Greg Hardy shows elite speed...

[mmmbeans]

Bullshit I have always said Peppers was not giving his all so dont even come with that crap. The fact was he was the most talented not the best. He got shut down most games by a TE and Beason had to call him out before he even showed signs of life. The only game he was our best DE was the Vikings game. The rest of the time he was hurting the team by not trying.

which DE on our team last year would you say was better than peppers?

[SorthNarolina]

Bullshit I have always said Peppers was not giving his all so dont even come with that crap. The fact was he was the most talented not the best. He got shut down most games by a TE and Beason had to call him out before he even showed signs of life. The only game he was our best DE was the Vikings game. The rest of the time he was hurting the team by not trying.

No defensive lineman even came close to Peppers in any sense. Peppers playing half assed is still way better than anybody on the team right now. A lot of fans including me think he was inconsistent in his effort, but he was still very good.

Everybody loves to talk about how he took plays off, but the big elephant in the room for a lot of fans is that he took plays on.

So to avoid giving Peppers any credit at all, or facing the music that he will be difficult to replace, people come up with far fetched stories to try and make it all better.

I'm happy he's gone, we have too many other players who like it here and want to be here. It wouldn't be right to reward him and then let go of a player that is just as good(kalil, beason, williams) who actually wants to be here. But he was a very valuable part of this defense and he will be tough to replace. It's not that difficult of a concept to grasp.

[PantherBob]

Bullshit I have always said Peppers was not giving his all so dont even come with that crap. The fact was he was the most talented not the best. He got shut down most games by a TE and Beason had to call him out before he even showed signs of life. The only game he was our best DE was the Vikings game. The rest of the time he was hurting the team by not trying.

That is officially the dumbest thing I have ever heard

[Stone]

hey guys, peppers is gone why are we still talking about him?

[SorthNarolina]

hey guys, peppers is gone why are we still talking about him?

The same reasons that Hoover or Harris get mentioned. They were losses so we talk about how we might replace them.

[MHS831]

Peppers is the standard at DE and how we fill that void is crucial to our success. As for the emotion, I don't think it would be as strong if Peppers had gone to college at Michigan or UCLA.

Hardy is pure upside at little cost. If he returns to the beast he was his Jr year, we could be better at the DE position even if nobody is better than Peppers. However, I wonder about the impact of a Pepperless lockerroom. At OTAs there was much more intensity that in previous years, in my opinion. There seemed to be fewer cliques. I think the moves we made (or didn't make) drop our talent level, but they are set to make it up in other ways. We'll see.

[Snake]

which DE on our team last year would you say was better than peppers?

Brayton and Johnson both had more pressures then Peppers last year. Its unfortunate that they dont record Pressures but its just as important or more then sacks. Peppers was beat by his man more often then not last year and even was benched a few early games for Johnson. This is until Beason called him out. Could Peppers have been our best DE last year? For sure.. Was he NO.....

No defensive lineman even came close to Peppers in any sense. Peppers playing half assed is still way better than anybody on the team right now. A lot of fans including me think he was inconsistent in his effort, but he was still very good.

Everybody loves to talk about how he took plays off, but the big elephant in the room for a lot of fans is that he took plays on.

So to avoid giving Peppers any credit at all, or facing the music that he will be difficult to replace, people come up with far fetched stories to try and make it all better.

I'm happy he's gone, we have too many other players who like it here and want to be here. It wouldn't be right to reward him and then let go of a player that is just as good(kalil, beason, williams) who actually wants to be here. But he was a very valuable part of this defense and he will be tough to replace. It's not that difficult of a concept to grasp.

See your doing the same thing you hate. Your making mountains out of ant hills. Peppers was beat by his man more times then not last year. They didnt even cover him with a TE and a T some game.... Call it want you want but that road still ends at the same place. He was a avg DE most of the year and a few games he was a Super Star. Still 2 great games dose not make up for 14 games you were not a factor. We might not be better at Pass rush this year but I can tell you we want be worse. We have guys that want to play and will play hard every game. With a good coach that most of the time results in good things.

[Snake]

That is officially the dumbest thing I have ever heard

and your so smart you hear things on a message board.

[SorthNarolina]

Brayton and Johnson both had more pressures then Peppers last year. Its unfortunate that they dont record Pressures but its just as important or more then sacks. Peppers was beat by his man more often then not last year and even was benched a few early games for Johnson. This is until Beason called him out. Could Peppers have been our best DE last year? For sure.. Was he NO.....

Maybe we have a different definition of "best". "Best" to me means the player who is making the most impact and producing the most. "Best" to you seems to mean who plays with the most effort. Effort is nice, but it needs to amount to something. You don't get All-pro and pro-bowl awards for effort, you need to have some ability too.

Acording to the website profootballfocus.com nobody on the line had more pressures, hits, or sacks than peppers.

Sacks

Julius Peppers 10 sacks 10 hits 33 pressures

Tyler Brayton 5 sacks 7 hits 24 pressures

Everette Brown 3 sacks 7 hits 13 pressures

Charles Johnson 4 sacks 2 hits 22 pressures

I'm sure they might have made some mistakes here or there but not by 5+.

Peppers has way more FF and INTs. Johnson and Brown have more batted passes.

They also rank each game. Green = good, white = mediocre, red = bad. At least I think lol.

Peppers leads the way with 8 green games, Johnson has 12 white games but he might have been injured during some of those, Brayton has 7 red games. Peppers only has 3 red games.

Peppers had the best game at 5.7 while he also had the worst game at a -5.9.

As far as their overall ratings of 4-3 DE's.

Peppers is 9th, Johnson 16th, Everette Brown 36th, Brayton 56th.

Peppers and Brayton took roughly double the snaps of Johnson and Brown. If you double Johson's and Brown's stats they are able to catch up a little. Johnson has more pressures and brown has more hits. Neither has more sacks.

Stats don't tell the whole side of the story, but there is a large enough difference that I think it shows that Peppers was generally making a significant impact, especially when compared to his fellow DE's.

There is a huge difference between lacking motivation and genuinely not performing. Peppers is at an ability level where he can lack motivation but still outperform a lot of other players in this league. It'd be nice if the players who worked the hardest also had the best natural ability but life isn't fair sometimes.

See your doing the same thing you hate. Your making mountains out of ant hills. Peppers was beat by his man more times then not last year. They didnt even cover him with a TE and a T some game.... Call it want you want but that road still ends at the same place. He was a avg DE most of the year and a few games he was a Super Star. Still 2 great games dose not make up for 14 games you were not a factor. We might not be better at Pass rush this year but I can tell you we want be worse. We have guys that want to play and will play hard every game. With a good coach that most of the time results in good things.

Again, Peppers playing average, occasionally being a superstar is better than playing average and never being a superstar.

The only superstar game I can think of from any of the other D-lineman is Johnson against Tampa.

Overall Peppers played better than our DE's. Maybe they couldn't produce as much because of lack of snaps. One reason they weren't getting snaps is because the coaches put in Peppers more often, most likely because they thought he was better.

[SorthNarolina]

and your so smart you hear things on a message board.

I hate to be a grammar hammer but if you're going to mock somebody for their diction try not to make any grammatical errors yourself. It's petty anyway, we all make mistakes.

[Ohio]

Peppers will be missed, but lets not forget, he had a year with 1.5 sacks, and last year when he looked pretty dumb the entire game against Dallas, looking like a chicken with his head cut off on the reverse and Jason Witten dominating him.

Hardy is showing promise, this dude can really play when healthy.

[SorthNarolina]

yeah i think johnson and brown should be able to replace him adequately. The only thing I'm worried about is how much respect teams will give the D-line without Peppers.

[Snake]

Maybe we have a different definition of "best". "Best" to me means the player who is making the most impact and producing the most. "Best" to you seems to mean who plays with the most effort. Effort is nice, but it needs to amount to something. You don't get All-pro and pro-bowl awards for effort, you need to have some ability too.

Acording to the website profootballfocus.com nobody on the line had more pressures, hits, or sacks than peppers.

Sacks

Julius Peppers 10 sacks 10 hits 33 pressures

Tyler Brayton 5 sacks 7 hits 24 pressures

Everette Brown 3 sacks 7 hits 13 pressures

Charles Johnson 4 sacks 2 hits 22 pressures

I'm sure they might have made some mistakes here or there but not by 5+.

Peppers has way more FF and INTs. Johnson and Brown have more batted passes.

They also rank each game. Green = good, white = mediocre, red = bad. At least I think lol.

Peppers leads the way with 8 green games, Johnson has 12 white games but he might have been injured during some of those, Brayton has 7 red games. Peppers only has 3 red games.

Peppers had the best game at 5.7 while he also had the worst game at a -5.9.

As far as their overall ratings of 4-3 DE's.

Peppers is 9th, Johnson 16th, Everette Brown 36th, Brayton 56th.

Peppers and Brayton took roughly double the snaps of Johnson and Brown. If you double Johson's and Brown's stats they are able to catch up a little. Johnson has more pressures and brown has more hits. Neither has more sacks.

Stats don't tell the whole side of the story, but there is a large enough difference that I think it shows that Peppers was generally making a significant impact, especially when compared to his fellow DE's.

There is a huge difference between lacking motivation and genuinely not performing. Peppers is at an ability level where he can lack motivation but still outperform a lot of other players in this league. It'd be nice if the players who worked the hardest also had the best natural ability but life isn't fair sometimes.

Again, Peppers playing average, occasionally being a superstar is better than playing average and never being a superstar.

The only superstar game I can think of from any of the other D-lineman is Johnson against Tampa.

Overall Peppers played better than our DE's. Maybe they couldn't produce as much because of lack of snaps. One reason they weren't getting snaps is because the coaches put in Peppers more often, most likely because they thought he was better.

Thats all nice and good but if you want to talk stats lets see where teams were running at last year. Since its a hell of a lot more obvious when its a players fault on a running play then a pass and of corse this should not be fair because Peppers is so talented. Football Outsiders has a lovely ranking on adjusted line yards in each direction. So we know where teams are running on us and who they like to pick on.

So CAR is ranked 27 and thats sad to say but true

Peppers is ranked 27 with a ALY of 4.99 and Brayton is ranked 17 with a 3.96. So what dose this tell us.... That most defenses chose to run right at Peppers and he also allowed them to get past him more times then Brayton.... So he was not the better player all the time. Really he was bad where you need him to be good. Thats stopping the run.... Now this might be skewed a bit because Johnson did take over LE for Brayton when in the dime but most runs dont come then anyway.

Also if you wanted to know more teams ran on Lewis ranked 31st then they did Thomas ranked 19th also.

[Snake]

I hate to be a grammar hammer but if you're going to mock somebody for their diction try not to make any grammatical errors yourself. It's petty anyway, we all make mistakes.

The fact is there was nothing wrong with his vocabulary only poorly choosing it.I mean maybe your right thought. Telling someone that "a dog walks upside down" dose not seems as bad as forgetting a comma in between "hammer and but".