Allen vs Thomas

[AU-panther]

Johnathan Allen and Solomon Thomas are two names that you hear as possibilities for us if they happen to be there at 8.  In some ways I consider them somewhat the same in that that they played more like DTs in college.  For the sake of discussion here are their results from yesterday. 

All of this from http://www.nfl.com/combine/tracker#day=sunday

If I miss counted a ranking please let me know

                             Allen                                    Thomas

Height                    6'3"                                        6'3'

Weight                   286                                        273

Arm                      33 5/8"                                     33"

40yrd                 5.00 sec (35th)                         4.69 sec (11th)

Bench                   21 (35th)                                   30(4th)

Vert                      30" (29th)                                   35" (5th)

Broad                  108" (39th)                                  126"(5th)

3 cone                 7.49 sec (30th)                          6.95 sec (4th)

20 yrd shuttle        4.5 sec (28th)                           4.28 sec (3th)

60 yrd shuttle    not listed yet

Of the two I think it is pretty safe to say Thomas has the better chance of playing DE in our scheme.  Actually those numbers are very impressive for Thomas considering he is 273 lbs. and some of the other lineman are 250lb edge types.  That 3 cone and 20 yrd shuttle should alleviate some fears about having the quickness to play on the edge.  I know Barnett was sick the day before but Thomas even did better than him in every drill, including the quickness ones. 

In some ways Thomas feels like maybe the safest top 10 pick.  He seems to check all the boxes, high production, great athletic testing, from what I've read high motor and character .  I don't think he has any kind of serious injury history.  Also DE is a high value position so if he is successful you are getting a lot of value out of the rookie contract.  About the only thing is he is a bit shorter than what people would like for a DE.

 

[Mr. Miagi]

Thomas > Allen

[Catufb85]

Give me Thomas at #8 if Adams, Fournette, or Hooker are gone.

[Growl]

The two really aren't comparable in terms of talent. Allen was a physical monster who could take over games at any position. Thomas is in that second tier range, probably far better suited as a 3 tech but will be pushed outside because of his size (or lack thereof)

[Mr. Miagi]

3 minutes ago, Growl said:

The two really aren't comparable in terms of talent. Allen was a physical monster who could take over games at any position. Thomas is in that second tier range, probably far better suited as a 3 tech but will be pushed outside because of his side. 

Both are actually more similar than you think. They're not fast speedy pass rusher. They beat you by pure power, inside and outside. They're better suited inside in a 43 or outside as a 34 DE. Thomas would make more sense as a 43 DE, like you said bc of his size. Thomas is actually a little more athletic. 

Barnett or Taco would be different. Thomas and Allen are pretty much the same. 

[AU-panther]

1 minute ago, Growl said:

The two really aren't comparable in terms of talent. Allen was a physical monster who could take over games at any position. Thomas is in that second tier range, probably far better suited as a 3 tech but will be pushed outside because of his size. 

Maybe but he did test better in the quickness drills than almost all of the so called "edge" guys.

[Growl]

1 minute ago, Mr. Miagi said:

Both are actually more similar than you think. They're not fast speedy pass rusher. They beat you by pure power, inside and outside. They're better suited inside in a 43 or outside as a 34 DE. Thomas would make more sense as a 43 DE, like you said bc of his size. Thomas is actually a little more athletic. 

Barnett or Taco would be different. Thomas and Allen are pretty much the same. 

They are comparable in how they were utilized. The comparisons beyond that are pretty slim.

[Mr. Miagi]

Just now, Growl said:

They are comparable in how they were utilized. The comparisons beyond that are pretty slim.

Like what ? 

[Growl]

Just now, Mr. Miagi said:

Like what ? 

Allen maintains control at the point of attack as well as anybody I've ever watched at the college level. His backfield vision is superb. Hes both a technician and an athlete. 

 

Thomas is a handchecker with a heavy swipe. Game consists of largely quick upper body movement.

 

Really I'd like somebody who slots in more obviously into our team rather than playing any kind of position hockey but we'll see what happens.

[AU-panther]

5 minutes ago, Mr. Miagi said:

Both are actually more similar than you think. They're not fast speedy pass rusher. They beat you by pure power, inside and outside. They're better suited inside in a 43 or outside as a 34 DE. Thomas would make more sense as a 43 DE, like you said bc of his size. 

Barnett or Taco would be different. Thomas and Allen are pretty much the same. 

Speaking of Taco, Thomas did better than him in every drill also.  Outside of Garrett, Taco and Barnett are probably the 2 defensive ends that most people would consider next in line. Thomas did considerable better in every drill than both of them including the quickness type of drills such as 3 cone.

This idea that he doesn't have the speed to play on the edge is it because he wasn't asked to in his college system or because he can't?

Also people need to consider that we just signed Addison to a decent size deal.  Addison is going to play RDE.  You don't sign a guy to that kind of deal to be a back up.  This is one reason I don't think Barnett is really in consideration for us.

The LDE on the other hand tends to be covered up by a TE on a lot of plays, so inside power is probably a little more important on he left side.  Not to mention run support is more important.

[5up]

Thomas more explosive.. faster we need that


Sent from my iPhone using CarolinaHuddle

[Mr. Miagi]

22 minutes ago, Growl said:

Allen maintains control at the point of attack as well as anybody I've ever watched at the college level. His backfield vision is superb. Hes both a technician and an athlete. 

 

Thomas is a handchecker with a heavy swipe. Game consists of largely quick upper body movement.

 

Really I'd like somebody who slots in more obviously into our team rather than playing any kind of position hockey but we'll see what happens.

Then I say, you take Barnett or Taco over both guys. 

[The Lobo]

44 minutes ago, Catufb85 said:

Give me Thomas at #8 if Adams, Fournette, or Hooker are gone.

I don't see hooker getting past the Chargers 

[Albion Panthers]

Will be really disappointed if Allen is the pick at 8