McCoy vs Kelly

[CelticCat]

fug Kelly. I never ever wanted him, and I still believe that he is overrated. You guys lauding him, will you be lauding him this year after he gets his ass kicked? No you won't.

Sure it's a business, blah blah blah. Bottom line: three star players in their prime are no longer on the Eagles, in addition to quality role players. This is not a recipe for success in this league. Kelly and all his jock sniffers will find that out very soon.

 

He definitely has talent as an OC, I personally am not convinced that style of play can take you all the way in January. Its almost philosophically opposite to what Rivera and Shula want to do. It puts a lot of pressure on the D. Asking them to hang in for 35 minutes on average every game is asking a lot, especially late in the season when injuries start to accrue.

 

However, that offense is still built off the run and with Murray and Matthews added to Sproles and Polk they have replaced some of those good players in their primes with others, Kiko is pretty young too. He has sacrificed on talent at WR but the D has steadily improved. I do believe slowing the tempo would help them out more too.

 

Bradford is the X factor here, I'm just not convinced by that move at all. Some of his draft picks and past FA acquisitions leave a lot to be desired too.

[top dawg]

Kelly has been pushing the boundaries on what works in this league before he even was a coach in it. You have multiple And Super Bowl winning head coaches flying out to him to learn his stuff to implement it into the NFL. His uptempo which is what won the pats the Super Bowl against the Seahawks absolutely destroy the best defense in the league was from kelly. He isn't overrated. He's an amazing coach with a tremendous amount of football knowledge far exceeding anyone on this board.

Tell me all these things after Kelly wins a ring, because regardless of whether anyone likes it it not, championships do matter. Kelly's team crumbled when it came across teams that were superior defensively and just as prolific on the offensive side of the ball.

All pro coaches have football knowledge that exceeds probably most on this board (I say "probably" because I don't know everyone's knowledge of football on this board), so that's not really saying anything. As for how the Pats beat the Hawks, it was Belichick's ability to adapt his coaching style to his opposition. The short dink and dunk passing game which focused on routes underneath the strength of the Hawks' coverage, along with just enough running to keep the Seahawks honest, was the winning formula. It had literally nothing to do with Chip Kelly, or his flawed style of offense which tires out his defense, and is largely being successfully dissected by the better coaches of the league.

[CarolinaCoolin]

"Flawed style of offense" are you fuging kidding me?! Just taking a peek at sheer numbers from Oregon and philly says you are talking out of your ass right now

[CelticCat]

"Flawed style of offense" are you fuging kidding me?! Just taking a peek at sheer numbers from Oregon and philly says you are talking out of your ass right now

 

It's flawed in the sense that it puts a lot of stress on the D. It doesn't complement the D well. They can increase the talent on the D to compensate but all the talent in the world will get tired being on the field too long.

 

The layman loves watching an explosive offense, but is it better to be more balanced on both O and D (Patriots) rather than favoring one side so greatly like the Eagles do with a top O but bottom D.

[CarolinaCoolin]

It's flawed in the sense that it puts a lot of stress on the D. It doesn't complement the D well. They can increase the talent on the D to compensate but all the talent in the world will get tired being on the field too long.

The layman loves watching an explosive offense, but is it better to be more balanced on both O and D (Patriots) rather than favoring one side so greatly like the Eagles do with a top O but bottom D.

If it was flawed it would be losing more games then it would be winning but that isn't the case. Kelly is 20-12 in two seasons. Seems to be working pretty well right now

[Mol3m4n]

If it was flawed it would be losing more games then it would be winning but that isn't the case. Kelly is 20-12 in two seasons. Seems to be working pretty well right now

How many playoff wins did that dude get?

[CarolinaCoolin]

How many playoff wins did that dude get?

0-1 hardly enough of a sample size to make a definitive statement that his offense is flawed.

[top dawg]

0-1 hardly enough of a sample size to make a definitive statement that his offense is flawed.

Like I said, wait until he actually does something of note except produce an offense that largely feasts on suspect teams before you crown his ass. His teams have failed, sometimes miserably, when they come against teams with at least equal offensive firepower and a strong defense. You are not getting over the hump in the NFL if you fail to appreciate that you almost always have to have a top tier defense, and that it takes a certain amount of star power, not to mention continuity and chemistry, to win championships. After you see Kelly exit early from the playoffs a few more times, if he makes it at all, then maybe you will get the message.

Moreover, you can try and use your offense to tire out defenses all you like, but you're going to tire out your own as well, and that's where the trouble comes for his up tempo gimmick.

Teams are catching up to this, and superior teams will turn his system around in their favor by either outgunning him, or using the same old ball control offense that has been largely successful forever. And this doesn't even take into account the teams that have the team speed and smarts on defense to nullify what Kelly wants to do on offense.

[CarolinaCoolin]

Like I said, wait until he actually does something of note except produce an offense that largely feasts on suspect teams before you crown his ass. His teams have failed, sometimes miserably, when they come against teams with at least equal offensive firepower and a strong defense. You are not getting over the hump in the NFL if you fail to appreciate that you almost always have to have a top tier defense, and that it takes a certain amount of star power, not to mention continuity and chemistry, to win championships. After you see Kelly exit early from the playoffs a few more times, if he makes it at all, then maybe you will get the message.

Moreover, you can try and use your offense to tire out defenses all you like, but you're going to tire out your own as well, and that's where the trouble comes for his up tempo gimmick.

Teams are catching up to this, and superior teams will turn his system around in their favor by either outgunning him, or using the same old ball control offense that has been largely successful forever. And this doesn't even take into account the teams that have the team speed and smarts on defense to nullify what Kelly wants to do on offense.

He's only had two seasons and has accomplished more than what our strong defense has been able to in 4. Back to back winning seasons and we can't even get that.

Back to back top 5 offenses shows me teams aren't catching up.

[top dawg]

He's only had two seasons and has accomplished more than what our strong defense has been able to in 4. Back to back winning seasons and we can't even get that.

Back to back top 5 offenses shows me teams aren't catching up.

 

Alright. We'll see what he does this year with his new pieces in place. Kelly was feasting off LeSean McCoy also with those top five offenses, not to mention that he let two top 10 receivers get away from him. 

 

Our defense has been what has led us to back to back NFC south championships. Arguably it's the offense that has let us down for a number of reasons, the first probably being the need for another legitimate playmaker at the WR spot followed closely by play calling, among others.  That being said, I don't think that Gettleman is a dummie, and I believe he will finally do what we arguably haven't done in a decade, and that's to legitimately upgrade the level of talent of our top 3 wide receivers. If all the new toys don't produce under Shula's leadership, I think that he will get rid of Shula sooner rather than later.

 

I could be wrong, but I believe that Gettleman's more conservative, tried and true way is the more efficient way to a championship and sustained success than a glorified variation of the no-huddle offense.

 

We will see. 

[MV%doe]

If you think for a second that Cam could march into The Big Cat's office and demand a coaching change, you haven't been following the Panthers very long.

JR would tell him to close the door on his way out, and that would be the end of it. The NFL isn't the NBA, or for that matter the MLB. Very few players have the ability to even consider what you suggested.

Can't really compare basketball to football though. In the NBA, the star players absolutely run the league without question.

In the NFL, the star players get a lesson in revenue charts while their players' union gets its ass kicked by the owners.

Yea, you guys are right. I'm going full PU....... with cam going to jerry demanding a huge change. Jerry has changed tho, I didn't think he would fire his sons and the nfl is changing too. Its always easier to fire a coach than the whole team(plus stud QB >>> coach unless bill bilacheat) I do believe if kalil, TD, luke, cam, and olsen as a group asked for _________ it would happen. Group " we want a cherry icey machine " within 24 there's one in the locker room.

[CelticCat]

If it was flawed it would be losing more games then it would be winning but that isn't the case. Kelly is 20-12 in two seasons. Seems to be working pretty well right now

 

I didn't say he couldn't win games. I said there was a flaw. If you can't see how its affecting the amount of time the defense is on the field I don't know what else to say.

 

When the team with the #3 and #4 offense the past two years can't get past the wildcard round year 1 and fails to make the playoffs year 2 maybe something doesn't jive. I think it will be hard for them to win in January playing that style, I'm not saying Kelly can't win but Shula and his 18th and 19th ranked O went 1 step further to the SB playing a more conservative ball control style both years. And don't give me its all because of the D because they ranked 21st last year.

 

[CelticCat]

He's only had two seasons and has accomplished more than what our strong defense has been able to in 4. Back to back winning seasons and we can't even get that.

Back to back top 5 offenses shows me teams aren't catching up.

 

Our Defense has only ranked highly 1 year. 1.

 

You obviously also rank regular season wins more than how deep a team goes in the playoffs. The goal is to get to and win the SB, not go 10-6 and miss the playoffs.

 

Philly has been drafting before us the last two years for a reason.

 

[CarolinaCoolin]

I didn't say he couldn't win games. I said there was a flaw. If you can't see how its affecting the amount of time the defense is on the field I don't know what else to say.

When the team with the #3 and #4 offense the past two years can't get past the wildcard round year 1 and fails to make the playoffs year 2 maybe something doesn't jive. I think it will be hard for them to win in January playing that style, I'm not saying Kelly can't win but Shula and his 18th and 19th ranked O went 1 step further to the SB playing a more conservative ball control style both years. And don't give me its all because of the D because they ranked 21st last year.

This is the way the NFL is now. It's a passing offensive league. If you don't see these rule changes and see the trend towards more offensive high powered teams idk what to tell you.

Let's be honest. We didn't deserve to make it to the playoffs or win our playoff game. We got extremely lucky. Philly had a better record and beat us during the season but they didn't get to go to the playoffs. That's not a fault of their coach or their system it's a league fault.

We played a 3rd string qb. Their offense set a record for being the worst in playoff history and we still almost lost.