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There was a brief time where many in the fanbase considered if we should seek his services after the dumpster fire that was the Matt Rhule experience had us completely downbad. Such is the result of living with the Tepper's as owners.

I know Herniay, gettlegut, shittererererrer, shinkshipsefort never took a awful OL or DL and solved the problems more than one year flukes. The depth is about as good as ever too, Cam Jackson and JHH have been inactive main stays. Panthers have been protecting them for a big portion of the season, cause Im sure some team would claim them. Sam Roberts was like the 10th DLmen and failcons signed him to their roster before week 1 and he's been there since. When teams are signing your 6th string player to a 53 roster, thats a great sign. Its against my rules to judge rookie class in their 1st season, but they've injected this team with talent and energy. 21% change with youth that by the early looks many have enough talent to help the team. Thor was getting starter snaps before his awful injury and he's not included. This group was under Dan and Tils watch, they had to add a 2nd rounder to counter that BY trade. Trade-wise they have been on the clear winning side on all 5-6 of them, the AT one looks arrestable right now. No one bats 1.000 on FA moves, they have bought something to roster. Turk had injuries and not playing at his salary-level, but he's stepping up with leadership and busting his arse in the weight room. Boom is leading too. Rico broke some all-time records and was lava hot leading the NFC in rushing without many snaps. Moehring has upped the talent level and able to play close to LOS while guarding TEs. They found Brycen Tremayne young perfect #4-5 WR that plays hard on STs. He a great blocker and I think he's can improve to a #3 type role given his young age and work ethic. He was the one that screwed up the WR numbers, no one had him making the team against 9 NFL WRs. The guy just busted his arse and made them roster him. Great under radar find, shame he's not gotten props. Early in the season he caught some big time balls too. I think for sure they have improved this team and done so with youth. If they get another 12 or so players like this 2025 class in 2026......That may build for the the first time, a team that can go to the playoff year after year.

If you actually edited those games out every time you mention his last season stats then more power to you. That's not the norm as most people just pull the stats from major sites like ESPN and NFL.com. Have fun looking at your posts for it. Maybe you will see how fixated you have become on a certain topic.

This is young’s time to shine Execute or take your seat at the kiddie table i can say this. The Bryce that comes out of the tunnel will tell the tale of this game and the season watch his face in warmups or on the first offensive series if he looks like he just turned off a video game in his pajamas leaving his momma’s basement, kinda deer in the headlights like the 49ers or sleepwalking like the first saints game, it is over if he looks focused and composed, a chance he can be very uneven

yeah, and in this case, people wanted to talk about a full time starter vs a guy that had garbage time games mixed in. I would wager a fun bet, I can find a post of mine, where I did that very thing for Bryce Young last year and edited those games out.

If I'm being honest, I still have no idea what to think of Bryce. And the uncertainty/divide in how to think of him only further shows why everyone is in a bit of a tough spot (fans, the team, heck, Bryce himself) He's had: 3 non-consecutive stellar games this year (DAL, LAR, ATL-2) - no disputing this 2 games where he initially looked terrible and then turned it around (AZ, MIA) - Both started so bad but he eventually came around. 6 where he was just really bad and difficult to watch. What we've been used to and was as recent as Thanksgiving on National TV. 1 where he didn't need to do much and we won handedly (ATL-1) - I think what a lot comes down to - Most fans REALLY don't like the fact that he has insurmountable physical limitations, so when he's bad, it feels like the pit of misery. Being stuck with a guy with no real elite physical traits where the team needs to be near perfect. It's just like "Ugh we're stuck with this shrimp dick?" He only very recently pulled together a game where he showed off franchise ability. I just need to see more. Nothing has come together but we've finally seen a flash. Took a while, but the Atlanta and Rams games were what I want to see. Hope it can continue. The duds just hit you like a frying pan to the head.

Exactly. Which means data.... doesn't always tell the whole story! Congrats we are officially fully circle again. Love talking in circles with you. Data without context is pointless. You can also skew it to tell whatever story you want, like looking at just games a player starts, GWDs, PFF etc...

Regardless most lists are not removing data from games players missed part of whether they got hurt or came off the bench. I don't think people are removing the game Bryce came off the bench when they are looking at this totals last year. It's typically cumulative.

I think without manipulating the data, Gunner is the GOAT

That's a fairly big loss, especially for squaring up against our interior. First things first, we better freaking beat the Saints

it's not so much my case, as IMO you suggest I am uniquely doing something here for Shough...... but how I simply have always talked about QBs. Specifically, ones that haven't started all season. I have done that with basically everyone for years. I mean, I guess my point is, you can disagree with caring about starts and think backup player garbage time games is just as important of data and shouldn't be separated. I'm just saying I'm not uniquely doing it for Shough. That's what I always do. I have done it with all the Panthers QBs over the years that weren't starters the full season.

What do you think that means?

It's pretty simple as they are very close. When you look at season totals Bryce barely beats him in a few stats. When you look at starts he barely beats Bryce. Most of the major sites have their data listed by season totals but you are looking at starts as it helps your case. That's all. Regardless they are playing close with Bo Nix right there as well.

That's what I'm talking about

No, I'm saying it doesn't help the ACC and their rep having their largely lower to mid-tier teams getting their asses beat by ND on national TV. The only other major conference their current deal may have made sense for was the Big 12 and that commissioner has basically been the only guy in a position of relevance who had had the balls to basically tell ND to fug off so I don't see that happening. The ACC holds the upper hand here if they're just willing to play their cards instead of panicking and folding every time ND bluffs.

we got a guy for that

We gotta hit em hard in the nuts.

data manipulation!

of the last 6 games, how many would you say featured good NFL QB play? Jets, Green Bay, New Orleans, Falcons, 49ers, Rams. How is he playing well, if he was not good in 4 of the last 6? It's the recurring trend of letting the last game when it goes okay have drastically too much weight.

How the fug did he beat us......

really need a thread on the Saints D. Really feels like a large % of Panthers fans dismiss the last Saints game and just some fluke and we will just win this week. There QB and D didn't just play well vs us last time, past several weeks they seem to have really gotten on a good track vs earlier this year. It will be a tough game IMO, just as tough as the Bucs games will be.

from my perspective, I call looking at quarterbacks starts when talking about him....and someone calling that manipulating the data, a wild take though. Think it's the most accurate way to view what you get out of a QB when his team and the opposing team both have game planned w/ that QB in mind and you have the full game. All these random bits of games distort the statistics IMO. What does saying Shough is playing surprisingly well mean? Literally nothing outside of our next opponent has a rookie playing surprisingly well (and it's enough we can't dismiss that after a very surprising first game vs us). and it's not a favor done just for him. I've always taken out the random games form dudes when talking about them when the sample size is small. I mean, ask PJ Walker to come in a blowout or start a game and IMO you get 2 very different things out of PJ Walker. If you are playing against him next week, it's probably best to acknowledge the variant that starts vs inserted late.

i think this game will have a more balanced attack. yes, establish the run, but don't be afraid to spread them out early if they stack 8 in the box.