I do not see how many can claim Ryan to be an "elite" qb.

[Henne Given Sunday]

He was playing for the chance to be the Panthers starting qb for the '10 season. Everything was on the line for him, personally.

i guess.

He always had for himself and from the fans perspective the argument

"well lets see how he does as the starter all off season"

And obviously, it wasnt THAT GOOD of a job.......who did you guys draft with your 1st pick in the draft this year?

[lightsout]

i guess.

He always had for himself and from the fans perspective the argument

"well lets see how he does as the starter all off season"

And obviously, it wasnt THAT GOOD of a job.......who did you guys draft with your 1st pick in the draft this year?

Lets consider this. When Jake took over and did a hell of a job, we didn't get a QB for the FUTURE immediately. No contingency plan. What happened? We're stuck with unproven guys with question marks like Moore had when we got him. Thankfully, Moore looks like he will work out. Clausen is the ultimate back up plan/competition for Moore.

How many QBs have the Dolphins had in the past 4 seasons again? That's right, 17 different QBs have started games for Miami since 2001. You are one to talk good QBs alright.

[Pox 08]

When I see Matt Ryan play, I see an average qb. Nothing good, nothing great or elite, but nothing bad either. I know, he can change that down the road, but still.

I definitely do not see anything deserving of all the press he has gotten since his rookie year.

[Pox 08]

i guess.

He always had for himself and from the fans perspective the argument

"well lets see how he does as the starter all off season"

And obviously, it wasnt THAT GOOD of a job.......who did you guys draft with your 1st pick in the draft this year?

Would you have wanted to go into this season with Moore as the starter and only Hunter Cantwell behind him? We all can't have a Pennington behind our young qbs as a safety net. The only experienced ones that were available were downright horrible, so the FO got what they considered to be top 10 talent of the draft with the 48th pick. I don't blame them. If you have to go with an inexperienced guy, may as well be one you considered to be one of the best of the draft.

I'm not sure how this conversation turned to Matt Moore though. I rarely see anyone claiming Moore is elite or even good. They normally just say he has potential.

[dimbee]

Matt Ryan is a good QB. He has the ability and players around him to make him an elite QB. That could potentially happen this year... My thinking is you'll see it next year big time.

[Ohio]

those werent big games for the panthers......call me when moore plays well in games when carolinas season is hanging in the balance. That wasnt pressure, he had nothing to lose!

8 games is not enough to gauge whether or not he is all-pro material......

"buddy"

Let's look at your logic. You're saying there was NO pressure on a guy who went undrafted, who is on his 2nd team, and played his whole career as a backup, to come in, start and play well.

How many undrafted, career backup players have no pressure to perform well when their opportunity strikes? By your logic, this guy was guaranteed a spot on the team like he's Tom Brady.

Your exactly right, an undrafted career backup that could very well get cut during the year as well as playing against the #2 defense in the Minnesota Vikings, as exactly ZERO 0 pressure on him.

Your logic is great, buddy!

[dimbee]

Let's look at your logic. You're saying there was NO pressure on a guy who went undrafted, who is on his 2nd team, and played his whole career as a backup, to come in, start and play well.

How many undrafted, career backup players have no pressure to perform well when their opportunity strikes? By your logic, this guy was guaranteed a spot on the team like he's Tom Brady.

Your exactly right, an undrafted career backup that could very well get cut during the year as well as playing against the #2 defense in the Minnesota Vikings, as exactly ZERO 0 pressure on him.

Your logic is great, buddy!

The key is that you fail to mention the epic poo the bed that the starting QB he replaced managed to perform. THAT is what leads to the perceived lessened pressure.

I'm kind of torn. I can buy into some of the talk of him having a nothing to lose mentality, so go for it... but at the same time, this is his "big break," so he actually has everything to lose. Because, as you mentioned, he went undrafted (potentially for a reason?), is a backup and has played his whole career as a backup. That's got to lead to a whirlwind of emotions. I think Moore has a grasp of the situation and isn't going to take anything for granted. I think you'll see him manage the game to start the season and build on that. i.e. let the stud RB behind the QB do his thing and build from there.

[Henne Given Sunday]

Lets consider this. When Jake took over and did a hell of a job, we didn't get a QB for the FUTURE immediately. No contingency plan. What happened? We're stuck with unproven guys with question marks like Moore had when we got him. Thankfully, Moore looks like he will work out. Clausen is the ultimate back up plan/competition for Moore.

How many QBs have the Dolphins had in the past 4 seasons again? That's right, 17 different QBs have started games for Miami since 2001. You are one to talk good QBs alright.

what does my favorite teams bad qb decisions have to do with me? And in all honesty, i do have room to talk....i have seen the "next great flash in the pan" named fiedler, huard, culpepper, harrington, lemon, freortte, beck, henne, pennington....etc etc

its down right pitiful. but every single one of those guys was the guy that was gunna turn it around.

Dont use drafting clausen as being a backup plan. there are/were plenty of free agent vet QBs that would be a good safety net for an obviously rebuilding team. The fact you guys didnt have a 1st round pick, and used your 2nd rounder on a qb is not a good sign for matt moore, no matter how much you wanna sprinkle glitter on it. Why not draft someone in the 3rd or 4th? or trade for jason cambell, or mcnaab? or sign a vet?

Peter King said he asked moore his reaction when clausen was taken....he said "unexpected" after a long pause.

Yeah, sounds like its just a safety net/back up plan to me.................

[Henne Given Sunday]

and FTR i like matt moore, sorry for derailing this thread, matt ryan is NOT elite.

if i can go back a million times and pass on matt ryan for jake long like we did that draft id do it in a heart beat.

[lightsout]

You missed the point of what I was trying to say, Henne. The point being, if Moore doesn't work out, then we have somebody we can groom long term into Davidson's system. Clausen is the future. Whether that future is in 2 years or 5, Clausen will EVENTUALLY lead this team. I just see Moore having a couple successful years before he shows signs of Jake Delhomme-itis.

No harm, no foul. I believe there is just a bit of miscommunication and we are on the same page to some degree, neither of us are really doing a good job being clear.

[Henne Given Sunday]

You missed the point of what I was trying to say, Henne. The point being, if Moore doesn't work out, then we have somebody we can groom long term into Davidson's system. Clausen is the future. Whether that future is in 2 years or 5, Clausen will EVENTUALLY lead this team. I just see Moore having a couple successful years before he shows signs of Jake Delhomme-itis.

No harm, no foul. I believe there is just a bit of miscommunication and we are on the same page to some degree, neither of us are really doing a good job being clear.

agreed haha. Ill buy you a beer at one of the tailgates this year.....(whenever the phins/panthers dont have the same game start time)

[dixontosanders]

I think the last elite quarterbacks to come into the league was 2004.

ben roethlisberger and eli manning have got the job done that clutchness is very rare in quarterbacks... theres been 61 quarterbacks selected after the 2004 nfl draft. None have won rings as starters, so starting is very small percentage and the ring winning is even rarer.

I don't think any are going to be elite from the 2005-2010 drafts, the lone exception of aaron rodgers but he hasn't guided his team to a playoff win from behind yet.

[lightsout]

agreed haha. Ill buy you a beer at one of the tailgates this year.....(whenever the phins/panthers dont have the same game start time)

Sounds like a plan to me. :cheers2:

[KatsAzz]

This is scary. I feel like my ability to tell if a player is great or not is getting severely slack and my judgment to be lacking every time I see someone talk about how good Matt Ryan is and all I can do is scratch my head and say "Huh?"

I would not say that Matt Ryan is elite by any strech but i would say he was slighly above average.

I would play him some where between the 10th to 15th best NFL QB.