Stingray3030

I am with you on with you on everything except that this is a very weak WR class - Johnston, Addison, Smith-Njigba, Flowers, Downs, Dell are all very good and should be gone by pick 50. If we get any of the first 5 I mentioned they are solid potential #1's.

The best QB mentor we can pick up IMO is Wentz....not because we want him on the field, like at all, but because he knows Reich's expectations and can be that 4th voice behind Reich, Brown, and McCown to physically show the new QB on the field during practice. And he is a decent enough backup in case of injury...and should be cheaper than most.

Richardson @ 9 I could live with although I believe it is a mistake.....trading all this for Richardson @ #1 is a ridiculous move. Even if he ends up being great you could have him well below there....it has nothing to do with his value and everything to do with his "perceived value". If they did this and take Richardson I have lost tremendous confidence in this staff.

very good option on the cheap

Adding more context - I watched his combine interview - you can tell ALOT from an interview that everyone seems to ignore. All the skill in the world is useless if their Leadership and Maturity are off. In his interview he said alot that I liked - best thing was when asked what he is working on he was very specific. He said he knew he needed to work on his lower half - not his running as much as footwork and mobility when passing. He said he was watching tape on Burrow and trying to emulate how he gets his lower half set so his upper half is consistent. Now I know that doesn't mean much by itself, but that is an outstanding answer. It shows a humble, self-aware guy working on the little things to focus on technique...not the "I know what I can do" or "just picking up the new system and learn everything I can" guys who just say stuff at interviews to get through. That is a Leader's answer....a mature answer. The best QB's are the ones who can tell you those details. Skill has to be there too....but for a combine answer that was fantastic

Elf & Shaq get released, DJ & Moton get restructured, we trade for Henry, sign Hardman & Okereke - all that looks pretty amazing combined with #1 overall....could get exciting soon

Agree here big time - everyone tends to focus on physical skills and college stats - but these guys have to now lead GROWN MEN in a business world. Leadership skills and decision making are every bit as important physical skills. Make a list of super talented guys who were bad QB's cause of their leadership and poor decisions.....very long list For a WR or RB this isn't nearly as critical....but QB is the Field General.....completely different animal

Understood, but it also depends on who you are moving up for....at some point it isn't worth what is being asked for. Moving up to 3rd given the first 2 might be QB limits the value also - and at some point the cost to go to #1 may be more reasonable. Honestly most are saying two additional 1st's and this year's 2nd gets you the #1 pick - I would probably just go that route if moving to 3 is this expensive

A 1st and 2nd to move up from 9 to 3 is way overpriced - in a reasonable world the value difference is 850, so two 2nd's will be worth around 1000 and should cover it....a 1st and a 2nd would be 1500 value which is nuts. They may want that but I don't think we have to go that far...or add anything more. It definitely isn't worth it then

Trading to 3 makes sense to me for the right price - by Draft Value we could get to #3 only giving up our 2nd RD pick this year and next (#39 pick only). We would still have the late 2nd this year and keep all our 1st in the future. If that lands us Stroud, Young, or Levis I think it is worth it. Plus if we did feel the need to jump to #1 it should really only take an additional 1st rounder next year to do it, which overall means we gave up one 1RD and two 2RD's to get to the first spot....that isn't horrible.

If you trust the Draft Value charts then #9, #39, and 2024 2RD should be enough to get to #3. As much as I hate losing the picks if we can get Stroud there I am all in. I just don't want us spending 3X 1RD picks+ for the top....such an overpayment when the expected value of Stroud vs Young is slim.

Trading up to 5 and landing Stroud I am 100% onboard - Not horribly expensive.....looked great in college, looked great at the combine - if he interviews well there really shouldn't be any red flags.

Hooker at 61 is a good value....that was my vote, but I am also on the fence about Levis @ 9...I just don't know enough about him to be sure either way. Young or CJ would be great but from 9 I agree not worth the cost....would rather BPA and find QB elsewhere like this or FA. I'm tired of bridge QB's too but ignoring the reality we sit with is a big mistake

If we stay at #9 and Stroud, Young, and Levis are gone I am 100% onboard for this list basically in the order you have them. I want a top WR or Mayer, but I would prefer we hit a stud pass rusher and maybe trade back into RD 1 late to grab that. I have a feeling that won't be too terribly expensive and a realistic possibility. Imagine If we hit Murphy, Mayer (trade up), Hooker, Sewell with our first 3 rounds....absolutely possible and would be ridiculous. The rest of the draft would be gravy!

Bridging until you get a franchise QB is a very common strategy - and yes it does work. There are tons of examples. It's not like most of the teams in the NFL just go from franchise QB to franchise QB without bridges - they all do it. Some teams like Chicago and the Jets drop way too much draft stock and trade up to failure, some get lucky with Mr. Irrelevant. But all of them sign bridge QB's while they try to find the next Franchise. If you want to ignore the reality of the team's current situation and trade picks for one of these QB's that is fine, but don't act like bridge QB's until you get a true franchise QB in the draft is wrong - it happens every year with extremely successful franchises.

Darnold, Trubisky are two examples - they went #3 and #2 in their drafts that teams gave up a ton thinking they were top tier franchise QB's.....yes it does happen. But your last point was exactly what I said - you win some you lose some....but only some teams trade tons of picks for the risk and they usually regret it.....like the Jets and Bears.....who still suck because of it.

You all are experts at missing the point....the point was trading up for the #2 ranked QB on the board which in 2021 was Wilson. The risk that he ends up the same as Wilson are higher than him ending up like Trevor is the point. Try and catch it. And don't you EVER use a meme from one of the most underrated movies of all time against me again...show respect to Face Off

My point wasn't their prospect rating - it was that the guy you trade up and draft could be either of those 2 possibilities while Carr is a known talent. had nothing to do with Trevor's potential - it is his reality

Wasn't talking to just you - but that is a useless comparison as I stated above. Trevor Lawrence has thrown more interceptions in the postseason than Baker too - equally as useless

All of yall comparing Carr to Baker are cherry picking your stats - you can't compare total INT's.....you compare INT %. Carr threw alot more than Baker. For their careers Carr had an INT % of 2.0 vs Baker at 2.8 - HUGE difference. 2.0 puts him around 13-15 in the league, 2.8 is one of the worst Carr's Passer rating is 91.8 vs Baker at 86....again huge difference. That would put him 16-17 in the league vs Baker at 25+ Carr also only won 6 games in 2022, but 4 games he led a 4th quarter comeback and 3 they won - you cannot understate how important that is when judging a QB. Baker has had 7 GWD's total in his career where Carr has had 33 - even half that is double Baker over the same time frame Keep in mind those first 2 stats include 2022 which was his worst in both categories - so either you believe we get the 3-time Pro Bowl, top 10 statistically QB and 2022 is an exception, or that 2022 is the future Carr. But at least the evaluation is reasonable stats. Carr is nowhere near as bad as Baker or Darnold - he has been a top 10 QB his whole career

Today's NFL more than ever is about passing QB's - I think mobile QB's like Rogers, Wilson, Murray, Mahomes, Trevor are taking over due to the defenses getting so much faster/better the last decade. Pocket passers still have significant success, but the running QB still hasn't been able to dominate consistently. If Hurts wins the SB he will be the first running QB in NFL history to do so....that might be the start of that style being consistent but it won't change the fact that it hasn't before. The irony is he won't be first because he ran better than the other - it will be because his arm was better - so it is still the QB arm that is most important. I'll take leadership and an accurate arm over a Wildcat QB all day long.

Lamar doesn't escape the definition - he is clearly a running QB. His career he averages 175 passing yd/gm and rushes 10-12 times. And he runs primarily an RPO and designed QB run scheme. His passing accuracy numbers are definitely better than previous running QB's, but his postseason performance shows the same problem - he can run successfully but is forced to use his arm to win and he can't....

Because of the reasons I stated - our current draft position, teams ahead of us who need a QB, the cost of moving up, not the strongest QB options in the draft, the guys available in FA, cap space.... You don't overpay for a drafted QB just because you need a QB....if you don't see them as a long term Top 10 QB you don't draft them 9th....period. Would you rather have 3 solid years of QB play and all our picks the next 2 years, or risk a QB bust giving up 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round picks to move up? For reference here are 2 scenarios that are very possible with our current situation: Option #1 - Carr, #1 WR in draft, #2 TE or #2 MLB Option #2 - Zach Wilson (but looks like CJ Stroud), same WR's and TE's we have now cause you traded our 2nd and 3rd round pick to move up Option #1 is all but guaranteed real if you can get Carr - the draft picks aren't guaranteed to be special but you have a very good shot. Option #2 you could get the next Zach Wilson or the next Trevor Lawrence....only about a 20-30% chance at best.....and you are guaranteed to lose 2 of the best prospects at their position to trade up for him. Opinions differ, but I believe the smarter play given the situation we are in is my original post. It isn't that I was bridge QB's - but I don't see the next Trevor, Burrow, Mahomes, Allen, Herbert, Hurts, or Jackson in this draft....certainly not enough to make me give up top picks to get Stroud over AR. If it was 2021 I would gladly give up those picks for Trevor....even before this past season.....but none of these guys look like that.

Mahomes is not a running QB - he is a mobile QB. That is a pass-first QB who runs at times when he scrambles and occasional designed runs. They have roll out plays as a standard of their game. Russell Wilson, younger Rogers, Mahomes, Trevor A running QB runs as a primary function of his game - RPO, designed runs. Cam Newton, Lamar, Vick, RGIII Hurts MAY have success long term as a running QB, but so far he has 2 seasons....longevity and consistency is always the issue. If he loses the SB he would be 2-2....don't crown him yet.

Running QB's don't win in the post season.....never have....doesn't look like they will any time soon. And AR doesn't look even close to ready. HARD PASS