Rivera Talks QBs

[Mr. Scot]

1. Being physically gifted not only matters, but is required for pro level play.

2. Show me a FRANCHISE quality QB... (not a just a poor performing starter, but a FRANCHISE quality pro-bowler) who had bad college stats.

You're pretty much full of crap with this statement so there's no point in replying to the rest of your post.

TRD responded, but I don't actually think that's as relevant to the point as what I said before.

I can show you plenty of gifted athletes who had fantastic college stats that got to the NFL and, frankly, sucked.

To quote the E-Trade folks, past performance is not a guarantee of future success.

[blackcatgrowl]

To quote the E-Trade folks, past performance is not a guarantee of future success.

And that's not my point. The point is PAST FAILURE is a guarantee of future failure.

Jay Cutler is not a franchise QB... otherwise he'd still be playing for Denver.

[DaCityKats]

cutler stats in college were not that bad. 8600 passing yards, 59 tds, 710 completions. got it wiki sorry cant link it @ work.

[Mr. Scot]

Looked up Matt Cassel's college stats recently?

[DaCityKats]

exception to every rule, has there been another Matt Cassel?

[Mr. Scot]

Tony Romo played Division I-AA and went undrafted. Look at him now.

Timmy Chang played for a major college program and lit up the statbook. These days the only signals he's calling might be "do you want fries with that" (ditto Tim Couch).

Look down the list of Heisman Winners, National Champions and stat leaders, then look down a list of NFL washouts. You'll find a load of names in common.

Regardless, the point isn't that bad college QBs succeed in the pros (no one ever suggested they did). The point is that a lot of good college QBs don't.

There is no formula that guarantees success. None.

[CRA]

Tony Romo played Division I-AA and went undrafted. Look at him now.

Timmy Chang played for a major college program and lit up the statbook. These days the only signals he's calling might be "do you want fries with that".

Look down the list of Heisman Winners, National Champions and stat leaders, then look down a list of NFL washouts. You'll find a load of names in common.

There is no formula that guarantees success. None.

yep....

will the last two overall #1's in Bradford and Stafford be able to combine resumes to compete with what Warner and Delhomme did in the league?

[DaCityKats]

i know.but thats a 2 way street. look at the succeccful qbs who came from big universities, smashed opposing teams with big stats, that were able to translate that on the next level.

theres no formula but you have to be in the right system that takes advantage of what you do best.

[Mr. Scot]

i know.but thats a 2 way street. look at the succeccful qbs who came from big universities, smashed opposing teams with big stats, that were able to translate that on the next level.

theres no formula but you have to be in the right system that takes advantage of what you do best.

The system can make the transition easier, but who had an easier transition last year than Clausen?

Skill set matters more than the other stuff, but even there it's no guarantee.

It's a different game.

[blackcatgrowl]

Looked up Matt Cassel's college stats recently?

Matt Cassel is not a "Franchise QB". He's a Free Agent that has played in KC with a level of inconsistency not all that dissimilar to Delhomme. He's 14-15 as a starter for KC.

Again, you're missing the point that failure in college translates to failure in the pros.

[Mr. Scot]

Matt Cassel is not a "Franchise QB". He's a Free Agent that has played in KC with a level of inconsistency not all that dissimilar to Delhomme. He's 14-15 as a starter for KC.

Again, you're missing the point that failure in college translates to failure in the pros.

And again, you're arguing against a point I was never trying to make :nonod:

What I've given you is a couple examples where guys that were less successful in college found greater success in the pros than counterparts who were considered better prospects.

What that shows is not that college failure can transition to college success (nobody ever suggested that). Rather, it shows that college success is not a guarantee of pro success. Never has been, and never will be.

Some of the most successful college quarterbacks ever were complete flops at the pro level. And whether you want to admit it or not, Cam Newton most definitely could wind up being part of that group (as could any of the other top prospects). Heck, even Andrew Luck could. Doesn't seem likely, but it's certainly possible.

There...are...no...guarantees. None.

[CRA]

Matt Cassel is not a "Franchise QB". He's a Free Agent that has played in KC with a level of inconsistency not all that dissimilar to Delhomme. He's 14-15 as a starter for KC.

Again, you're missing the point that failure in college translates to failure in the pros.

yeah, but no QB being discussed in any draft in the 1st or even 2nd round will have been a failure in college.

you would be hard to find any QBs who failed in college that are going to be drafted at this point.......no sure of your point.

[riddel]

2010 Sam Bradford QB Oklahoma St. Louis Rams 1 0

2009 Matthew Stafford QB Georgia Detroit Lions 2 0

2007 JaMarcus Russell QB LSU Oakland Raiders 3 0

2005 Alex Smith QB Utah San Francisco 49ers 6 0

2004 Eli Manning QB Mississippi San Diego Chargers 7 1

2003 Carson Palmer QB Southern Cal. Cincinnati Bengals 8 2

2002 David Carr QB Fresno State Houston Texans 9 0

2001 Michael Vick QB Virginia Tech Atlanta Falcons 8 3

1999 Tim Couch QB Kentucky Cleveland Browns 6 0

1998 Peyton Manning QB Tennessee Indianapolis Colts 13 11

1993 Drew Bledsoe QB Washington State New England Patriots 14 4

1990 Jeff George QB Illinois Indianapolis Colts 13 0

1989 *Troy Aikman QB UCLA Dallas Cowboys 12 6

1987 Vinny Testaverde QB Miami, (Fla.) Tampa Bay Buccaneers 21 2

1983 *John Elway QB Stanford Baltimore Colts 16 10

1975 Steve Bartkowski QB California Atlanta Falcons 12 2

1971 Jim Plunkett QB Stanford New England Patriots 15 0

1970 *Terry Bradshaw QB Louisiana Tech Pittsburgh Steelers 14 3

QBs go #1 more times than not. This list is pretty impressive, but there are also some dudes in there. Rather than reaching for QBs that were not the #1 pick over all, why don't you discuss the guys on this list and explain why Cam's name belongs on it.

[CRA]

2010 Sam Bradford QB Oklahoma St. Louis Rams 1 0

2009 Matthew Stafford QB Georgia Detroit Lions 2 0

2007 JaMarcus Russell QB LSU Oakland Raiders 3 0

2005 Alex Smith QB Utah San Francisco 49ers 6 0

2004 Eli Manning QB Mississippi San Diego Chargers 7 1

2003 Carson Palmer QB Southern Cal. Cincinnati Bengals 8 2

2002 David Carr QB Fresno State Houston Texans 9 0

2001 Michael Vick QB Virginia Tech Atlanta Falcons 8 3

1999 Tim Couch QB Kentucky Cleveland Browns 6 0

1998 Peyton Manning QB Tennessee Indianapolis Colts 13 11

1993 Drew Bledsoe QB Washington State New England Patriots 14 4

1990 Jeff George QB Illinois Indianapolis Colts 13 0

1989 *Troy Aikman QB UCLA Dallas Cowboys 12 6

1987 Vinny Testaverde QB Miami, (Fla.) Tampa Bay Buccaneers 21 2

1983 *John Elway QB Stanford Baltimore Colts 16 10

1975 Steve Bartkowski QB California Atlanta Falcons 12 2

1971 Jim Plunkett QB Stanford New England Patriots 15 0

1970 *Terry Bradshaw QB Louisiana Tech Pittsburgh Steelers 14 3

QBs go #1 more times than not. This list is pretty impressive, but there are also some dudes in there. Rather than reaching for QBs that were not the #1 pick over all, why don't you discuss the guys on this list and explain why Cam's name belongs on it.

Can't think of a reason why he doesn't belong.......not sure why an Andrew Luck would fit and a Cam wouldn't. Mixed bag of guys there.....variety of skills sets. All have winning in common heading into the league....