kungfoodude

Here are some breakdowns for how we stack up to the rest of the NFL in terms of "Draft Quality." This is from 2019-2023, so basically the "Tepper Era." Tepper took over in May 2018, so our 2018 draft was completely without his input at all so it was not included. The current year cannot be included as the wAV/AV is not generated until after the postseason. wAV is Pro Football Reference's Weighted Approximate Value. I didn't do a DrAV breakdown which would isolate for how the drafted players performed for the team that drafted them but this is really a look at overall talent evaluation and not development.

Here is a fun little factoid. From 2018 to 2021(four full drafts) we drafted a total of 33 players). Only four of them are still on the team. A retention rate of 12.1%. From 2022 to 2024 we have drafted 18 players. We currently have only 11 on the team. A retention rate of just 61.1%. I suspect the 2022 to 2024 retention rate will plumment towards the end of those rookie deals. And people wonder why we are so bad.

Those are the picks you throw out in the 5th-7th round. Get some potential special teams aces to develop. But using the same strategy in the 2nd-4th round??? It's nuts. ESPECIALLY when you literally don't have any talent on the team.

This is an underrated comment. I do wonder if our analytical approach is literally completely broken. The numbers/models are only as good as thosd creating them. And they damn sure aren't better than watching the tape and having seasoned evaluators break people down.

Well typically our 1st round guys are just slightly to moderately disappointing. It's the 2nd to 4th rounders where we really do our best work and literally get next to nothing out of.

I mean, in a year where we have all the PT in the world available we have very limited impact. XL has been extremely unreliable with flashes of why we drafted him. Brooks is still MIA. Wallace piled up a bunch of tackles yesterday being apparently the only guy that can actually wrap up on the team. Sanders looks completely lost when he is on the field more often than not. So MAYBE one impact-ish player so far? That's terrible.

Yeah, there has been past grumblings about our scouting department, I remember. Has anyone looked at an org. chart to see how long thess guys have been with us? @Mr. Scot is this something you did a deep dive on in the past by chance?

A lot of those offenses in college just train you to be a zombie. I am painting with a broad stroke here so don't take this as anything that is 100%. The scheme allows technically less adept players to also excel. Hence why you see a guy like Mingo look good in that kind of offense in college. But he is a sloppy route runner and has poor hands.

You could have drafted a guy that will absolutely have a long and successful NFL career in Ladd McConkey. Certainly, he is never going to be a Jefferson, Adams, etc but he is going to carve out a meaningful role as a slot receiver. These are the type of guys we absolutely refuse to take. Sure things. Or maybe we just overdraft an injured RB instead of a starting caliber NFL center in Zach Frazier? We just keep doing the same ignorant horseshit. We shoot for high ceiling, very low floor guys over and over and over again. And we do it completely regardless of the fact that we have so unbelievably rarely been able to develop any of that talent. Without the luxury of having a deep roster to stash someone on to develop. Look at poor Wallace. Another high ceiling and incredibly low floor guy that isn't playing special teams....he's fuging starting and stinking it up. Why? Why do we keep doing this to ourselves and these fuging players?

Given our rich history to draft insane busts(TMJ, Mingo, Corral being recent examples) but spanning multiple iterations of General Managers, do you think the core of the problem is our management or our scouting department? Do we have long tenured scouts that have been here through multiple terrible drafts?

He has the capability to be a shut down corner but I worry about the high mileage on him. But, this is also one of the very few areas on the team we seem to be above average at. Admittedly, the idea of Hunter/Horn as a combo is pretty amazing.

You mean not body catchers that "bloomed" as 5th year WR's? Or air raid guys?

I would basically go to our scouting department and ask for their favorite WR's outside the first round. Immediately take those guys off the board entirely.

I am fine. I moved into the "acceptance" part early last season. I know this is going to suck for a very long time so I basically don't get worked up at all about it.

He won't but he is also a success driven egomaniac, so this will all hurt him. This is the one small glimmer of hope we have is that he doesn't appear to be happy about failure. Snyder didn't want to fail but he meddled because it "wasn't fun" if he wasn't intimately involved. Guys like Modell were notoriously cheap. Michael Jordan is the perfect example, as he was never interested in winning if it cost him a dime of this money. Jerry Jones always believes he knows best, so he will never stop meddling, despite almost all his true success being authored by a far more knowledgeable football mind. So in that regard, perhaps we have a leg up on some of these scenarios....in theory. The question is whether he is capable of learning the NFL(doubtful), whether he is capable of eventually backing into a talented architect of a successful organization(doubtful) and maybe most importantly, if he can keep his hands off the product IF we do finally get the right building blocks in place. That last one seems highly doubtful. He amassed his fortune by doing his own thing and running it on his own. So all of his success has been defined by him being "the man." I don't see that being something easy to deprogram, especially for someone that is in his age range.

I will continue to watch games because I am still a fan. As you said, the butts in the seat is such an insanely small portion of the NFL profits that it isn't relevant at all to Tepper's bottom line. But, us not showing up will at least further embarrass him. Perhaps we will get some more incidents of him being heckled in his box by all the opposing fanbases in his stadium.

I really am perplexed anytime someone argues with me about it taking multiple offseasons to fix this roster's talent issue. I just cannot fathom how anyone cannot see this. We are utterly devoid of talent, core players, winning culture and talent that we drafted. But people think this is a 1-2 year turnaround??? LOL. How?? Even if we nailed every single move in the next two offseasons, that isn't enough to bridge the gap to this being a contending football team. Hence why I said what I said earlier this season, this is not rebuilding. This is building. There is quite literally only two players on our roster that extend back to Rivera's culture. There are zero drafted players on this roster who have experienced anything but losing and chaos. The rest of this roster is a hodgepodge assortment of journeymen. These aren't culture instilling players. Frankie Luvu was a guy like that and he wanted out of here ASAP. What should that tell everyone? This isn't rebuilding. The foundation is completely removed. This is building. And there is no expansion draft to magically fix our roster.

Oh absolutely. None of these guys created this scenario. Bryce didn't trade for himself. TMJ/Mingo/XL didn't over draft themselves. Miles Sanders didn't sign himself to an absolute goofy amount of money. This is what bad ownership looks like. It isn't even remotely unprecedented. There are ample examples of what we are going through in the past 25+ years from the NFL, NBA, NHL, and MLB. Bad owners hire bad management, who hire bad evaluators and all of them hire bad coaches and/or bad talent. This is what this was supposed to look like.

I got annoyed at Mingo stinking it up yesterday just because it's so predictable that he would be a bust. That's as close to getting mad as I got. I was watching with other fans so I mainly just had a good time roasting the team and laughing. I watch with casual interest rather than living or dying with their success. After last season, I knew this was going to get a lot worse before it got better. As I said literally last season, I don't see a winning season until at least 2030. We are too far from having the talent to do that and we don't appear to have improved(IMO) enough in the FO to make that change happen. So the path to winning football is likely to be at least one more overhaul away.

"Wait till next year" about to have a whole new meaning.

I mean it's the least talented defense this franchise has ever fielded and that is if we were at full strength with no injuries. Did you think that would get better starting former Home Depot stockers from the PS?

Just got rid of my PSL's last year and merch boycott is about 3 seasons old.

XL has another full season to show me something. Mingo I would normally say the same but he is just so bad at just about everything. He hasn't visibly improved on just about any aspect of catching the football. He is not an NFL WR, plain and simple.

It was blatantly obvious Mingo was a bust after last season, same as TMJ. People just don't want to believe what they are seeing. I am gonna tell ya'll now.....don't be surprised to see XL end up in this category, as well.

We will do something ignorant like franchise him to hold him hostage.