Why you don't fire John Fox

[ChucktownK]

It`s a valid discussion, but the name that always comes up in my mind is Tony Dungy.

Suppose the Bucs had stuck with Dungy? Would he have won there? Or was a change the catalyst that was needed to get both the Bucs and Dungy to their respective Super Bowls?

The same situation could happen here, though if it does I hope we pick a better successor than Tampa did. After that one year, Gruden was generally the picture of mediocrity.

I've seen some of the Warren Sapp interviews about that and from the way he puts it, in so many words, that organization totally changed when Dungy got there. They became a team he said. If he had stayed, I believe they would have still done really well.

[Brooklyn Bully]

I'd go far as to say Fox is a Top 5 coach. I base that on trying to find coaches that are better than him. There are a slew on par with him. Let's take a look...

Pats - Belichick better

Jets - Ryan

Dolphins - Sparano

Bills - Fewell

Colts - Manning...I mean Caldwell (inherited Dungy's team)

Jaguars - Del Rio on par

Texans - Kubiak

Titans - Fisher on par

Steelers - Tomlin better

Bengals - Lewis

Ravens - Harbaugh

Browns - Mangini

Chargers - Turner on par

Raiders - Cable

Chiefs - Haley

Broncos - McDaniels

Cowboys - Phillips

Redskins - Zorn

Eagles - Reid better

Giants - Coughlin on par

Lions - Schwartz

Bears - Smith on par

Packers - McCarthy

Vikings - Childress

Bucs - Morris

Saints - Payton on par

Falcons - Smith

Cardinals - Whisenhunt on par

Seahawks - Mora

Rams - Spagnuolo

49ers - Singletary

So...that makes three coaches out right better than Fox, while seven are pretty much dead even with Fox. You can argue which of those are better until your face turns blue, but I think Fox could easily be the fourth best coach in the NFL.

So, Meat, you're right...he's good. But since this isn't college, you don't keep a coach around for decades. When things aren't working, you fix them. In the NFL, a coaching change is almost always part of the fix. You could sit there and name us coaching change after coaching change that hasn't worked, right? Well we could name you coaching changes that have worked. You need to have faith in Mr. Richardson that he'll bring in the best guy. Also, even the best coaches get the axe or step down after things get stale. We're not winning and it's making things stale. It's time for some new life in this organization.

[Snake]

I realize that Fox has only once drafted in the top five, and that he made a great decision in drafting Peppers. Still, that he doesn't have a better option at quarterback is no one's fault but his own.

I started running over the league's coaches, and I think you may very well be right that Fox is in the top ten. But you can't possibly agree with the offensive playcalling this year. Do you think we're seeing the offense run solely by Davidson, without Fox meddling?

Fox is a good coach when it come to Defense he lacks alot in the Offensive department and his fear of taking chances has gone to the point of insanity. I mean we have sat on a 14 point lead this year. Yes he may still be a good coach but not for this team. His time has just come to pass and he has lasted alot longer then most coaches.

[Carolinafan320]

john fox coaches like hes gambling on his own team to lose..ala pete rose..heheh

[guyinchesapeake]

I have to say, there have been some outstanding points made on this thread, I'd say more so than on the 'typical' thread. Both arguments (should Fox stay?/should Fox go?) are well presented.

As shown, even having perenially good teams is not enough to keep some coaches around, as Dungy's resignation after last year showed. Recent NFL history shows it is quite hard indeed to produce a consistent winner and contender from year to year. The common thread for the teams that are winning consistently over the past few years are they have exceptional QBs. The Pats, Colts, and to a lesser degree the Giants are winners because they developed great, or potentially great (the word may still be out for Eli) QBs. The Packers with Favre had a lot of success since the early '90s. The Eagles win consistently but have yet to earn a ring. John Fox record is a good one overall. The inability to produce consecutive contending seasons is the biggest negative on that record. Cowher had several losing seasons in his tenure in Pittsburg.

If Fox is retained, it is vital that they address the QB situation ASAP. But I don't know if this team has it in them to rise again next year after this season's disappointments and underachievement under him. Based on typical NFL history, his time appears to have come and gone, and a new direction is needed. His SB winner may be with another team, for he no doubt will get hired by another team if he is let go from here, or if he resigns. Remember, Billichek was run out of Cleveland before he became the 'genius' he is considered today. And finding Brady (he was a 6th round pick after all), and having Bledsoe get hurt at an opportune time has everything to do with contributing to that 'genius' status. At least until that 4th down call on his own 28 last week! LOL..

[Jangler]

Fox has never had back to back winning seasons, thus he has surely not "proven himself in the long run."

Your "reason" is all fluff.

I like fluff...

[ChucktownK]

That's Puft

[Kevin Greene]

I like fluff...

Can I have the fluff in your sig?

[Jangler]

You're in California, right? You probably have a better chance of finding her before me....

[ChucktownK]

That's muff

[Wither]

That's muff

Lmao.

[CatMan72]

They were either 0-5 or 0-6 after that 59-0 debacle at New England, and everyone said "he's lost the team, he needs to go." Now they are playing like the team that went 13-3 last year, and things look bright for next year.

Fox is a top 10 coach. If you're dumb enough to run him off, you get what you deserve.

Yup, it's amazing what good play at the QB position can do for you... must be nice to have a coach with the balls to bench a QB that's struggling...

[Wither]

Yup, it's amazing what good play at the QB position can do for you... must be nice to have a coach with the balls to bench a QB that's struggling...

It's funny that you mention "bench." I wonder if Jake could really benefit from some benching (I meant sitting on the bench, but maybe he needs to lift some too).

[Pantherman]

LOL. Sorry, top 10 coaches actually get back-to-back winning seasons. Last years team would have been 8-8 or 9-7 if we didn't play the Raiders, Lions, Chiefs, and any other terrible team on our schedule.

agreed. The samething is happening to the saints this year. Saints last year had a hard schedule and went below .500. this year the saints has one of the easiest schedules in the league. now they are 9-0. Not a big surprise. Panthers this year one of the hardest schedule in the league. Now we will be lucky to make .500 before the end of the season. Then next year we will get easy schedule again and then go above 500.