isn't as if one player stands out head and shoulders above the rest like Star did in 2013.

. I would argue that you are trying to polarize the argument into BPA versus need and I think that need is a factor but not the main issue. I think gettleman's comments are more related to various drafting services who tend to put people at certain positions and teams solely based on need and he is saying that isn't how he rolls. But If you look at his drafts instead of what he says you can see that many of his BPAs have been at positions of need. Pure coincidence? I don't think so.