Jim Miller and Pat Kirwan on Cam

[panthers55]

FYI on Scott according to PFF

Week 1 - worst grade in pass blocking on team (-3.0)

Week 1 - worst overall graded O player (-5.7)

After the game Carolina (Kalil) pumped him up by giving out a coaches grade. It was a specific grade. Only how the coaches grades him in one aspect and on one side.

Maybe the coaches knew what his assignment was and PFF just looked at film without context. The common flaw about PFF is they have to infer what was supposed to happen when they saw the play whereas the coaches know what was supposed to happen.  If it was only to pump him up then why aren;t they doing the same thing with Bell??  Maybe the coaches know something PFF doesn't.....

[panthers55]

Eli has horrible mechanics often, horrible body language, questionable leadership....

He has wins....and plays well on final drives while his team is often in holes he helps create.

You mentioned mechanics as a big issue....simply pointing out that most QBs have issues. There are bigger issues in Carolina than Cam.....have been every season. Yes, he needs work....that isn't why we can't win though

So is this your assumptions or is it what everyone is saying about Eli.  Maybe it is me but I haven't heard all those complaints.

[CRA]

So we should look at 2 games and decide what kind of quarterback they are? How ridiculous.

Mechanically, Eli has shown poor mechanics for years, bad body language, questionable leadership. Most QBs have things they need to work on.

Those haven't kept NY from winning. Cam isnt keeping us from winning more. And no, that isn't a direct comparison of the two players but merely pointing out QB flaws aren't all it is about in terms of not being able to win

[panthers55]

Actually Russell Wilson was first and Vick was 2nd. Cam was 3rd nice try tho

So even if that were true and I don't know it was does that make it good then??  Still seems like a big problem to me when you o line is struggling.

[panthers55]

Mechanically, Eli has shown poor mechanics for years, bad body language, questionable leadership. Most QBs have things they need to work on.

Those haven't kept NY from winning. Cam isnt keeping us from winning more. And no, that isn't a direct comparison of the two players but merely pointing out QB flaws aren't all it is about in terms of not being able to win

Unless I missed it and you are a quarterback expert this is your opinion. Show me what the experts say then I might give it some credence.

[CRA]

So is this your assumptions or is it what everyone is saying about Eli. Maybe it is me but I haven't heard all those complaints.

Eli Manning displaying poor body language over his career is a fact not worth rguing over. Heck, almost every other 3 and out he looks like someone ran over his puppy. He does it on field all the time. Slumped over, pouting, and dejected.

Eli Manning being questioned as a leader over his career is also fact. Tiki Barner even came out when he retired and said they would laugh at him when he attempted to standup

Eli throws off his backfoot all the time.

Which one of these are you claiming is made up? Most QBs have parts of their game that need work. Cam isn't unique and that isn't why we can't win

[frash.exe]

So we should look at 2 games and decide what kind of quarterback they are? How ridiculous.

But that's exactly what you're doing

[AceBoogie]

So even if that were true and I don't know it was does that make it good then?? Still seems like a big problem to me when you o line is struggling.

You don't get it and I can't make you. What do those three have in common? They can scramble and extend plays. So a lot of times when you say Cam is holding the ball too long he is actually extending the play and making something out of what would be nothing by most qbs. Like the throw to Lafell when he was being sacked last week.

Also take in account the routes that are being run. If they're slow developing plays that's not Cam that's Shula.

[wine-o and cheese-doodle]

It's hard to know how much is Cam right now, considering Shula and others trying to force him to be more of a pocket passer with a shadytown OLine. But, I don't review film and what have you. I'm sure he still makes mistakes,

 

It's hard to know how much is Cam's fault and how much is the Oline, receivers or coaching. It's easy to be blinded by Cam's raw athletic ability. For instance, I see Cam throwing the ball too late in the receiver's route. This would apparently be holding the ball too long. Others would say the receivers ran a bad route, Who knows?

 

What I would dearly love to see is Cam and Anderson split game time against  the same team. If both have the same trouble with the Oline then I would know that was the trouble. If it was poor receivers for both then etc..etc. If one threw better than the other then the coaches would know where to start. Endless speculation on weather to blame the various components of the whole without comparison is senseless.

 

Look we are losing. It can't hurt to try and find out whats wrong. I'm not saying Anderson is going to kick ass but it sure would be nice to see a little comparison and yes real competition at QB. It might do Cam a world of good to look from the side lines for a half.

[CRA]

It's hard to know how much is Cam's fault and how much is the Oline, receivers or coaching. It's easy to be blinded by Cam's raw athletic ability. For instance, I see Cam throwing the ball too late in the receiver's route. This would apparently be holding the ball too long. Others would say the receivers ran a bad route, Who knows?

What I would dearly love to see is Cam and Anderson split game time against the same team. If both have the same trouble with the Oline then I would know that was the trouble. If it was poor receivers for both then etc..etc. If one threw better than the other then the coaches would know where to start. Endless speculation on weather to blame the various components of the whole without comparison is senseless.

Look we are losing. It can't hurt to try and find out whats wrong. I'm not saying Anderson is going to kick ass but it sure would be nice to see a little comparison and yes real competition at QB. It might do Cam a world of good to look from the side lines for a half.

You really feel the need to see Anderson taken off on a stretcher to confirm the right side of our OL is a nightmare?

[wine-o and cheese-doodle]

You really feel the need to see Anderson taken off on a stretcher to confirm the right side of our OL is a nightmare?

 

Yes or maybe he might be able to work fast enuff to avoid that.

 

if he gets warped It would surely expose what needs to be fixed LOUDLY. Maybe even the Gman would hear.

 

[AceBoogie]

Yes or maybe he might be able to work fast enuff to avoid that.

if he gets warped It would surely expose what needs to be fixed LOUDLY. Maybe even the Gman would hear.

Uh that's what practice is for

[CRA]

Yes or maybe he might be able to work fast enuff to avoid that.

if he gets warped It would surely expose what needs to be fixed LOUDLY. Maybe even the Gman would hear.

Gettlemen knows exactly how crappy our OL and secondary are.... he knew that going in.

[panthers55]

Eli Manning displaying poor body language over his career is a fact not worth rguing over. Heck, almost every other 3 and out he looks like someone ran over his puppy. He does it on field all the time. Slumped over, pouting, and dejected.

Eli Manning being questioned as a leader over his career is also fact. Tiki Barner even came out when he retired and said they would laugh at him when he attempted to standup

Eli throws off his backfoot all the time.

Which one of these are you claiming is made up? Most QBs have parts of their game that need work. Cam isn't unique and that isn't why we can't win

Links or it didn't happen......

 

Besides mechanics have to be taken in context. Arnold Palmer was supposed to have terrible mechanics but the bottom line is as long as the ball goes down the fairway 200 yards consistently it doesn't matter how it started. He compensated, hit big shots and won consistently. Likewise if Cam were throwing off his back foot but hitting receivers in stride consistently and not missing wide open guys would we be having this debate.  I say not.