Prototype vs Team scheme fit vs actual Prospect??

[WOW!!]

The question here is what do you find important when looking at a prospect..

The league has a general blue chip type for each position... 

Example .. LT= 6'4 and Up 305 to 320lb and long arms.. 

QB = 6'3 and Up 220lb to 240lb pounds over 9.5 hand size .. Strong arm and live feet..

VS

Then each team has a specific scheme fit type of player..

Example

Seattle like long CB with adequate speed built more for tackling and Zone play. ..

Vikings Like More speedy CB no matter the size bulit more for Man coverage. 

VS

A guy who might not have protype size or speed just being a good player.. 

Example Smitty, Brent Grimes, and Derek Barnett..

What is more important and has a better chance of working out for a team..

Picking the league prototype..

Picking the scheme prototype .. You know what type player works in your system..

Or 

Just productive players no matter size speed and body type..

 

[Moo Daeng]

Fit and intelligence seem to work better towards the team goal. 

[LinvilleGorge]

6'4" is short for a LT.

[LinvilleGorge]

In terms of the Panthers, we definitely like prototypical builds in our linemen, both offensive and defensive. We really value speed/range in LBs. We really value cheapness in safeties. LOL!

[WOW!!]

5 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

6'4" is short for a LT.

6'5 I meant.. my bad..

[WOW!!]

6 minutes ago, Moo Daeng said:

Fit and intelligence seem to work better towards the team goal. 

Intelligence is good but let's be real.. J pep was considered the blue chip prototype for DE and he was dumb coming out of UNC.  Cam is the prototype (freak QB) and he isn't always showing his intelligence and most teams question it especially after the Gurden QB camp.. He still was a number 1 pick.. While Clausen ,Wenkie , Brees and Russell Wilson  who were consider a very smart QB'S who knew scheme like the back of their hands.. Weren't 1st round picks.  Moral of the story coaches rather have God giving abilities and feel like they can teach intelligence..

[WOW!!]

11 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

In terms of the Panthers, we definitely like prototypical builds in our linemen, both offensive and defensive. We really value speed/range in LBs. We really value cheapness in safeties. LOL!

What do you think is more important and is the more successful way when picking a prospect??

[Seoul_Panther]

13 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

In terms of the Panthers, we definitely like prototypical builds in our linemen, both offensive and defensive. We really value speed/range in LBs. We really value cheapness in safeties. LOL!

Yes we do. But has that really worked well for us? I think thats the question posed by OP. Oversized receivers and CBs haven't exactly been a raging success. When was the most recent home run draft pick? Luke? Cam? I remember watching a football life about Chris Doleman of the vikes. Sometimes the smaller dogs have more fight.

[LinvilleGorge]

2 minutes ago, Seoul_Panther said:

Yes we do. But has that really worked well for us? I think thats the question posed by OP. Oversized receivers and CBs haven't exactly been a raging success. When was the most recent home run draft pick? Luke? Cam? I remember watching a football life about Chris Doleman of the vikes. Sometimes the smaller dogs have more fight.

I'd call Short a homerun pick. Daryl Williams too.

[WOW!!]

4 minutes ago, Seoul_Panther said:

Yes we do. But has that really worked well for us? I think thats the question posed by OP. Oversized receivers and CBs haven't exactly been a raging success. When was the most recent home run draft pick? Luke? Cam? I remember watching a football life about Chris Doleman of the vikes. Sometimes the smaller dogs have more fight.

Yes my question is what do you guys feel is important or a more successful way when picking a prospect??

Blue chip size speed combination the league has determined is ideal for a position..

Or 

What you feel fit your team scheme better..

Or 

A prospect who might not have ideal size and speed but produced at a high rate in his career..

[LinvilleGorge]

3 minutes ago, WOW!! said:

What do you think is more important and is the more successful way when picking a prospect??

As a fan, I like treating every prospect as an individual. But I also understand that NFL GMs have to answer for their picks. That's why they love guys who have prototypical size and athleticism. If that guy busts they have an excuse for why they made the pick. 

But some guys break the mold. Smitty was way too small to be q great outside WR. It didn't matter. Brees is too short to be a franchise QB. Dwight Freeney wqs way too short to be an every down DE. Sam Mills was too small to play LB. Jerry Rice was too slow. 

[WOW!!]

12 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

As a fan, I like treating every prospect as an individual. But I also understand that NFL GMs have to answer for their picks. That's why they love guys who have prototypical size and athleticism. If that guy busts they have an excuse for why they made the pick. 

But some guys break the mold. Smitty was way too small to be q great outside WR. It didn't matter. Brees is too short to be a franchise QB. Dwight Freeney wqs way too short to be an every down DE. Sam Mills was too small to play LB. Jerry Rice was too slow. 

Good answer.. I agree you do get a buffer on mistakes when you pick the prototype instead of a gut feeling.. How do you feel with always drafting scheme fits??

I think it has its benefits as long as you plan on keeping that coach or GM a long time.. But it back fires when you change scheme but you're stuck with players you picked to fit that certain scheme.. I think Seattle and New England maybe going thru this real soon..

[Seoul_Panther]

31 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I'd call Short a homerun pick. Daryl Williams too.

Yes I thought about Short. Williams had a great year can't believe people flippantly talking about letting him go in FA. But hes only started one season. A bit early to call him a homerun IMO. 

  Point is how many guys have been selected as a result of prototypical traits? Has this been effective? How much weight do they give to tape, production, Character? Or is it lipservice? Can we say that the method has been successful in recent times and if it hasn't would that make any difference?

I mean last year, we were told that we were evolving. Addiņg more speed. Blah blah.So does the assessment criteria change massively year to year.

[Seoul_Panther]

I think if you asked any GM they would tell you that they check all the boxes and do a ton of background on each guy. But there are definite clear trends by team/head coach/GM.

 My personal preference is scheme and proven production. But clearly there is no proven method. I would like to think if successive draft strategies are unsuccessful that franchises would be willing to adapt their approach or change the scouting dept. But you know this game is run by guys with big egos.

 I do wonder if GMs are affected by the views of talking heads too much as the draft draws near.