If we go 9-7 and miss the playoffs, Rivera should NOT be fired.

[FootballMaestro]

- Rivera can't fire anyone without the GM's and owners permission.

- Coordinators and position coaches never get fired in season, especially when that particular season is already over due to a 1-6 start (or whatever it was).

- Who said that Rivera didn't read Chud the riot act? None of us will ever know.

- Like I've said before, there's only so much you can do in-season if a coordinator and and coach disagree... see Rob Ryan and Jason Garrett. Ryan ignored Garrett's message to simplify the defense but he remained on the staff until the end of the year.

All I can say is that Rivera needs/ed to surround himself with better people/coaches and he did that this offseason.

Also I'm not saying that this happened, it's just speculation on my part based off of various comments from Williams and Tolbert.

 

Excuse me?

 

Why can't, couldn't Rivera fire his Coordinators or position coaches (especially with Hurney there)? Who hired them?

 

None of the evidence, suggest Rivera "read Chud the riot act". And even if he did, it took Hurney's firing for that to happen. Rivera admits, that both he and Chud had agreed to the new change of offensive direction with the Panthers, as early as August 2012 before the season started. 

 

And considering, Chud left Rivera high and dry, after the season. It appears Rivera was "all in on Chud" to continue with him. 

 

It remains to be seen, if 'Rivera surrounded himself with better coaches and people'?

 

I've read articles on Rivera, with quotes from him, which let's me know he as clueless and culpable for the 2012 seasons missteps as much as Chud. 

[FootballMaestro]

- Rivera can't fire anyone without the GM's and owners permission.

- Coordinators and position coaches never get fired in season, especially when that particular season is already over due to a 1-6 start (or whatever it was).

- Who said that Rivera didn't read Chud the riot act? None of us will ever know.

- Like I've said before, there's only so much you can do in-season if a coordinator and and coach disagree... see Rob Ryan and Jason Garrett. Ryan ignored Garrett's message to simplify the defense but he remained on the staff until the end of the year.

All I can say is that Rivera needs/ed to surround himself with better people/coaches and he did that this offseason.

Also I'm not saying that this happened, it's just speculation on my part based off of various comments from Williams and Tolbert.

 

Excuse me?

 

Why can't, couldn't Rivera fire his Coordinators or position coaches (especially with Hurney there)? Who hired them?

 

None of the evidence, suggest Rivera "read Chud the riot act". And even if he did, it took Hurney's firing for that to happen. Rivera admits, that both he and Chud had agreed to the new change of offensive direction with the Panthers, as early as August 2012 before the season started. 

 

And considering, Chud left Rivera high and dry, after the season. It appears Rivera was "all in on Chud" to continue with him. 

 

It remains to be seen, if 'Rivera surrounded himself with better coaches and people'?

 

I've read articles on Rivera, with quotes from him, which let's me know he as clueless and culpable for the 2012 seasons missteps as much as Chud. 

[Cyberjag]

They were in position to win the Super Bowl and they did...

You just further proved my point why Chud wasn't fired in-season... the season was already over as far as the playoffs went.

 

So examples of coordinators fired after dismal starts prove the point why Chud wasn't fired.  And examples of coordinators fired mid-season after successful starts prove the point of why Chud wasn't fired.  Got it.  #HuddleLogic

[Cyberjag]

FWIW, I think the reason Chud wasn't fired was because Rivera didn't think it would make the team better.  And I think Chud takes far, far too much of the blame for what happened early in the year.  But he's a convenient scapegoat for the apologists.

[CarolinaPanthers8789]

Excuse me?

Why can't, couldn't Rivera fire his Coordinators or position coaches (especially with Hurney there)? Who hired them?

None of the evidence, suggest Rivera "read Chud the riot act". And even if he did, it took Hurney's firing for that to happen. Rivera admits, that both he and Chud had agreed to the new change of offensive direction with the Panthers, as early as August 2012 before the season started.

And considering, Chud left Rivera high and dry, after the season. It appears Rivera was "all in on Chud" to continue with him.

It remains to be seen, if 'Rivera surrounded himself with better coaches and people'?

I've read articles on Rivera, with quotes from him, which let's me know he as clueless and culpable for the 2012 seasons missteps as much as Chud.

- Rivera lets the GM know who he wants on his staff and the GM either gives him the thumbs up or thumbs down... it's that simple.

- How do you know Rivera didn't read Chud the riot act? Didn't the offense change half way through the season? Couldn't that have been because Rivera spoke to Chud?

- I don't care what articles you are reading because none of those articles tell you what is going on behind closed doors.

[CarolinaPanthers8789]

FWIW, I think the reason Chud wasn't fired was because Rivera didn't think it would make the team better. And I think Chud takes far, far too much of the blame for what happened early in the year. But he's a convenient scapegoat for the apologists.

So what if Rivera succeeds this year? Will Chud be the scapegoat or will he be seen as the actual problem for the 2012 debacle.

[CarolinaPanthers8789]

So examples of coordinators fired after dismal starts prove the point why Chud wasn't fired. And examples of coordinators fired mid-season after successful starts prove the point of why Chud wasn't fired. Got it. #HuddleLogic

If you actually watched the Ravens you would have known that the defense was the main reason they got off to good a start. It's clear to me that the Ravens thought that with a new coordinator that they had a chance to be a Super Bowl contending team not just a playoff team, so they made the switch...

But hey, it's not my fault if you don't recognize that.

[Cyberjag]

I didn't say that they didn't have a reason.  But I did point out that there's precedent for firing coordinators on winning teams, as well as losing teams.  You want to make it mean something else, go right ahead.  I made no comment whatsoever on why they may have, or why anyone should have.  The only comment I made was that I thought Rivera kept Chud around because he didn't think the team would be better if Chud was fired.

 

But hey, it's not my fault if you don't recognize that. :)

[FootballMaestro]

- Rivera lets the GM know who he wants on his staff and the GM either gives him the thumbs up or thumbs down... it's that simple.

- How do you know Rivera didn't read Chud the riot act? Didn't the offense change half way through the season? Couldn't that have been because Rivera spoke to Chud?

- I don't care what articles you are reading because none of those articles tell you what is going on behind closed doors.

 

You and I certainly see things differently. 

 

Rivera was all in on Chud's Changes. Albert Breer of NFL.com wrote about this earlier this year, with direct quotes from Rivera substantiating this. In this article, Rivera also admits, that Hurney's firing lit a fire underneath him. So I'm not sure what hypotheticals your suggesting here, regarding what Rivera may have or not said to Chud? So what!? The evidence (including at the end of the season), strongly indicates, Rivera was too lax in his management and dependency with Chud. This includes his direct quotes. Why is that so hard for you to admit, understand?

 

And it's nonsense, for you to think that Rivera was basically 'crippled' to demote or fire his coordinator, if he wasn't pleased with him (either before or after the season), with or with out his GM's approval. Do you really think, if Rivera felt strongly about demoting or firing Chud (and made a strong/cogent argument), that Hurney would say no, even if we buy your premise that Rivera would have to check in first? Come on now!

[DaCityKats]

didnt rivera fire his special teams coach mid season?

[Cyberjag]

didnt rivera fire his special teams coach mid season?

 

Shush, you!  You're messing up the narrative with your inconvenient facts. ;)

[CarolinaPanthers8789]

I didn't say that they didn't have a reason. But I did point out that there's precedent for firing coordinators on winning teams, as well as losing teams. You want to make it mean something else, go right ahead. I made no comment whatsoever on why they may have, or why anyone should have. The only comment I made was that I thought Rivera kept Chud around was because he didn't think the team would be better if Chud was fired.

But hey, it's not my fault if you don't recognize that. :)

Maybe Rivera kept him around for that reason, maybe he kept him around because he didn't want to disrupt Cam's progress, maybe he even kept him around to be the scapegoat (maybe Rivera planned on firing Chud after the season with the rest of the coaches that he fired).

The point is, Chud is gone... there are no more excuses...

[CRA]

So you don't think that they are some better NFL, former NFL, and college coaches that aren't (or shown to be) better than Ron Rivera??

I know you're a fan, and feel he may be a great coach one day. Maybe (especially with Gettleman, working with him, and looking over his back)? However, based off of what we seen, I would agree with a recent writer, who said that 'they're were almost 30 better NFL coaches in the NFL than what Rivera has demonstrated so far". I agree.

2 years into his HC career where their better coaches than Bill Belichick?

Rivera has the foundation to be great IMO....he just needs to tweak some stuff and find his identity. I would put RR up against just about anyone from and X and O standpoint. He just needs a little more time feeling out managing the flow of a game.

Plus, I think the big picture for Cam....a new coach drastically decreases his odds if staying here. NFL history is pretty consistant with it. Which is the ultimate pull for RR IMO

[CarolinaPanthers8789]

You and I certainly see things differently.

Rivera was all in on Chud's Changes. Albert Breer of NFL.com wrote about this earlier this year, with direct quotes from Rivera substantiating this. In this article, Rivera also admits, that Hurney's firing lit a fire underneath him. So I'm not sure what hypotheticals your suggesting here, regarding what Rivera may have or not said to Chud? So what!? The evidence (including at the end of the season), strongly indicates, Rivera was too lax in his management and dependency with Chud. This includes his direct quotes. Why is that so hard for you to admit, understand?

That still doesn't mean he couldn't have talked to Chud...

It goes something like this... Rivera tells Chud to stick to the game plan, Chud continues to ignore the game plan... It's that simple

You said, Rivera never spoke to Chud... all I'm saying is that you don't know that.

I'm aware of Rivera's comments about being a little relaxed when it comes to Chud, but once again does that mean that Rivera didn't speak to him? It sure doesn't.

Why is that so hard to understand lol.

You also said that Rivera was in on the changes, so are you calling DeAngelo and Tolbert liars? DeAngelo was quoted as saying that the team game planned to run during practice that week but when they got to the game, those plays weren't called. There was even speculation that Tolbert was actually happy that Chud left.

Once again, how do you know what happened in the front office? For all we know Rivers could have approached Hurney or Beane about changing coordinators and they told him to wait until the season was over.