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The Roar Podcast with John Ellis is back

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MHS831 Grand Master

MHS831

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Jackie Lee said:

The issue is literally his size and strength, which he apparently can't improve upon first glimpses of him showing up to voluntary workouts. They can try to fix his footwork but as soon as there are 5 6'5" guys in his face that's gonna be out the window and he'll revert back to what got him to this level in the first place which worked in college but did not last year facing grown men

I see it too, don't get me wrong.  My thing is, "how can we fix it?"  Give him time, protection, and weapons.  If not, he is out.  If Morgan and the new coaches did not think they could develop him as is, they would not want to inherit Fitterer's mistakes.  The only thing that worries me--is Tepper involved in this?  Did he hire Canales on the condition that he could fix his mistake, which is why Canales was hired?  If not, I trust that Morgan and Canales have some ideas.

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MHS831 Grand Master

MHS831

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Just now, mrcompletely11 said:

I mean comparing him to brees will never get old..........

The comparison is to a player at the same position with the same criticism (QB, hopping).  It is how New Orleans built the program around a shorter QB.  Gold Jacket.

Cannot think of a more appropriate comparison.

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mrcompletely11 Grand Master

mrcompletely11

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2 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

I see it too, don't get me wrong.  My thing is, "how can we fix it?"  Give him time, protection, and weapons.  If not, he is out.  If Morgan and the new coaches did not think they could develop him as is, they would not want to inherit Fitterer's mistakes.  The only thing that worries me--is Tepper involved in this?  Did he hire Canales on the condition that he could fix his mistake, which is why Canales was hired?  If not, I trust that Morgan and Canales have some ideas.

Morgan was never getting hired if he went negative against bryce especially if he was on the young train pre draft.  Morgan did and said what he had to for the job.  Probably in his mind he has one re-do at qb if young isnt it.  Very few gms make it past 2 qbs

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frankw Grand Master

frankw

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Posted

Bryce Young is smaller than Johnny Football and people are still out here making comparisons to hall of famers.

How about we start small (no pun intended) and let this guy actually show any level of an NFL deep ball in his second season as a pro?

Sound good? Awesome.

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Jackie Lee Grand Master

Jackie Lee

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, MHS831 said:

The comparison is to a player at the same position with the same criticism (QB, hopping).  It is how New Orleans built the program around a shorter QB.  Gold Jacket.

Cannot think of a more appropriate comparison.

Doug Flutie if he has the determination lol. At least Doug had some fire to his game

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mrcompletely11 Grand Master

mrcompletely11

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, MHS831 said:

The comparison is to a player at the same position with the same criticism (QB, hopping).  It is how New Orleans built the program around a shorter QB.  Gold Jacket.

Cannot think of a more appropriate comparison.

If you say so, but A) brees is the most accurate qb in nfl history (so its wild to compare young to that) and B) it took Brees 4 years and then HOF level coach to really get going.

 

situations just arent the same

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mrcompletely11 Grand Master

mrcompletely11

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, frankw said:

Bryce Young is smaller than Johnny Football and people are still out here making comparisons to hall of famers.

How about we start small (no pun intended) and let this guy actually show any level of an NFL deep ball in his second season as a pro?

Sound good? Awesome.

The luke (welcome to the nfl) play on Johnny football will never get old

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MHS831 Grand Master

MHS831

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Jackie Lee said:

Ignore the hair look at the eye levelFngPzoUXEAEngqT.thumb.jpeg.a30949bf3ea00803681ccee26db26d3f.jpeg

Bryce is short.  I knew that going in.  Answer this question and I will let you all claim victory.  If you are so certain that Bryce is going to fail, why would a new coach and GM not cut him right away?  They have no ties to him.  Why would they simply not make Andy the starter?  Are they stupid?  If you can answer that question without creating some hyperbolic assumption presented as fact, you will convince me.  Yes, Bryce is short.  Got it.  What is the difference between two inches when it is six feet vs 6' 5" or 5'10" vs. 6' 5"?  I just refuse to throw players and coaches under the bus until they have had a chance to do what they say.  I also respect their expertise. However, if you knew in your heart that Young is not going to cut it, you cut him immediately.  Play Andy and draft Nix or even Rattler.  They could do that, but I doubt it.  So you are a new GM or a new coach and Bryce is your QB.  What do you do the minute you take over and why didn't Canales and Morgan?

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Jackie Lee Grand Master

Jackie Lee

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

If you say so, but A) brees is the most accurate qb in nfl history (so its wild to compare young to that) and B) it took Brees 4 years and then HOF level coach to really get going.

 

situations just arent the same

Yeah the Saints invested $10m in Brees as a gamble that paid off, if it didn't they could have easily moved on. We gambled a whole bunch more on a completely unproven smaller guy that was pretty good at one of the best schools in college. He couldn't even get his team to the playoffs last year, and before people blame his supporting cast, Cam won a natty at Auburn with nothing

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MHS831 Grand Master

MHS831

Posted
Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, frankw said:

Bryce Young is smaller than Johnny Football and people are still out here making comparisons to hall of famers.

How about we start small (no pun intended) and let this guy actually show any level of an NFL deep ball in his second season as a pro?

Sound good? Awesome.

That is intentionally misleading, but if it makes you feel right, ok.  The problem attributed to Young was a problem attributed to another short QB.  How did the team overcome that issue and get him to the hall of fame?  They paid guards.  Now, that is what Morgan did. 

That is the comparison.  It suggests that the GM and head Coach are going to do the same thing here.  That is what was stated.  Are you claiming to know more than the GM and Head Coach?   That is a yes or no question. 

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mrcompletely11 Grand Master

mrcompletely11

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Posted
1 minute ago, MHS831 said:

That is intentionally misleading, but if it makes you feel right, ok.  The problem attributed to Young was a problem attributed to another short QB.  How did the team overcome that issue and get him to the hall of fame?  They paid guards.  Now, that is what Morgan did. 

That is the comparison.  It suggests that the GM and head Coach are going to do the same thing here.  That is what was stated.  Are you claiming to know more than the GM and Head Coach?   That is a yes or no question. 

In regards to young or stroud.  Yes.  I absolutely know more then either if young is still their choice

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    • *FreeFua*
      Good film breakdown of Young. Good and bad. Film examples

      By *FreeFua* · Posted

      How did this “innovative” narrative start with Canales? Just because he’s young? He truly wants to run the ball and nothing Tampa did last year was all that creative. Mike Evans ability to win 1 on 1 does wonders for an offense as a whole 
    • *FreeFua*
      Does anyone actually think Bryce will actually be good?

      By *FreeFua* · Posted

      Sam Howell could’ve been had for free
    • MHS831
      Does anyone actually think Bryce will actually be good?

      By MHS831 · Posted

      Initially, I wanted Stroud but I thought the trade up meant that, whoever they chose, it was for a reason.  There was no pressure to do anything for the entire scouting team to do other than investigate every aspect of the top 3 candidates.  Stroud had his question marks, and I think it is possible that he falters this year.  Bryce had a much worse situation here in Carolina because we neglected the OL, traded our #1 WR, did not pick WRs well in the draft, traded our pro bowl RB, and seem to disregard the TE position altogether.  Bozeman was not a good fit and we relied on an improved OL in 2022 to suggest that we were set there when we were far from it.  Fitterer had no vision, no grasp of talent, and everyone in the front office and on the coaching staff were pretending to be gurus.  Our coaching staff was a group of men earning a lifetime achievement paycheck.  It all goes back to the years of neglect for the OL.  My theory?  If Stroud had come to Carolina, he would be as mocked and ridiculed as Bryce Young.   No, he does not have a cannon.  Chad Pennington was a weak-armed QB who had success and would have been even better if it were not for injuries.  Smarts is important at QB, and so are mechanics.  Before you can address Young's mechanics, he needs an OL, Running game, and weapons. We were not really able to run play action from under center for a few reasons--play action is not effective when you have to pass the ball--other than that, the QB must turn his back to the LOS for about 1.5 seconds.  When the QB has less than 2.5 seconds to pass the ball, that eliminates that part of the play book.  Heck, even the run option is minimized when there is immediate facial pressure.  SO those who want to talk about happy feet, bouncing, etc--they are symptoms of the problem, not the problem.  A weak arm?  Well, Young's arm is between Chad Pennington and Joe Montana--closer to Joe.  His are is not as weak as some think--but he has issues with the deep ball. When you are reacting to the defense and quickly have to pass, then that takes away the strength because you don't have the base to get power behind it.  I still wish we had taken Stroud, but we have Young and if you toss him out before giving him support, you are not wise, unsmart, not unfoolish, and rather elite in your failure to attain mediocrity.  Expect growth.  How much? Nobody knows.
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