John Fox

[Matt Foley]

Meat is a *****.

couldn't agree more.

Your butt must be sore, get off the floor.

[CatMan72]

You seriously think Head Coach John Fox had no idea about releasing these players?

Get real man.

He knows they are being released, but it's not his call. I think allot of these moves are coming straight from the top.

Look at our draft, it was the most anti-Fox draft I've ever seen. We're giving a HC in the last year of his contract two rookie QB's to backup his young QB... that's not a move made by a man who is trying to save his job.

[mmmbeans]

Your butt must be sore, get off the floor.

meh.

i'll give us a combined 6/10

[CatMan72]

Do you think Fox would stick around if he didn't have say in personnel moves? Especially with a team that hasn't renewed his contract?

I don't think he would. He'll have no problem finding work elsewhere.

I think he has a say in it, or they ask him for his opinion, but I also think he's been overruled quite a bit lately.

[panthers55]

I guess they wanted better cover guys with more speed and felt that harris was a stop gap but not a long term solution. The complaining just sealed the deal. Who else complained? Williams? Gross? Smith?

On another note maybe Fox plans to go to Chicago when they cut Lovie after this year and he is just assembling the talent there for when he arrives.

[Swarly]

No.

[CatMan72]

Honestly, I think Fox weighed his options this year but didn't see a job opening he was interested in so he decided to come back and the Panthers let him come back after he agreed to allow them to reshape his roster.

[Proudiddy]

Hadn't thought of it that way, but you may very well be right Meat. I think we have considerably more talent here this year than in 2001 though. We had f'ing Richard Huntley at RB, lol. The QB position had no talent behind Beurelein (sp?) despite going with a youth movement and the defense was horrible.

We may have gotten rid of several leaders, but it's bound to happen. Only thing I disagree with is that they purged them all in one offseason, rather than stagger it and phase them out over time, that way the younger guys had time to adjust to their roles. But, in this way, you either got it or you don't and whoever doesn't is gone.

Beason has already proven to be a leader, now we have to find other guys to step in those shoes with him - On defense? TD maybe? Offense - Gross, DWill? We still have guys to get other guys in check with immense talent and leadership qualities.

Plus, I don't think Fox/Hurney would be as giddy as they were about the Clausen pick had either of them suspected they have no chance of being here to see them develop, I think Fox knows any extension is going to be up to him after this season. Hurney already holds his own fate.

I just have questions both ways b/c from Smitty's interview on WFNZ yesterday, it sounded to me like he suspects Fox won't be back. Why hasn't Hurney signed an extension yet? This is why I think they won't be back... I think Fox will be welcomed back as long as we don't absolutely bomb this season, but I don't think he wants to be back (the rumor about him wanting to become the biggest coach on the market and get big money wherever).

So there are arguments to be made for both sides of it - whether they are staying or going...

I would completely believe that both of them are leaving after this season on their own accord, but why would they draft Clausen and Pike?

[Swarly]

[mj4life]

we have more talent than we had 01, you have to remember that seifert built alot of his teams on older FA's that didn't pan out and we had very little depth at those postions and we still had the after effect of the sean gilbert trade which cost us 2 first round picks

[House]

Here is a little test for all of you stupid people posting stupid poo about how the FO is trying to throw the season.

When you type down the name of the player who got cut/traded that was so VALUABLE to this franchise, type the name of his replacement next to it.

Something like this: Delhomme (Moore, Clausen, Pike), Kemo (Leonard, Tank, E. Johnson, Irvin), Diggs (Connor, Anderson, Ivy), Harris (Martin).

Hopefully it will make you realize that we are letting a bunch of older players that are on the downside of their carreers go and replacing them with young guys with TONS of upside. If it doesn't, oh well, you were an idiot before and you still are, no harm done.

[DaCityKats]

bert gay ass.lmao. this trade is not that bad, after i did some research.

[rico6]

Here is a little test for all of you stupid people posting stupid poo about how the FO is trying to throw the season.

When you type down the name of the player who got cut/traded that was so VALUABLE to this franchise, type the name of his replacement next to it.

Something like this: Delhomme (Moore, Clausen, Pike), Kemo (Leonard, Tank, E. Johnson, Irvin), Diggs (Connor, Anderson, Ivy), Harris (Martin).

Hopefully it will make you realize that we are letting a bunch of older players that are on the downside of their carreers go and replacing them with young guys with TONS of upside. If it doesn't, oh well, you were an idiot before and you still are, no harm done.

Talent =/= Solid Veteran Leadership

On paper that's a real pretty assessment though.

[Matt Foley]

The talent in 2001 was not that bad, folks. That team simply quit on Seifert. The Panthers lost several close games that year, and injuries decimated the team. Basically, it was the same team as the 7-9 2000 team, only with Weinke instead of Beuerlein, Smitty instead of Michael Bates, Jenkins instead of Chuck Smith, and Morgan instead of Dean (can't remember his last name).

Seifert, like Fox, never had a team finish anywhere near that bad before. And yet, the 2001 Panthers put four players in the Pro Bowl.