MHS831

Not to intervene--sometimes we can get pulled or pushed on here and it shifts from the Panthers to each other--but I respect both of your opinions--maybe some common ground, where you are 95% of the time? I am out--just a thought.

I heard or read that he was eyeballing the Jags job at one time. We shall see--after that owner threw the GM under the bus on national TV, I might reconsider---It was my opinion at the time that Jerry Richardson's "Pie chart" presser days before underclassmen had to declare for the draft was the reason Andrew Luck went back to school--same effect. If you recall, he made no damn sense, he seemed to hit on Morgan Fogherty and he trashed Darin Gantt.

He cost himself millions of dollars in the last six hours spent on a football field--like in the 30-40 million range. My diagnosis is this: The DCs looked at Jets Panthers tape and realized that they could get into his head--. Sam Darnold is the quintessential front runner--a fair weather friend--the loudest singer in the choir at weddings and the lip sync master at funerals. I would like to add that there were several sacks where I saw 2 or, at times, 3 OL looking dazed and confused. A few times he had 2 OL not touch a defensive player. I think Darnold just became a Colt or Brown.

saw this after my post at about 8:09 this AM---I stole your idea--great minds.

Welcome back, Sam.

McCarthy knows football--I am guessing da Bears. Dont want him in Nawlins.

I think we need a new DT (NT) and a 3T as well--both need to be starters. I see A Robinson as rotational at this point in his career. There are some good DL in the draft--but you dont want 2 rookies--one FA, one rookie, in my view. Tuttle sucked at NT, and then there is this:

Jones does whatever he can to keep the Cowboys in the news. He is pathetic because his antics hurt him in the long run.

If you have not seen THE BEST OF TIME you need to watch it--

Here is what i do not get--Morgan says, "We gonna get some DAWGS." XL has gifts, size, speed, but Morgan's first draft pick--the one he traded up for-- is not a dawg. I want him to do well, but he needs to be the alpha and take it to the defensive back. It is not just about being physical, but it is a mindset that makes you think you are the best player on the field--that the others are scared of you--it is not about running your mouth--it is between the ears. I think he will be better by next year. Forget the accent--forget the Possum pudding--get your frigging head right and start thinking that every ball in the air is your next touchdown.

Yeah, but he made teammates call him Laddness because he liked Hunger Games.

early day 3?

yeah, when you need 7 starters, that is a third of the starting roster. Not counting Horn (if he can't be signed, he needs to be dealt. If we could get a draft pick for him and save $25m or more, that is potentially three good players. I am big into trading back if Carter is gone--I think we can add 4 contributing starters if we do--I am also a fan of bringing in a stud pass catching TE (instead of reaching for a WR in the draft or free agency-not a good year). If we can add the pieces on the DL, we will improve. They made the LBs and DBs worse.

It is kinda like when girls you dated become lesbians after you break up. Was it you, or simply coincidence?

Remember, this is the guy who came out and told the press that the Panthers were going to draft him before they drafted him.

I understand that thought completely---depends on the board, but I think there will be a bunch available after the draft. Did you notice I forgot QB? Not intentionally, but we have talked about it so much, why bother now? I might draft Scattleboo or whatever because he is so unique (to me) and would play many roles (STs, good blocker, FB if needed, etc.)

January 11 2025: And so it was written.... Not getting into too much depth concerning new contract extensions etc–I figure Horn and Ickey (and possibly Jackson) are the priorities right now and it does not have to happen all at once. I think you decide what you need to be successful then work on contracts until it happens–I believe the Panthers expect to be competitive in 2025. The South is wide open–Tampa Bay is not a team that cannot be dethroned and they are aging, Atlanta is now riding on Pennix, and The Saints are headed for a roster overhaul, starting with Carr (word on the street says they were interested in Russell Wilson before his late season collapse.) Offensive Line. (1-2 depth players) Brady Christensen is going to pimp his services in free agency. He is a valuable backup, but I think he has been misused. He is a short-armed swing tackle, but we have him at G and C. Let him look. Nijman is still under contract for $5m per season and I think I would draft an OT (to backup and possibly Moton’s replacement in a year or two. Cutting Nijman would save $3.6 m and I think a rookie would give you as much Nijman has a 57.9 PFF rating, and I think that might be high, but his pass blocking rating was 84th of 141 OTs overall and his run blocking was 112 of 141 OTs. I think a rookie can do better, like maybe Kingston. Nijman will be 30.. Besides, you should draft an OL every year anyway. Tight End (1 starter). Ja’Tavion Sanders flashed too little and Tremble had 200+ yards entering Free Agency. In my view, neither is the Alpha TE we need at the position. Sanders is only 21, so he should get better, but Bryce Young needs a stud. Do not be surprised to see us make a move at TE. I think a top TE could improve our offense as much as any WR in this draft. Full stop. Wide Receiver (1 starter, 1 depth player). Xavier is a project in year 2 and I expect improvement from him. He needs to start being treated like a football player and not some novelty from a SC time warp. He will. Coker is becoming a solid pro. AT is flirting with time, but he is solid–shows that hands and route running mechanics are more important than 40 times. We could go WR in round 1 if T-Mac is there, or we could try to fill the WR room with Cokers. Maybe the way to give Bryce weapons is at TE and possession WR–I see a lot of them in the draft–few Alphas. For example, there are only 2 WRs that have first round grades, and only 1 projects to a #1–arguably. (I do not see Egbuka, Ohio State, as a first round prospect and he has never been a #1 on his college team). If you have 4-5 guys who can catch the ball and a TE who is also a threat, why do you need what we call a #1 WR? Currently, the Panthers have XL, Coker, AT- we should bring Moore back on the cheap. We need 2 more WRs, one needs to have the ability to start. If the Panthers added 1 WR (with the ability to start) and a #1 TE, this offense would improve, but we need a sixth WR regardless–injuries always happen and rarely is the WR room without a player sitting out. Running Back. (1 depth player) Sanders is probably gone. One of the previous administrations’ dumbest moves. Chuba has been solid, as we all know, and the draft is loaded at RB, which means there will be some UDFAs available. We need a RB who can block, catch, and hit the holes–It was hard to watch Arizona State without thinking, “That would be a great backup/short yardage RB and special teamer” when you saw Skatteboo or whatever his name is. As much as some of us think you don’t spend draft picks on RB, I say it is 10x better than signing a RB on a second contract. I think you might get more value out of a fifth round RB than you would a fifth-round CB or Edge. Cornerback. (1 starter). There is a lot of drama at this position. You have an oft-injured CB who will want pro bowler money because he is worth it when on the field. You have an UFA who came in and earned a starting job. Smith-Wade seems ready to play the nickel as the starter; a good tackler who seems pretty instinctive. Finally, Akayleb Evans and Shemar Bartholomew quietly proved that they should be the depth conversation in 2025, both with PFF scores in the mid fifties. I am confident the Panthers will sign Horn, but what to do if Mike Jackson leaves? Is the answer on the roster? Personally, I think if the Panthers get Jackson back, the starters are Horn, Jackson, and Smith-Wade with Evans and Bartholomew behind them entering camp–that is a decent–not great–CB room. I think you try to re-sign Mike Jackson because we know what he can do in this system. If the Horn extension negotiations do not go well, consider trading Horn for picks and cap room. At least you know that we are not giving guaranteed money to an ice tub Eskimo. Safety. (2, 1 starter, 1 depth) Demani Richardson is 24 and played 400+ snaps and has a 60+ PFF grade. He is a big S who can tackle. He was better than starting SS Jordan Fuller (54 PFF grade) who he split reps with, for the most part. Richardson starting at S is probably a given. On the other side, it is wide open. Woods played 1200 snaps with 3 picks but his PFF score was 57. He will be 30 next season, and is an UFA. We need a starting S and we need a backup. Nick Scott (UFA) is also going to be 30 and his PFF grade in 324 snaps is low (52.6). We can do better, so look for Richardson to be the SS and look for us to draft (probably) a FS to start. Inside Linebacker. (2, one starter, maybe 1 depth). Jewell (56.5 PFF) will be 32 and should play better with a better DL; however, he is a far cry from the Mills, Morgan, Beason, Luke tradition in Charlotte. Since one of those LBs is now our GM, I cannot see us watching Shaq leave without replacing him with a Dog. Wallace (56 PFF score) was fine, but behind that DL, hard to gauge. He seems to be a backup LB. I just do not see Morgan sitting back in this draft, with so many good LBs, and not getting a “Dawg.” to play inside. Windmon showed signs of having a shot, and they may want to look at Rhattigan a bit more. Still need that Alpha Dawg. Defensive Line: (2 starters, 1 depth) Gone: NT–Shy Tuttle (42.7 PFF score) Deshawn Williams (47.9 PFF score); LaBryan Ray (33 PFF score). NO WONDER WE SUCKED. Questionable: A’Shawn Robinson (DE) had a 54.6 PFF rating and is due $10m salary in 2025. He will be 30. Derrick Brown returns, but aside from Robinson, the cupboards appear to be bare. Yes, there is Jaden Crumedy (not good in 2024) and Sam Roberts who played 24 snaps in 2025, so who knows how deep this cut really is? Ideally, we could save a lot of $$ ($5m) by cutting Robinson, but we really have nothing else, so if you cut him, DE becomes a priority. I think he will be better with Brown and a good NT inside. We need a NT. We need a DE to challenge Robinson. Edge/OLB: (1 starter–or developmental rotational player) Clowney (70.8 PFF) has a $14m cap figure and Wonnum (55 PFF) has a $8m cap number. That is $22m for average to below average. Barno showed a few signs of turning the corner in very limited play this season (injured) and his salary is $1m. DJ Johnson had 1 pressure in nearly 400 snaps. Thomas Incoom only played 41 snaps, but his PFF score was nearly 80: he is 25. Cam Gill (27) played over 200 snaps but his PFF score was 49.1. If it were me, I would add a pass-rushing edge and keep Clowney, Wonnum, Barno, and Incoom. Need Starters (7): NT, S, WR, OLB, CB, TE, ILB . (While TE is not essential, it is more important than people realize and Tremble is a free agent. You could pencil in Sanders as a starter, but he is not starting material at this time….CB is removed from this list if we re-sign Mike Jackson or another quality veteran….OLB is a big need because long term need and rotational participation is emphasized at this position.) Need Depth: DE, OL, S, ILB, RB, WR

I think a free agent pass rusher (if we keep Wonnum and Clowney) would break the bank (without doing any research, mind you), so I think we have to look draft for that edge....S? I think we can get a free agent to help. I am guessing Fuller will not be back and Richardson will step up into that role--and I am also guessing that Woods will not be back--Of course,before teams start negotiating, you don't know what you have but I really like Tre'von Moehrig from the Raiders. He does not sound that interested in returning to Vegas. He is 26 and covers the field.

I liked Sawyer when he was a second rounder, but not in the first. I think he has limitations, but he is a dawg. Not sure he will ever be that 12 sack guy, but you will get 6 and he will hold the edge, imo. I am afraid this game will inflate his stock. I think this draft is pretty even from about pick 12 through the second round--not a huge dropoff--the play may be to trade back and get 3 players instead of staying at #8 and getting another pick at #54 or so. I think we are going to need 2 DL, 1 edge, 1 CB, 1 LB, and maybe 2 Safeties. Not sure if we are keeping Clowney and/or Wonnum-as much as it hurts our cap, we probably should.

I don't assume Allar will declare after that game he had vs. ND. He probably needs a year anyway.

I have not kept up with who wants whom, and that might be the best move for the Browns in the long term. Stefanski has one year, I would assume, so breaking in a rookie might not be in his best interest. My first thought was Cousins--who the Falcons will want to deal-- I could see the Browns taking a second-tier QB from this draft--Ewers maybe, or Howard.

You bring up an interesting point--of course, we will know what I am about to post during free agency, but here is how I see it (shooting from the hip based on mocks): Quality players are available: Round 1: All positions except QB Round 2: If you need an edge, better get it by end of round 2. WR, DBs that are likely to make a difference year 1 are gone by mid round 2. Round 3: DT/DEs run out in round 3 I really like the DT/DE depth in this draft--So much I might double dip (NT) and 3 tech (DE). WR? Free agency is not good, and you have to ask, "When are we getting a WR?" You could add edge early, but if we plan to keep Clowney and Wonnum et al, can we get one later? Doubt it, which suggests that we may need to try to trade back and get the second or third best edge and WR early, DT/DE in rounds 2 and 3. Just how I feel right now.

The Browns pick second, and they were prepared to renegotiate Watson's deal and go with him--until Thursday's second surgery--he could be done (my opinion). Regardless, the Browns have to take a QB--Ward or Sanders. Wonder how Coach Prime feels about baby Prime playing in Cleveland?

He is 29. Never earned a starting gig he could hold. Decent value as a swing T, but we played him at G and C. He is not a necessity, and you gotta lose some to gain some. Go figure. I think we need to draft a T to replace BC as a top swing T (Nijman is not the answer) and eventual Moton replacement. Moton's knees (knee issues on a big man are not good) and when we sign Ickey, Moton's contract could be an issue if we cannot extend him. Always plan ahead for unseen circumstances. If you think the agents don't know when you are vulnerable, you would be wrong for thinking the agents don't know when you are vulnerable. Good thread. I would like to see us analyze the S situation, the LB situation, DTs, and the OLB /edge situation soon.

Seriously, everyone had a right to criticize Bryce and they have a right to be skeptical now--his positive sample size is small. But I agree that he showed us enough to change our approach to QB in 2025. And Daniels points out how well he was reading the defense. Hats off to the OL, and especially Cade Mays who stepped in at C and improved us. Coker who is going to be fun to watch in 2025 because he was just getting started-great hands, nice size, and a gamer. Add a WR or two and maybe a TE and this offense is going to be way groovy.