A Solution to the QB Dilemma

[kungfoodude]

4 minutes ago, stbugs said:

And they barely made the playoffs at 9-7, largely due to Houston resting. We beat that same team. They may beat NE and NE is really showing their cracks but if you think that Tennessee team with Tannehill is now a perennial contender, you’re mistaken. They’ll be in the mediocre Mariota phase as soon as teams game plan for Tannehill.

I don’t want to be Tannehill or Dalton mediocre and make the playoffs because the Steelers are down their QB and Oakland isn’t really good enough yet. I want to be healthy Cam good or rookie Lawrence good with potential to go far in the playoffs.

I mean....he did go 7-3 as the starter and is one of the highest rated QB's over the past 10 games in the NFL. I don't think you can discount Tannehill. 

[45catfan]

1 minute ago, Panthercougar68 said:

I've come to terms that it might be a possibility.

People are dodging the question: A one win season occurring and wanting/wishing it to happen are two completely different things.  You are a horrible fan if the later is the case.  It's becoming obvious some people will actively be pulling against this team next year.  Some fans!

[Panthercougar68]

1 minute ago, 45catfan said:

People are dodging the question: A one win season occurring and wanting/wishing it to happen are two completely different things.  You are a horrible fan if the later is the case.  It's becoming obvious some people will actively be pulling against this team next year.  Some fans!

Do I want it? no. I'm sick of New Orleans and ATL embarrassing us every year. I just think that we are in year 2 of Teppers 5 year plan.

[45catfan]

Just now, Panthercougar68 said:

Do I want it? no. I'm sick of New Orleans and ATL embarrassing us every year. I just think that we are in year 2 of Teppers 5 year plan.

I'm getting the impression that some are all-in on the Lawrence sweepstakes and won't have the courage to say it (type it), but yeah, they are hoping the Panthers are the worst team in the League next year.

[kungfoodude]

2 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

I'm getting the impression that some are all-in on the Lawrence sweepstakes and won't have the courage to say it (type it), but yeah, they are hoping the Panthers are the worst team in the League next year.

I think quite a few of those are just Clemson homers. I'd be floored to get the kid, don't get me wrong, but I don't want to end up hanging another 1-15 season to do it. 

[kungfoodude]

3 minutes ago, stbugs said:

His 7 wins were Tampa, Chargers, KC (Henry and the D scored 3 TDS, he had 181 yards passing), Jax, Indy (in the middle of their 2-7 finish, we were 1 of the 2) and Houston who was resting their starters.

It looks like Allen’s 5-2 start and we beat Tannehill. Not taking anything from Tannehill, he played well and he was a former top 10 pick. That said he came into a team with a decent defense and a solid OL and a top rushing attack. He played smart, which is pretty much all Mariota had to do to make the playoffs a couple times.

That OL allowed the most sacks in the NFL and the highest adjusted sack rate. I do attribute some of that to scheme, however. 

The difference between Tannehill and Allen is pretty stark when you actually watch them play. I'd say that he may just end up being a guy that needed to get out of a dumpster fire situation in Miami. We will know next year. 

[MHS831]

I love the banter, speculation, and debate that coincides with this time of year.   Rarely is anyone proven to be right, for what its worth.

I think Tepper is very involved in this Cam situation.  We all saw Cam in 2015, etc. but Tepper has been owner for 2 seasons now.  What has Cam done in those 2 seasons?  Would you have a plan B if you were Tepper?  You damn right you would.

Secondly, the organization will have to make a decision about Cam before March's free agency period if we are being smart.  So why did Cam wait to have the surgery?  Is this a vegan, non-invasive medicine thing?  I dunno.  You don't either.

I could not help but notice the Panthers and Terry Bridgewater chatting during the game yesterday.  Were they recruiting him?  If so, it might suggest that the team suspects that Cam is leaving or will not regain his form. 

Yes, we are better in 2020 with a healthy Cam Newton, but everyone here tries to make things so right or wrong, black or white.  It is not that simple.   How much has he deteriorated or regressed?  Is he worth the big investment of 2021, when he will command top money in the best case scenario.  Remember, he was the QB in his prime in 2015 and we lost a Super Bowl that we were favored to win.  Who thinks we will get better than that?  Lotta things to consider. 

Here is the big one:  If we are going full rebuild mode, why would you have a $21m question mark on your books?   If the team will not be ready until 2021 and Cam will cost you $36m per year then, could that $36m bring you a better, younger fit?  Do you want to rebuild around a 32 year old, battered, oft-injured running QB?  It is not as simple as "if he is healthy..."  in the eyes of Tepper.  A wrong decision sets your program back yet another year.  How many seasons have been lost due to Cam's health?  2---if he costs the fans another season of losing, will the fans embrace the franchise?  If you realized that the upside is not as probable as the downside, do you start planning your future now instead of waiting to see if Cam has anything left in the tank?

The best franchises move on from players before they tank.  Is it time to move on from Cam?  What if he has another season or two in him?  Will he ever be as good as he was before or has the beating taken its toll?  Remove the bias, and the dilemma facing Tepper and a smart GM is sobering.  Sorry if that disappoints some of you, but that is the reality of the situation.  If keeping Cam hurts the franchise in the long run and produces no trophies or rings, what was the point?

[45catfan]

1 minute ago, stbugs said:

I’ve said it multiple times and I’ll say it again. I’d much rather be 1-15 and get Lawrence than go 5-11 again and miss out on what we desperately need, a franchise QB. No disrespect to Gerald McCoy, but he didn’t play with Cam the franchise QB. He played with Cam the QB who has only finished 1 of the past 4 years and appears to be getting less healthy.

So tank mode?  Got It.  At least you came out and said it.  Lawrence will end up being another Clemson by-product anyway.  Wait and see.

[MHS831]

4 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

So tank mode?  Got It.  At least you came out and said it.  Lawrence will end up being another Clemson by-product anyway.  Wait and see.

The Dolphins and the Panthers both went 5-11 this season after the Dolphins had a fire sale to assure the #1 pick.  Now THAT is embarrassing.

If you lose in order to have the chance of winning, that makes you a loser. 

[kungfoodude]

3 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

I love the banter, speculation, and debate that coincides with this time of year.   Rarely is anyone proven to be right, for what its worth.

I think Tepper is very involved in this Cam situation.  We all saw Cam in 2015, etc. but Tepper has been owner for 2 seasons now.  What has Cam done in those 2 seasons?  Would you have a plan B if you were Tepper?  You damn right you would.

Secondly, the organization will have to make a decision about Cam before March's free agency period if we are being smart.  So why did Cam wait to have the surgery?  Is this a vegan, non-invasive medicine thing?  I dunno.  You don't either.

I could not help but notice the Panthers and Terry Bridgewater chatting during the game yesterday.  Were they recruiting him?  If so, it might suggest that the team suspects that Cam is leaving or will not regain his form. 

Yes, we are better in 2020 with a healthy Cam Newton, but everyone here tries to make things so right or wrong, black or white.  It is not that simple.   How much has he deteriorated or regressed?  Is he worth the big investment of 2021, when he will command top money in the best case scenario.  Remember, he was the QB in his prime in 2015 and we lost a Super Bowl that we were favored to win.  Who thinks we will get better than that?  Lotta things to consider. 

Here is the big one:  If we are going full rebuild mode, why would you have a $21m question mark on your books?   If the team will not be ready until 2021 and Cam will cost you $36m per year then, could that $36m bring you a better, younger fit?  Do you want to rebuild around a 32 year old, battered, oft-injured running QB?  It is not as simple as "if he is healthy..."  in the eyes of Tepper.  A wrong decision sets your program back yet another year.  How many seasons have been lost due to Cam's health?  2---if he costs the fans another season of losing, will the fans embrace the franchise?  If you realized that the upside is not as probable as the downside, do you start planning your future now instead of waiting to see if Cam has anything left in the tank?

The best franchises move on from players before they tank.  Is it time to move on from Cam?  What if he has another season or two in him?  Will he ever be as good as he was before or has the beating taken its toll?  Remove the bias, and the dilemma facing Tepper and a smart GM is sobering.  Sorry if that disappoints some of you, but that is the reality of the situation.  If keeping Cam hurts the franchise in the long run and produces no trophies or rings, what was the point?

Great post. It is an extremely difficult position to be in because the majority of the possible outcomes are bad for the Panthers. This is also what happens when you draft a player like Cam Newton and never put forth a big enough effort to protect him. But the past is the past and I hope Tepper learns that with Cam moving forward or without, you don't neglect your franchise QB.

[kungfoodude]

6 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

So tank mode?  Got It.  At least you came out and said it.  Lawrence will end up being another Clemson by-product anyway.  Wait and see.

I mean Watson is one of the best young QB's in the NFL so I can't agree with you there.

[MHS831]

Just now, kungfoodude said:

Great post. It is an extremely difficult position to be in because the majority of the possible outcomes are bad for the Panthers. This is also what happens when you draft a player like Cam Newton and never put forth a big enough effort to protect him. But the past is the past and I hope Tepper learns that with Cam moving forward or without, you don't neglect your franchise QB.

Thanks-we all want a healthy Cam to play here for another 5-6 years and, like Elway, bring a couple rings home at the end of his career, but the timing and perspectives of this situation are unique and make it a difficult decision---gotta take your heart out of it----I would not want to make the decision--a career maker or career breaker.

[45catfan]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

I mean Watson is one of the best young QB's in the NFL so I can't agree with you there.

Good yes, elite, no.  He's good enough to get his team to the cusp or just in the playoffs.  The AFC South has been the joke of the NFL.  To win that division is nothing special.  Colts, Titans and Jags...

[TheRed]

MHS831 borderline hates Cam Newton and has for years. If you find yourself agreeing with him please speak to someone that can help you.