Matt Moore = MVP!

[PantherFanForLife]

Because you can't base all your football decisions in one season based on past performances. Sometimes, players regress and need to be benched to get their head straight... I think that is what happened here. That, and it helped that his receivers had time to develop, and they had the bye to really work on the passing game.

The reason I think he would have played just as bad is because he was starting to show a trend through several preseason games and two NFL games at not getting it done. It was not just one game. The offense was miserably bad in the preseason, too... which DOES matter when it continues into the regular season.

There are a million what if scenarios. Ultimately, we have what we have. That's a quarterback who just had a great performance after being benched, and who has credited the benching with helping him.

It wasn't one season. He also played solid as a starter in 2007.

But yes Mav, you are right, Matt Moore regressed. He really sucked and all he needed was a good benching to get him back to shape.

For Christ's sake some of you just don't know when to admit YOU WERE WRONG!

And you STILL continue to judge him based on 2 games. A trend during pre-season? He barely had any playing time during the last 2 pre-season games.

Oh here:

The Carolina Panthers quarterback would like to say those hours in the film room were the difference betweehis brilliant game Sunday, a 23-20 win against San Francisco, and his turnover-marred performances in losses to the New York Giants and Tampa Bay.

But Moore admitted he's not sure what led to his career-best 308-yard passing performance against the 49ers.

"That's the million dollar question. I don't know," Moore said. "I did a lot of self-scouting when I had my time off. I was just trying to get back to the form that we were playing with last year - not just me, but everybody."

Read more: http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2010/10/24/1785262/moore-found-what-he-was-looking.html#ixzz13KmvHNTy

So much for that argument.

[mav1234]

I don't "still continue to judge him." We're speculating about HOW TO HAVE TREATED HIM IN WEEK 3. In week 3, he had just come off two terrible showings and a bad preseason. Yes, back then, I was concerned by his play. Would I have sat him? I don't know, but I don't believe for a second that had he started against Cincy he woulda done what he did today.

All I'm saying is this: Had Moore continued to play, and not played well WHICH IS A POSSIBILITY, it would have made his play in this game unlikely to have happened since he probably wouldn't have started.

That's all. I'm not saying that he sucks or that he's bad or any of that nonsense. Jesus. I don't get why this is so hard. I think the benching helped him. You don't. Get over it. I'm not going to agree with you just because he won some games as a backup in past years. When the team was his, he faltered. Now he's back on track, and I hope he stays that way.

[mav1234]

durr look I can underline quotes, too:

"That's the million dollar question. I don't know," Moore said. "I did a lot of self-scouting when I had my time off. I was just trying to get back to the form that we were playing with last year - not just me, but everybody."

[mav1234]

Dunno where the quote is (was on the game today) about how he said him being benched helped him look at the game again since he was really out of rhythm until that point.

I think you're also reading the quote wrong. The author is basically asking "what changed", not "did being benched help". As in, "what did HE change to regain his mojo." The answer is he wasn't sure, he just did a lot of soul searching and a lot of watching of film and came out aggressive.

Props to him for finding his rhythm again though, it was fun to watch.

[PantherFanForLife]

I don't "still continue to judge him." We're speculating about HOW TO HAVE TREATED HIM IN WEEK 3. In week 3, he had just come off two terrible showings and a bad preseason. Yes, back then, I was concerned by his play. Would I have sat him? I don't know, but I don't believe for a second that had he started against Cincy he woulda done what he did today.

All I'm saying is this: Had Moore continued to play, and not played well WHICH IS A POSSIBILITY, it would have made his play in this game unlikely to have happened since he probably wouldn't have started.

That's all. I'm not saying that he sucks or that he's bad or any of that nonsense. Jesus. I don't get why this is so hard. I think the benching helped him. You don't. Get over it. I'm not going to agree with you just because he won some games as a backup in past years. When the team was his, he faltered. Now he's back on track, and I hope he stays that way.

My only problem with your argument Mav is that you still continue to assume the likelyhood that he would have continued to play BAD is greater than the likelyhood that he could have shaken it off and played better.

And if you are not basing it on those 2 games, what are you basing it on? You are bringing in pre-season play into the argument now, which I don't remember the last time that could even be considered in real football talk. Honestly it feels like you are grasping at straws.

But his previous performance, where he won 6 of 8, winning 4 out of 5 last year, and ALWAYS playing solid or better as a starter prior to this season....holds no relevance to you. I just don't understand that. And I don't understand why you continue to look at the "less likely" of the possibilities instead of the more likely.

Yes it is possible that he would have played just as bad if he continued to play, but it is more likely he would have gotten better. It is less likely he would have played so bad as to actually put up a 0.0 QB rating in any half. And then follow it with a 6.2 rating two weeks later.

Possible? Sure. Likely? NO.

[koolkatluke]

Dunno where the quote is (was on the game today) about how he said him being benched helped him look at the game again since he was really out of rhythm until that point.

I think you're also reading the quote wrong. The author is basically asking "what changed", not "did being benched help". As in, "what did HE change to regain his mojo." The answer is he wasn't sure, he just did a lot of soul searching and a lot of watching of film and came out aggressive.

Props to him for finding his rhythm again though, it was fun to watch.

He also said the pressure was getting 2 him and he had alot of things going thru his mind.

I agree he had a great game today (beside the pick 6) but the benching and the fact we have no expection of playoffs helped him.

[PantherFanForLife]

Dunno where the quote is (was on the game today) about how he said him being benched helped him look at the game again since he was really out of rhythm until that point.

I think you're also reading the quote wrong. The author is basically asking "what changed", not "did being benched help". As in, "what did HE change to regain his mojo." The answer is he wasn't sure, he just did a lot of soul searching and a lot of watching of film and came out aggressive.

Props to him for finding his rhythm again though, it was fun to watch.

He's saying Moore would have liked to say that the benching is what improved him, but instead he's not saying that, and he is saying he's not sure.

I know the quote you are talking about. But he wasn't really saying benching transformed him. He's saying he picked up some things from being able to watch a lot of film and viewing things from the sidelines. But he's not saying that if it wasn't for that he would have not improved or gotten better. Him playing a third game and playing it better while watching film during practice could have helped just as much or more.

[Carl Spackler]

He's saying Moore would have liked to say that the benching is what improved him, but instead he's not saying that, and he is saying he's not sure.

I know the quote you are talking about. But he wasn't really saying benching transformed him. He's saying he picked up some things from being able to watch a lot of film and viewing things from the sidelines. But he's not saying that if it wasn't for that he would have not improved or gotten better. Him playing a third game and playing it better while watching film during practice could have helped just as much or more.

Why oh why does it fuging matter? He won the game, why dissect everything he says? This is becoming worship. This isn't attempted translations of Christ's speeches to his disciples, it's a football player's postgame presser regarding being benched earlier in the season. Enjoy the damned win, stop trying to prove to everyone you're his number one fan. You're his number zero fan. :piggy:

[Phil Dees]

49ers have given up the most points in the NFC.

[mav1234]

...whoah whoah, I never said he'd have those Qb ratings. I said he wouldn't play as well as he did today. There's a huge difference. I also have said I don't think he would have played well enough to win us the game against the Bengals. Would he have played better than Clausen in those two halves? I sure as hell hope so considering he is a 4 year pro. The team's struggles were so much greater than the QB in our first 3 games that I don't think it would have mattered.

Anyway, here's the thing: I believe that what a player does for two straight games is likely to be the result in the third straight game, especially when that player has a recent history of struggling. I'm not saying Moore couldn't have found his rhythm eventually, but that because of the nature of this team he may have been benched before he did even if he started week 3, and he may not have been back for this game because of it. So while we can debate if we'd have won a game before this or not, we also may not have won this one. Ultimately, I think benching him helped him. You think it didn't. That's fine. I don't see what the big deal is here - we just don't agree. I'm glad he's found it back, if just for one game.

[PantherFanForLife]

...whoah whoah, I never said he'd have those Qb ratings. I said he wouldn't play as well as he did today. There's a huge difference. I also have said I don't think he would have played well enough to win us the game against the Bengals. Would he have played better than Clausen in those two halves? I sure as hell hope so considering he is a 4 year pro. The team's struggles were so much greater than the QB in our first 3 games that I don't think it would have mattered.

Anyway, here's the thing: I believe that what a player does for two straight games is likely to be the result in the third straight game, especially when that player has a recent history of struggling. I'm not saying Moore couldn't have found his rhythm eventually, but that because of the nature of this team he may have been benched before he did even if he started week 3, and he may not have been back for this game because of it. So while we can debate if we'd have won a game before this or not, we also may not have won this one. Ultimately, I think benching him helped him. You think it didn't. That's fine. I don't see what the big deal is here - we just don't agree. I'm glad he's found it back, if just for one game.

What about the fact that his second game was better and an improvement over the first?

Are you willing to at least give him credit for the dropped pass by Rosario in the second game now after seeing this game?

[PantherFanForLife]

Why oh why does it f**king matter? He won the game, why dissect everything he says? This is becoming worship. This isn't attempted translations of Christ's speeches to his disciples, it's a football player's postgame presser regarding being benched earlier in the season. Enjoy the damned win, stop trying to prove to everyone you're his number one fan. You're his number zero fan. :piggy:

Dude honestly I have no intention of continuing any conversation with you. At least mav can see poo and though he doesn't come out and say it directly, you can tell he admits it when he's wrong.

You, oth, are hopeless. You were still pointing out his interception DURING the game today hoping he would fug up just to prove your own fuged up argument. That's sick. Seriously.

I don't care how much I felt Clausen shouldn't have been our starter...I always supported him when the game started.

[koolkatluke]

What about the fact that his second game was better and an improvement over the first?

Are you willing to at least give him credit for the dropped pass by Rosario in the second game now after seeing this game?

Against a worst team at Home. I would hope he improved but he still threw int's and the offense was going 3 and outs 2 much.

[mav1234]

I don't think he did play much better against TB (if he did at all), to be honest. I thought against New York we at least moved the ball, he just took too many risks.

Look, I think we've both said enough on this topic, so I'm done with it. Think what you want of it, I think benching him helped. Second guessing it now is just speculation and we can agree to disagree on if it would have lead to a better season or not.